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Topics - Vette

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Big Blue Huddle / Distraction Has No Place In This House
« on: May 27, 2017, 08:21:20 AM »
After a week of some controversy several NYG players came up big in interviews to take the legs out of any Drama and to have the back of their teammates.

Those that come to mind and I'm sure there were others are Brandon Marshall who could have responded in unkind to Richardson's douche bag parting shots. He didn't and he demonstrated the character and wisdom that experience brings.

Then there is Snacks Damon Harrison who had the back of Marshall and OBJ. He used lighthearted humor to make his point. He says he's not a leader but some lead in support and do little things behind the scenes.

For a young man in the spotlight, Sterling Shepard also came up big.

Add to that Ben McAdoo who kept his demeanor in the face of a barrage of questioning about OBJ and Vernon's absence.

There's a lot of ingredients that go into a Championship Team and it's a long road to get there. It starts with the proper foundation and that foundation is built on confidence, character, integrity and passion steered by wisdom.

This was the first test of many that they will face this season. Every year the chemistry of a team changes. Sometimes it's a big change and sometimes it's considerably less. Last year was a huge change in the Coaching Staff and the influx of many new players to the team. This their second year the players and the coaches know the huge opportunities that have before them and it's clear that the message is, "Distraction Has No Place In This House".

Big Blue Huddle / Top Position Battles to Watch by Dan Duggan
« on: May 24, 2017, 08:11:48 AM »
I'm liking Dan's articles and coverage. This is a great topic to be studying. There are also depth competitions that will very important and among those are the 4th CB, rotational DE, the backup RB, the pecking order at TE, who gets bumped at LB and who the cut is at QB because they are not going to carry 3 QB's...or will they?


The competition to man the middle of the Giants' defense is wide-open. Kelvin Sheppard wasn't re-signed after starting 11 games last season, which leaves B.J. Goodson and Keenan Robinson as the top two candidates to take his spot. Sliding Goodson into Sheppard's role would seem to make the most sense, but the 2016 fourth-round pick will need to prove he's ready to run the defense. Robinson played 71 percent of the defensive snaps last season, but he mostly played in sub packages, not the base 4-3 defense. Free agent Gerald Hodges, who reportedly visited the Giants on Tuesday, is a potential wild card.


There's a question in the middle of the third level of the Giants' defense as well. All-Pro Landon Collins is locked in at strong safety, but it's unclear who will man the free safety spot. Darian Thompson was in line to be the starter last season, but a foot injury limited the 2016 third-round pick to two games. Undrafted free agent Andrew Adams filled in admirably in Thompson's absence. Nat Berhe, who missed nine games with two concussions last season, is also back in the mix.
The first step for Thompson is proving that he's 100 percent healthy. If he's able to do that, there should be a competitive battle among a group of young players for the starting job.


The Giants have an opening in the middle (noticing a trend?) of their defensive line. Johnathan Hankins' free-agent departure opened up the starting job next to All-Pro defensive tackle Damon Harrison. Second-round pick Dalvin Tomlinson is the early favorite to win the job, but the rookie needs to earn it, while Jay Bromley and Robert Thomas will push for the starting job. The veterans will be in the defensive tackle rotation if Tomlinson emerges in the competition.


Bobby Hart took over as the starting right tackle when veteran Marshall Newhouse suffered a calf injury in Week 2 last season. Hart held the starting job until he was unseated by Newhouse in the regular season finale and playoffs. Newhouse signed with the Raiders this offseason, which opened the door for Hart to reclaim the starting job. But the Giants added competition with the acquisitions of free agent D.J. Fluker and sixth-round pick Adam Bisnowaty. Hart is the early favorite to win the right tackle job, but last season proved that starting spots aren't guaranteed.


John Jerry has started 40 games at right guard for the Giants in the past three seasons. The veteran signed a three-year, $10 million contract this offseason, so it appears that the team is expecting Jerry to retain his job. But the addition of Fluker provides competition. The former first-round pick can play either spot on the right side, but he is working at guard primarily in the early stages of the offseason. Odds are that Jerry and Hart will remain the starters on the right side, but Fluker will push both players.
Explain your choices for an eventual cut and the Lineup of your choice. For example will Flowers eventually succeed or fail? Will Pugh and or Richburg be re-signed? This is not specific to this year but let's say within the next 2 years.
Big Blue Huddle / Bobby Hart priority over Fluker and Jerry?
« on: May 22, 2017, 10:34:31 AM »
"The Giants did not allocate many resources to bolstering a middling offensive line, pointing to the incumbents being given another chance. Although the team added guard/tackle D.J. Fluker on a lower-level deal, Paul Schwartz of the New York Post believes Bobby Hart will still be given every chance to keep the right tackle job. This arrangement could potentially pit Fluker against recently re-signed right guard John Jerry, whom Pro Football Focus assessed as enjoying a bounce-back season in 2016. The 22-year-old Hart being a priority over putting Fluker and Jerry in the lineup together would be interesting given his history as a former seventh-round pick and a player whom PFF graded as the No. 67 full-time tackle last season."

