Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: AZGiantFan on April 18, 2024, 01:19:54 PMBut even if she makes it to the top of the WNBA, what's the most she can hope to make, half a million?  Which is twice what the top players make now?

But you're right that nothing changes until (unless) the league starts to make money.  But there is no sign that's going to happen.

I would have 1000% agreed with you on this until a few weeks ago when her games were some of the highest rated basketball games EVER - and not just for women.  I was watching....  Then they just had a WNBA draft that crushed all previous versions, ratings wise. 

I'm not saying the WNBA can parlay this into a huge payday...but it's a lot more possible than I would have thought even just a couple weeks ago.  If they keep their (mostly manufactured...like most sports) rivalries alive, who knows?

Another thing to remember amid all the outrage is a rookie contract is a rookie contract for a reason- she has, as yet, done nothing at the professional level to warrant an outsized contract compared to current vets.  Not saying she won't- just that she hasn't yet.  Like every other rookie contract in any pro sport.

This is the most reasonable mock I've seen to date.  Thanks for sharing. 

Yeah I'd have to see when he ranked them the years they were each drafted in order to give this any kind of attention. 

Yeah but those Cowboys 1st quarter TDs include all the ones against us, so it's skewed.   

Quote from: jgrangers2 on April 12, 2024, 12:45:34 PMThis is where I stand. If you think his upside is George Kittle, he's not worth it. If you think his upside is Travis Kelce then there's a convo to be had.

Agree.  And here is my disconnect- no sane person on the planet should ever mention a TE prospect as having a Travis Kelce (or Antonio Gates or Rob Gronkowsi) ceiling.  Kelce is the GOAT and the other 2, IMO, are 2 of the next best 3 tight ends of ALL TIME.  No one could or should project a prospect to be in the top 5 of their position of all time....regardless of position. 

Bowers might be good, he might be great, he also might be like every other TE drafted in the first round this century- nothing special.

I'll remember OJ through Norm McDonald, thank you very much:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2SSVIg4Noqc&t=314s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCSCJtuyfUY

Quote from: Jclayton92 on April 09, 2024, 03:25:30 PMWhy can't we ever have a full on rebuild.

My gut is because the nature of the NFL now is so short-term / GMs and coaches have to win quickly and patience is thinner than I can ever remember.  Because of this I feel like there is a huge disincentive to actually tearing things down to the studs and starting fresh.

I dunno this would make me a bit nervous...  I'm guessing Hoge gets more play now because of how well he called Manziel being a bust:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZXaEmS8zaQ .  He was also right on CJ Stroud last year:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLrHCw6RjcM . 

I'll also add- I'm not sure it does much good to bring guys like Kelce, Gates, or Gronk into this particular conversation.  In that one sentence you are listing 3 of the top 4 pass-catching TEs of ALL TIME (at least IMO- those 3 + Tony G).  I mean, of course it would be nice to get a HALL OF FAME tight end in rounds 2-3+. 

Here's the funny thing though- not a single TE drafted in the first round in the last 24 years has come even close to those players:  https://thefalconswire.usatoday.com/gallery/nfl-draft-falcons-tight-end-kyle-pitts-hayden-hurst-atlanta/ . 

So yeah, hard pass for me on any tight end at 6, in the top 15, or maybe even all the way through round 1. 

Quote from: PSUBeirut on April 07, 2024, 01:31:16 PMInteresting!  So are these the same thoughts you had about Saquon being selected #2 overall?  Or do you just feel differently about the TE position than you do RB?

For me personally, a TE at 6, no matter the prospect, is a waste.  At least until one of these uber athletic, generational TE prospects actually produces like that on the field. 

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on April 07, 2024, 02:23:12 PMActually yeah, I do feel differently about TE than I do RB. First, TE is a more expensive position than RB in terms of average salary. It is not as expensive as receiver, which I very clearly alluded to in my post, but it is pricier than RB. Secondly, the league is a passing league, so if you do happen to have a weapon like Gronk, Kelce, Gates etc it has a greater impact on an offense in today's NFL than having a Derrick Henry or Jonathan Taylor does.

I understand TE is not as valuable a position as receiver, QB, OT, and CB. I have also made it clear (twice now) that I am not advocating for taking Bowers. Nor do I think the Giants will. I was simply highlighting the low probability scenario where they have him graded as a much better prospect than the other options they're considering with that pick. My own personal opinion is that he is not a superior prospect to the big three receivers, but unlike some here who clearly believe they are better talent evaluators than NFL front offices, I am happy to defer to Schoen and his team on this matter.

Would I be happy with the pick if they took him? Since I am hoping we somehow get a QB the front office likes, and since I like all three of these receivers quite a bit as well as Joe Alt, probably not, but I'll make up my mind more firmly about that once I have watched him play for a year or two.

All good.  I respect that.  Just found it interesting that almost the exact same (opposite) verbiage was used by folks who were 100% against taking a RB that high - ie, our GM (and the vast majority of NFL folks, draftniks, etc.) considered Barkley to be the top or at least top 3 overall prospect in that draft, regardless of position.  So when you say "I would not want them to hold back and go with the inferior prospect in this case based purely on position." it piqued my interest- as many folks who didn't want Saquon at #2 used the opposite of this logic in their arguments- ie, that the GM SHOULD draft an inferior prospect on their board solely based on position. 

Me, personally- I don't think either a TE --OR-- a RB should ever be taken that high- And I actually feel more strongly on the TE piece than the RB- as long as the RB is a multi-dimensional threat....because they're gonna touch the ball a whole lot more than a TE ever would.

Quote from: Jolly Blue Giant on April 07, 2024, 07:31:12 PMIt's interesting that the only TE they've had in for a visit is Theo Johnson (that I've seen listed anyway). A big and fast traditional type TE who show exceptional athleticism at the combine

I believe Theo will be a better pro than he was a college player.  IMO he was misused in the offense last year and should have been a more-featured weapon.  I could see him being one of those mid-round gems for someone.  He's got a lot of great tools and good intangibles as well.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on April 07, 2024, 01:04:21 PMNone of the above examples mean Bowers will be a bad pick.

To be clear, I'm not advocating taking Bowers. Based on my own observations and sense of value, I would prefer any of the receivers over him. What I am not on board with is dismissing the idea of picking him completely out of hand, based purely on his being a TE and the others being receivers. If Schoen and his scouts rated Bowers as a distinctly better prospect than the WRs available when they pick, and they aren't going with a different position, then I would not want them to hold back and go with the inferior prospect in this case based purely on position. That is all.

Interesting!  So are these the same thoughts you had about Saquon being selected #2 overall?  Or do you just feel differently about the TE position than you do RB?

For me personally, a TE at 6, no matter the prospect, is a waste.  At least until one of these uber athletic, generational TE prospects actually produces like that on the field. 

Terrible.  Awful.  With the talent that is available at 6, guaranteed- that matches up with critical team needs - picking a TE would be ridiculous.   

What a cool story.  It would be amazing if things worked out for the young man.