NFT: Who do you believe was the Greatest US President?

[files58]

What made Reagan in the eyes of some a great president?

[murderhill]

Ed, I agree this belongs on the back porch, I also agree with Jersey guy that we haven't seen a great president yet.  Some were close to greatness but had their imperfections.  Actually most presidents were great/good in some ways and awful in others.  The founding "fathers" left a lot to be desired in the constitution and so many presidents prior to Lincoln were elected to protect the slave based ecconomy of the south.  A bunch of corrupt cowardly southern puppets.  Some were progressive presidents meant that there was a perceived flaw in the Amerian culture (all sorts of rights that needed correction; ending slavery, voting, civil and equality. Correcting the inequalities of poverty including health, housing, minimum incomes, nutrition and education, public roads) and eventually correcting perceived flaws around the globe.  These presidents used government, laws, military force (and if necessary, funded by taxes) to make corrections.   Conservatives?  my caveat is always "what exactly is being conserved?".  Administrators. Populists and Idealists.  There's more, like forgetable, corporate whores or the worst president for example. I'll make a long story short.
My classifications:
Almost great:  FDR, Lincoln (because he hunted vampires when he was a young man), and Washington…………….mmmmmmmmmaybe Bill Clinton (he shut down large bureaucracy and helped generate a budget surplus)
Good:  Eisenhower, Truman
Progressive:  Lincoln, Teddy R., Taft, Wilson, FDR, Truman, LBJ, Nixon who mostly fulfilled LBJ's unfinished projects
Conservative:  Lincoln I know, weird. (Constitutional except for suspension of Habeas corpus), Washington (Constitutional), Coolidge, Cleveland and Regan (Pro busness/corporation, unregulated enterprize and small govt)  Eisenhower (status quo and pro business)
Worst:  GWB and Ronald Regan.  These two dudes have cost this country trilions of $$$$$  in unnecessary war, ecconomic deregulation and liberallizing the ecconomic climate so that corruption and lack of ethical business  and governmental practice was encouraged.  Reagan destroyed the basis for a fairly large (tax paying) middle class by attacking and destroying unions and cutting taxes for the wealthy

" Government is not the solution to our problem government IS the problem"

  That is true when someone as unqualified for the office as he was runs the government.

Biggest problems left to solve for upcoming presidents (baring an invasion from Canada or Mexico)
1.  The Dumbing Down of America
2.  Racism
3.  Greed as an acceptable value
4.  Stop fighting wars and reduce the size of the Military/Industrial/Congressional complex so we can drown it in a bathtub http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/g/grover_norquist.html
5.  Me winning the lottery (just kidding )

[babywhales]

What made Reagan in the eyes of some a great president?

When he died there were two very different approaches toward remembering his tenure in office.  He was the greatest and the he was just Ok.  Depends on your other believes and what you value.

[JimboWHO]

You guys realize that Lincoln was, for all intents and purposes, a tyrant. He saved the union and freed the slaves but he also stripped American citizens of their right to Habeus Corpus which allowed him to hold critics of his administration without due process. He also stripped some American citizens of their right to a jury trial and replaced it with military tribunals. Often those tribunals were so stacked in the governments favor that the defendant had no chance of being exonerated. Hundreds of citizens were sent to their deaths at the hands of those tribunals.

Lincoln was a complex man, both good and bad, but there is no way that a man who shredded the bill of rights and repudiated the ideas espoused in the Declaration of Independence should go down as our greatest President. I'd take Jefferson, Washington, Adams, Teddy Rex, Truman and Reagan before I'd even begin to consider where to place Lincoln.

The citizens' right to habeas corpus was protected but for the existence of a rebellion - the language in the Constitution was clear.  Lincoln relied upon that language and the fact that the fate of the U.S. hung in the balance.  The laws of war are different and the president-commander in chief must be allowed extraordinary latitude to interpret and use these laws as he sees fit.  This is how Lincoln, correctly it turns out, saw it.

We're talking about the bloodiest conflict this country ever fought, with outright rebellion in several key states.  Expecting some perfect human rights track record during what was likely the first incident of total war is naive.


JJM

[JimboWHO]

What made Reagan in the eyes of some a great president?

When he died there were two very different approaches toward remembering his tenure in office.  He was the greatest and the he was just Ok.  Depends on your other believes and what you value.

Indeed.  Americans who are independents or conservatives correctly labeled Reagan as great or "near great"

The Left was responsible for the "just OK" label.


JJM

[babywhales]

What made Reagan in the eyes of some a great president?

When he died there were two very different approaches toward remembering his tenure in office.  He was the greatest and the he was just Ok.  Depends on your other believes and what you value.

Indeed.  Americans who are independents or conservatives correctly labeled Reagan as great or "near great"

The Left was responsible for the "just OK" label.


JJM

I would leave out the statment suggesting the independents simply side with Reagan and leave out the judegment i.e. "correctly"  but agree with everything else.

Having participated in the Back Porch for too many threads to count over countless years, those little extras on the judgements are what starts everything off on the wrong foot.