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Big Blue Huddle / Justin Pugh discusses contract situation
« on: May 22, 2017, 10:29:12 AM »
"The whopping dollars allocated to UFA guards this offseason stands to impact teams’ negotiations with impending free agents at a position that’s seen its value rise. Justin Pugh is entering his contract year and looks ready to cash in after seeing players with similar profiles do so in March."


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This was a Fact or Fiction on for the Receiver Corp being the deepest. This always scares me because every time I think a position is deep it becomes decimated with injury. I would say WR is the deepest and Oline or LB is the Shallowest. What do you think?

Here is the link to the video:

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My good friend Gordon G. from the BBWC sent me an E-mail about the status of the WR/TE and O-line this season vs the Best in the Eli generation. It sparked some thought about how all these players can be utilized and it's been on my mind for some time now. Dennis mentioned it in his question to Patti Traina also.

I question whether McAdoo will become creative or not. I see this Lineup as a great opportunity to exploit mismatches in motion out of an 11 and 12 formation. They can have 2 inline TE's with one moving to the Slot or not. They can move Engram from the Right Slot to the Z with OBJ. They can move Marshall from the X to the Left Slot. They can move Ellison from the H-Back to inline. Here is Gordon's e-mail and my response to Gordon:

2011 vs 2017.  Interesting take by Schmeelk and Salomone.  Salomone identifies specific accomplishments in 2011 that we can compare at the end of the season.  Of course, the key variable is Eli.  The obvious question is: Will the 2017 Eli ibe as good as the 2011 Eli.  Eli had 3 seasons that his QB rating was 92-93.  2009, 2011, 2014 and 2015.   

His WR corp for each of those years were:

2009:   Domenik Hixon.  Mario Manningham.   Hakeem Nicks.  Steve Smith.

2011:  Cruz  Manningham  Nicks  Hixon (Cruz replaced Smith)

2014  Beckum  Randle  Donnell (Cruz played in only 6 games)

2015  Beckum  Randle  Harris  Donnell   Tye

I find the above fascinating in the sense that Eli was able to accomplish so much with significantly less talent in 2014 and 2015.  I consider the talent level in 2009 and 2011 equal.  It will be interesting to see what happens this season.   

Here is what Schmeelk and Salomone had to say.

JOHN SCHMEELK: Fact - The 2006 group of Plaxico Burress, Jeremy Shockey, Amani Toomer and Tiki Barber are in consideration here, but the team didn’t have a significant third wide receiver, so they lose out. The 2011 group is next but after Hakeem Nicks, Victor Cruz, Mario Manningham and Brandon Jacobs/Ahmad Bradshaw, the team didn’t have a good enough tight end. Manning has never had three wide receivers as good as Odell Beckham Jr., Brandon Marshall and Sterling Shepard. I think Paul Perkins has the ability to be just as good as any of Manning’s running backs not named Tiki Barber. Even though he is just a rookie, Evan Engram should be his best receiving weapon at tight end since Jeremy Shockey.

DAN SALOMONE: Fiction - In 2011, Eli Manning came 67 yards short of the hallowed 5,000-yard season. He still set the franchise’s single-season record that year with a pair of 1,000-yard receivers in Victor Cruz (set the franchise record with 1,536 receiving yards) and Hakeem Nicks. Cruz propelled them to the playoffs, and Nicks took over from there. Nicks’ 444 yards are the second-most in a single postseason in NFL history. And then who can forget Mario Manningham’s sideline grab late in Super Bowl XLVI? Or what about tight end Jake Ballard finishing third on the team with 604 receiving yards and four touchdowns, including one with 15 seconds remaining in Foxborough to end Tom Brady’s 31-game winning streak at home in the regular season. That group got it done, and that’s what matters the most.

Another key element to this discussion is the OL.  So, I went back and looked at the OL starters for 2009, 2011, 2014 and 2015. 

