Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on April 28, 2024, 12:05:56 PMI often think fans somewhat overrate the importance of coaching (relative to the importance of the actual talent level on the roster), but with O line in particular I think coaching matters quite a bit. I don't know exactly how good Carmen Bricillo is or will be, but I am extremely confident that he is at least somewhat of an upgrade over Woody Johnson, and I am cautiously optimistic that he may be a very large upgrade over Woody Johnson. I'm eager to see what impact he is able to have.

Neal was a total disaster for us at RT last year as well as in his rookie year. That was a major source of the trouble (albeit far from the only one). Elumenor played at a respectable level last year at RT for Vegas, for Bricilo. I don't know if they're planning on giving Neal another shot at RT and using Elumenor as a guard, but either way I think it's safe to say that we'll have much better RT play this year. Either Neal suddenly gets much better, or Elumenor takes over. Either way, that side of the line will be a lot better than the last couple of years, where we were counting on Neal and Glowinski whereas now we have Runyan and either a much improved Neal or Elumenor, who is solid.

That alone is big IMO. If Thomas can stay healthy, and JMS can improve from his rookie season (not a huge stretch), this line can be quite decent actually. Runyan is going to be fine, Thomas is an all pro caliber guy when healthy, Elumenor was a 70ish PFF caliber RT under this coach last year, and JMS is a talented player who had a rough rookie year but figures to hopefully improve in year two. Left guard is a bit of a question mark but we have multiple options there, so hopefully the best (or least bad) of all of those options is good enough to not mess up the whole line.

I actually think this will be a league-average line this year.

You make good optimistic points; however, as fans we are hopeful that the product is good and ready. Last year I had this attitude and felt betrayed. My frustration is that most other teams have the ability to turn around their weak O lines fairly quickly; but for the Giants it is a huge puzzle!!

Quote from: jgrangers2 on April 27, 2024, 06:28:33 PMOur starting OL in week 1 will likely be Thomas, Eleumanor, JMS, Runyan, Neal barring injury.

Do you notice right there why some of us are upset about not addressing the Oline weakness in this draft?
O line is like a chain.. one weak link and it breaks. Neal was a turnstile last year.. they messed up with that high pick... they knew it and still stuck their head in the Staten Island sand and depended on his off season training to have fixed him. We know what happened ( and I lost my $5000+ wager)
, so what about this year?
Who is the solid back up at OC behind Schmitz? Bredeson is not here any longer to come in when / if Schmitz goes down.
To me this is failing at your job.

Doesn't matter much who are the targets if the line can not protect the QB or open holes for the RB.
At best with Nabers, this is an average unit imo.

I voted 2. Didn't go with 1 to give them the benefit of the doubt.
Not addressing the lines was a mistake imo.
If the FA pick ups were good enough to fix the O line and also strengthen the defense against the run up the middle, then this could get a better grade. I don't see it though.
We'll see soon.

I don't know but they went totally opposite of building up the trenches... no Linemen, offense or defense!
Either they are onto something or they are really inept.
The only clear thing is, we should know by the end of this year if these guys are worthy of the job or not.

Quote from: brownelvis54 on April 27, 2024, 03:36:02 PMA crap pick. We should have taken Michael Pratt

I guess they wanted to fill the need for a kick returner 🙄

Wingo, Mahogany and Pratt all there but what do we get?

Mahogany was still there!!

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on April 27, 2024, 02:58:33 PMOf course not, but you can't just pull up one team from one year and look at their draft picks through four rounds and then say because we're not doing what they're doing we're ignoring the line. How many times have they drafted O linemen in the first four rounds over the last six years? How many have we? If we're going to do comparisons we should probably do more than just look at two days of roster management work.

The Giants have done a very poor job at improving their O line over the past decade. Nobody is denying that. I would suggest that the problems run deeper than just continuing to throw as many draft picks at the problem as possible. We have kind of already tried that. Scouting, player development, traiing/medical, and coaching matter too. Maybe we're not looking at the problem holistically enough. I can almost guarantee you the Steelers are much better than us at all those other things I listed.

Yes, the problem that they seem to have not addressed, except may be for the new O line coach, is their scouting and O line talent assessment.. by now it should have been clear to Schoen that they suck in that area.
We have what 13 linemen on the roster? No other team would want 10 of those!

It comes down to team building philosophy and the ability to assess O line talent.

May be ignoring the line is the wrong word; they certainly have devoted a lot of valuable assets to it, but so far the efforts have had dismal results. Last year they ignored that they made a mistake and Neal is no good.. they ROLLED THE DICE, and they got snake eyes. My question is, are they rolling the dice again?
I brought up Pittsburgh as an example. PFF ranked their O line as the # 12 in the league.
Here is their picks through 4 rounds:

Round 1: No. 20-Troy Fautanu, G, Washington
Round 2: No. 51- Zach Frazier, C, West Virginia
Round 3: No. 84-Roman Wilson, WR, Michigan
Round 3: No. 98 (Compensatory - from PHI)-Payton Wilson, LB, North Carolina State
Round 4: No. 119-Mason McCormick, G, South Dakota State

Are they stupid?!

I think this team just doesn't get it. The offense lives and dies through their line.
Just throwing bodies at it doesn't work. Other teams' leftovers is not the way to have a dominant O line.
Just look at the Steelers. Their O line was decent, check their draft!
Evan Neal is a bust, who is the RT we can rely on to stop the pressure on DJ from that edge? Are they really relying on Eluemunor or Cajuste?
Who is behind Schmitz? Even if he improves, who's backing him up, Morrissey?
This to me is weird.. I hope I am wrong, but I doubt it. They are ignoring to address the line effectively, like they did last year too.

Theo Is not Benn Sinnott, but he has the potential to put it together and become that blocking TE we need.

Damn.. Washington took Ben Sinnott!

Our pick took longer probably because of what had just transpired..
With the 47th pick NY Giants decide to take S Tyler Nubin!

Quote from: killarich on April 26, 2024, 07:58:51 PMNothing ... what is there to say ?

Nabers will never have lasted to the second and Mcconkley wasn't getting picked by anyone that early

It would just be a good pick by the Chargers

Why not? Professionals with vast resources, paid nicely, should know better... That is what I would say.