[tomeee]

What's the over / under on post counts until this thread gets locked or disappears.

[murderhill]

What's the over / under on post counts until this thread gets locked or disappears.

This one

[vette]

What's the over / under on post counts until this thread gets locked or disappears.

This one

Nah, I'm leaving it up for a while and I just asked the guys not to delete any content within reason.

[babywhales]

What's the over / under on post counts until this thread gets locked or disappears.

This one

Nah, I'm leaving it up for a while and I just asked the guys not to delete any content within reason.

It is a bold move as religotics gets infused into everything in the US in 2012.  But I used to enjoy the backporch and look forward to seeing something being able to take hold. Best of Luck. 

[JimboWHO]

Ed, I agree this belongs on the back porch, I also agree with Jersey guy that we haven't seen a great president yet.  Some were close to greatness but had their imperfections.  Actually most presidents were great/good in some ways and awful in others.  The founding "fathers" left a lot to be desired in the constitution and so many presidents prior to Lincoln were elected to protect the slave based ecconomy of the south.  A bunch of corrupt cowardly southern puppets.  Some were progressive presidents meant that there was a perceived flaw in the Amerian culture (all sorts of rights that needed correction; ending slavery, voting, civil and equality. Correcting the inequalities of poverty including health, housing, minimum incomes, nutrition and education, public roads) and eventually correcting perceived flaws around the globe.  These presidents used government, laws, military force (and if necessary, funded by taxes) to make corrections.   Conservatives?  my caveat is always "what exactly is being conserved?".  Administrators. Populists and Idealists.  There's more, like forgetable, corporate whores or the worst president for example. I'll make a long story short.
My classifications:
Almost great:  FDR, Lincoln (because he hunted vampires when he was a young man), and Washington…………….mmmmmmmmmaybe Bill Clinton (he shut down large bureaucracy and helped generate a budget surplus)
Good:  Eisenhower, Truman
Progressive:  Lincoln, Teddy R., Taft, Wilson, FDR, Truman, LBJ, Nixon who mostly fulfilled LBJ's unfinished projects
Conservative:  Lincoln I know, weird. (Constitutional except for suspension of Habeas corpus), Washington (Constitutional), Coolidge, Cleveland and Regan (Pro busness/corporation, unregulated enterprize and small govt)  Eisenhower (status quo and pro business)
Worst:  GWB and Ronald Regan.  These two dudes have cost this country trilions of $$$$$  in unnecessary war, ecconomic deregulation and liberallizing the ecconomic climate so that corruption and lack of ethical business  and governmental practice was encouraged.  Reagan destroyed the basis for a fairly large (tax paying) middle class by attacking and destroying unions and cutting taxes for the wealthy

" Government is not the solution to our problem government IS the problem"

  That is true when someone as unqualified for the office as he was runs the government.

Biggest problems left to solve for upcoming presidents (baring an invasion from Canada or Mexico)
1.  The Dumbing Down of America
2.  Racism
3.  Greed as an acceptable value
4.  Stop fighting wars and reduce the size of the Military/Industrial/Congressional complex so we can drown it in a bathtub http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/g/grover_norquist.html
5.  Me winning the lottery (just kidding )

Rather than correct you on the many errors and conclusions you incorrectly (IMHO) come to I 'll ask you just this:

Assuming you voted for Obama (and If I'm wrong I'll stand corrected),  you state that Reagan, as a former successful two-term Governor of the largest state in the nation was "unqualified" to be president.

How can your community organizer who has never run anything, never met a payroll, never been responsible for the safety of others be more qualified to be president than Reagan?

Answer: He can't.  And you are seeing the results.


JJM

[bldevil]

1 vote for Thomas Jefferson, author of the Declaration of Independence.  The philosophical father our our country.

When Jerry Reese retires, maybe he can become President.  But I hope he just stays GM for a long time.

[BlueMoshik]

Best Hair: Andrew Jackson

Second best: JFK

Worst Dye Job: Ronald Reagan

Best jokes: Tie between Reagan and Gerald Ford.

Funniest pronunciation of the word "nuclear": Jimmy Carter

Second funniest: George Dubya Bush

Most soothing voice: FDR

Best at holding down his drink: Warren G. Harding

Best at working a hidden tape recorder: Richard M Nixon

[vette]

Best Hair: Andrew Jackson

Second best: JFK

Worst Dye Job: Ronald Reagan

Best jokes: Tie between Reagan and Gerald Ford.

Funniest pronunciation of the word "nuclear": Jimmy Carter

Second funniest: George Dubya Bush

Most soothing voice: FDR

Best at holding down his drink: Warren G. Harding

Best at working a hidden tape recorder: Richard M Nixon

  There you go! Have fun with it.

Maybe a question should have been who was the most under-rated President. I like the McKinley story.

[bamagiantfan]

What's the over / under on post counts until this thread gets locked or disappears.

This one

Nah, I'm leaving it up for a while and I just asked the guys not to delete any content within reason.

I guess mine wasn't reasonable then? Factually accurate, certainly, but apparrently unresaonable.