2009:  Diehl, Seubert, O'Hara, Snee and McKenzie

2011:  Beatty, Diehl, Bass, Snee and McKenzie

2014: Beatty, Richburg, Walton, Jerry and Pugh

2015: Flowers, Pugh, Richburg, Schwartz and Newhouse

My take on the offensive lines:  2009 and 2011 were clearly superior to 2014 and 2015.  What amazes me is that Eli did so well in 2015.. In fact, that was his highest QB rating of his career.  It is significant to me that in 2015  had only 14 interceptions while passing for 35 touchdowns.  I know, I know, the defense was the problem. 

For me, one of the key conclusions I come away from the above research is that Eli is as good as ever.  In fact he has had only one really bad season (2013) in the last 9 seasons.  A reasonable argument can be made that he made a huge jump after the 2007 regular season.  All of us remember the phenomenal playoff and SB he had after the 2007 regular season.  What I had totally forgotten is that during the regular season he had 20 interceptions and only 23 TDs.  i have to tell all of you.  I feel really good about the upcoming season.

I have a good feeling too. The Offensive Line needs to make a move up though. I'm not sold on it yet. The best Offensive Line since the Suburbanites was the Diehl, Seubert, Ohara, Snee, McKensie line. I think the WR group of Nicks, Cruz and Manningham was the best of all time that one season. This season, the group of OBJ, Marshall and Shepard has a lot of potential. That tall/physical receiver they had in Burress has been missing since Hixon. As for TE...well it's been neglected for many years and this could be the best group since the Boss/Ballard & Pascoe groups. Bear Pascoe was a very underrated blocking TE. For Eli, I think Shockey had the best all around talent and he never reached his potential to the team. This year's group has great potential with Ellison, Engram and Adams to be the best since Mowatt, Bavaro and Cross.

Paul Perkins really has to step up big time and I would like to see a FB on the Roster. The offensive question marks to me are the OT's, no FB and no veteran presence in the RB group. Could Perlins/Gallman then become the Jacobs/Bradshaw of 2017? That remains to be seen but hopefully they can pass protect some.

The key is going to be some creativity in the Offensive formations. How is Ellison going to be utilized as a TE/FB? How is a young Engram going to be used as a TE/ Slot and Wide out. Same with Marshall. Will there finally be a better mix of 01, 11, 21, 12 and 22 formations instead of the standard 11 formation. Kevin Gilbride/Coughlin would really take advantage of this lineup. McAdoo hasn't shown me much yet. The league figured him out last season and it hurt the Offense clearly. Eli completely ignored his other reads and many times Cruz was open. Shepard was not used as I thought he could have been. The best most productive Formation may be and 11 and 12 formation with the lack of a FB. I like motion of OBJ/Engram between Slot and Z, Engram between inline and Slot, Ellison between inline and Slot and Sheppard/Marshall between X and Slot. That would be:

 X                      Slot/TE in motion              OOOOO             Y/Slot/TE in motion            Z                     
Marshall           Shepard/Ellison                     Eli                         Engram                      OBJ
                                                           Perkins Offset R/L       

The lack of motion was conspicuously missing last season and this year if utilized it can produce some serious mismatches.
Big Blue Huddle / Top 100 Players picked by the Players
« on: May 08, 2017, 09:28:54 AM »
Everyone is pointing fingers to what happened to the Giants potent Offense from 2015 to 2016. It's everything from Flowers to the Oline to the running game to the Tight Ends to the dropsies to failure to get open to an aging Vic Cruz...

Here is one factor never discussed. How much influence did Coach Coughlin have in that Offense and the game plan so that his absence creates a huge void?

Before you write this off, consider details like a balanced attack, Offensive Blocking schemes and the failure to have a Full Back on the Team. Consider the depth of the routes and the utilization of the Receivers in their respective formations. Consider the routes run by the Tight Ends or the lack of up the seam. Consider the use of the RB in checkdowns or in the flat. Consider the use of screen passes behind the LOS in Zone Coverage.

Your thoughts?

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Big Blue Huddle / May Birthdays
« on: May 07, 2017, 04:49:05 PM »
nygsem- Steve- 10th
tomeee- Tom- 17th
Dennis- 31st

Have a Happy Birthday, Gentlemen!  <:-P <:-P <:-P
On this week's episode Bob, Brian, Rich and Ed discuss the 2017 NY Giants Draft Class and the Post Draft Free Agent signings.
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