Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: Bob In PA on Today at 01:40:13 PMking: I never fail to read his posts and highly recommend them. They are IMO too few and far between. Bob

You are too kind. 

I invite you to look at the best receiver in the SEC over the last 10 years and look at his track to production and success in the NFL. It is pretty close to "can't miss." You may also notice something interesting if you look at the top 3 lines on each list.

Yards

Player    Yds    Year    School
1    Malik Nabers*1569    2023    Louisiana State
1    Jalin Hyatt*    1267    2022    Tennessee
1    Jameson Williams*    1572    2021    Alabama
1    DeVonta Smith*    1856    2020    Alabama
1    Ja'Marr Chase*    1780    2019    Louisiana State
1    A.J. Brown    1320    2018    Mississippi
1    A.J. Brown    1252    2017    Mississippi
1    Josh Reynolds*    1039    2016    Texas A&M
1    Laquon Treadwell*    1153    2015    Mississippi
1    Amari Cooper*    1727    2014    Alabama

Receptions
Rk    Player    Rec    Year    School
1    Malik Nabers*    89    2023    Louisiana State
1    Malik Nabers*    72    2022    Louisiana State
1    Makai Polk*    105    2021    Mississippi State (Wan'dale Robinson finished with 104)
1    DeVonta Smith*    117    2020    Alabama
1    Justin Jefferson*    111    2019    Louisiana State
1    Kalija Lipscomb*    87    2018    Vanderbilt
1    Ryan Davis*    84    2017    Auburn
1    Christian Kirk*    83    2016    Texas A&M
1    Calvin Ridley*    89    2015    Alabama
1    Amari Cooper*    124    2014    Alabama

Quote from: killarich on Today at 10:00:36 AMThink anyone would give a second rounder for Slayton ? lol

I like the dude but I want the team to get a beefy DT and Corner

With all the young WRs still available going into the second round that you could have on a rookie deal, uh.....no. Any trade of Slayton would be initiated by the Giants to free up CAP space and they would take whatever they could get. That said, I don't think he is on the trading block.

Stroud is a little high after one year and Love is a little low, but I won't argue. Nice list.

Quote from: GloryDays on Today at 12:17:41 PMTonight I would love it if we took TE Ben Sinnott in the second and OT Roger Rosengarten in the third.
Tomorrow with only 2 picks, if we can get RB Shipley in the 4th and S Kit. Oladapo in the 6th I would be thrilled.

Unless something has changed, the Giants have a 5th (Pick 166) also.

"The number one thing that drives me insane about Daniel Jones is his lack of vision in the pocket when things get messy."

I see it more of Jones not having time to see the play develop in a pocket that is always messy. I'll give Kafka some blame for that. Barkley wasn't great at blitz pickup but he was okay. Too often Barkley was in the pattern or wasn't on the field in a 4 wide set which, with the Giants offensive line woes, just begs the Defenses to bring extras. Kafka's personnel for protection schemes don't often match the playcalling. In simpler terms, if you count to two and the pocket is already collapsed, how is Jones supposed to get the ball out of his hand on a deeper route.

The play calling in 2022 was a natural reaction to the Offensive line injuries and issues and it worked. For some reason they abandoned that last year and started running routes further down field. It just didn't work, mostly because the problems on the line had not been fixed.

When Arizona went into a Prevent Defense we saw what the offense could look like. Unfortunately, the Giants were unable to handle the pass rush in normal situations and the O-line, QBs, and receivers all looked like they can't play.

Quote from: Jclayton92 on Today at 07:59:02 AMIn today's game you need a 4,000 yard 20td + qb to be relevant and we just don't have that currently.

Um, Lamar Jackson?

Quote from: kingm56 on Today at 08:12:49 AMI appreciate your perspective, bama!  However, I have to disagree with your statement regarding Mahomes having mediocre season.  I also believe his stats prove the opposite of the point you're trying to make.  In point of fact, Mahomes finished in the Top 10 of almost every major NFL passing category, without a top-tier WR.  By definition, a top 10 performance is anything other than mediocre.  This also wasn't his first year playing without WR talent; he also played without WR talent last year, when he put up all world numbers.  Indeed, he had an off year for Mahomes; however, it was hardly mediocre.  In short, QBs akin to Mahomes and Brady can still put up top 10 numbers without quality WRs.   

Yards    #6
Comp    #3
TDs    #8
PCT    #9
RTG    #12
QBR    #8

Great rubuttle.

You left out a few,

INTs   #4 Only three QBs threw more. I'll agree with you that 4th most interceptions is not mediocre. 
Y/A    #19 I don't consider that good or bad. If that is where  or when the ball needs to go because that is how Defenses are playing you, then that is where it needs to go, yet we kill Daniel Jones for similar numbers.

ATT #3 which of course drives all numbers, both good and bad.

Quote from: Jclayton92 on April 17, 2024, 09:01:39 PMThat was 12 years ago but if Jones was throwing for 300 yards and 2 tds a game we wouldn't be having this discussion.

I like Phil Simms' comment from years ago. In the NFL, statistics lie. If the team is playing well on both sides of the ball, the QBs shouldn't have big numbers at the end of the game. Its the teams that struggle to win (or not) that are throwing the ball for big numbers. Everyone is looking for the next Patrick Mahomes. Patrick Mahomes was a mediocre QB statistically in 2023 (yes, I said it) due in large part to a bunch of mediocre WR receivers. Compare his stats in 2023 to Jones in 2022. They are pretty similar, except Mahomes threw 150 more passes for about 10 more touchdowns and 10 more interceptions. Mahomes was able to grind out first downs with short passes and and his legs when he had to for wins. Kinda like Jones in 2022.

No, I'm not comparing the overall talent of Jones to Mahomes but there is a formula for winning that has won Superbowls and Jones has shown he is capable of making the plays that win games, which may not include big stats. It also included horrible offensive line play which was/is the one thing that has to be fixed for ANY QB to be successful in NY.

I think uconnjack got it right. THe pieces around him from the Offensive line to the recievers at all positions prohibit Jones from being successful without a great Defense.

With only 3 CBs and 1 DT drafted on Thursday night, it shapes up well for the Giants to start Day 2.

If the Giants DO actually want a Guard as an upgrade to what they have, all of them are still on the board, as are all the Safties. That was expected though. There isn't much separation between the top 3 guards, so one of them will probably be there at #47 if they want one.

With the money the Giants have tied up in edge rushers it might be difficult to sign Ojulari after this season. With five guys on the last year of their deal at LB they may go for some depth at Edge/OLB. CB has a similar problem.

For me, getting good CBs and DTs late in the draft rarely happens. McKinstry and DeJean could be the first two picks of Round 2. My preference would be CB Ennis Rakestraw Jr., Missouri or DT Braden Fiske, Florida State in the 2nd, and hope the Guards keep falling and you can pick op a quality one in the 3rd Round.

By position, the value going into Round 2 remains at WR followed by CB and DT.

I've always liked Slayton because he seems to outplay his ability every season. But the fact that the Giants have not been able to upgrade the position over the last 4 years has made him valuable to the Giants. He'll show up. He'll compete. He will stay healthy or play hurt. He'll be ready when his number is called. I wish we had more wide receivers like that. Maybe now we do. We'll see.

Let's have some fun with this. Assuming they do not trade out of #6, what would be your,

Perfect Pick -

Surprise pick you wouldn't mind -

Dear God, no! -

For me,

Perfect Pick - Odunze/Nabors/Harrison. i.e. - the best WR available

Surprise pick you wouldn't mind - Brock Bowers. A receiver that will make everyone forget about Darran Waller pretty quick.

Dear God. No! - J.J. McCarthy. It simply makes no sense and I'm just not ready for another reset.

I can't help but think of all the guys who never got much of a chance to show their stuff before the portal because they stayed at their school and "waited their turn" like a good soldier. They must be sitting at home thinking, "If only....". 

They have 39 players on a one-year deal or whose contracts end after this season, including 5 LBs and CBs and 4 DEs. The backfield is wide open and if Waller retires so is the TE position. Other than Offensive line where they have 8 guys signed through 2025, they need upgrades for 2024 and bodies for 2025 everywhere. I can't see them packaging picks to move up. To the contrary, I see them trading down and adding picks if they can find a trading partner, or at a minimum staying put and taking best player available over and over again every round. 

They are actually in a good spot. I don't believe they are desperate for anything and for the first time I think they are happy with what they have at O-Line and D-Line. They have starters and experienced backups at every spot in the trenches. They just need to upgrade where they can.

I have no expectations for this draft.

Quote from: Jclayton92 on April 23, 2024, 03:27:11 PMBut why? We have holes everywhere, if we've solved the line, let's solve another problem.

Because its the Giants. Recent history says 4 of these 5 guys will be hurt by October.