Big Blue Huddle

I don't think passing on McCarthy, Penix, or Nix will cost Schoen his job if they perform well in year 1. Of course, their careers are highly unlikely to be defined by their first season in the NFL (whether good or bad)--so firing a GM off such performance would seem equally misguided to me.

Wan'Dale and Hyatt are talented receivers. Slayton is a consummate professional and a good hand. That, in my mind, would have provided a rookie QB a decent enough foundation for their first year. This also ignores entirely the TE position and potential contributions from the new running backs.

Unless Jones plays well enough to prove he is the long-term solution at QB (which I don't even know is possible in light of his health concerns), I don't think it matters. A positive season from Jones would be just that and no more.

Quote from: TDToomer on Today at 09:31:16 AMRespectful Islanders chat for a change in this thread. I appreciate that. So I will be respectful when I ask the following honest question to you Rangers fans. Why is Rempe so overhyped? He has played 21 NHL games and has 3 points. When he is not scoring at a .14 PPG pace he is committing an ungodly amount of penalties and is on suspension watch by the league. But he is all over the ESPN like he is some prodigy Conner Bedard and their hosts and Rangers fans won't shut up about him.

What am I missing here? He seems like a one dimensional big guy who plays an outdated game when stars needed protection. Yes my team is guilty of having players like this. In fact he reminds me a bit of Matt Martin when he broke into the NHL at a similar age with similar stats. But no one overrated him and the Islanders were in a rebuild at the time with a young superstar John Tavares, not a playoff team trying to win the cup. Surely even great teams need roll players but they never get as much hype as he has gotten. The John Scott types only make sports center when they do something wrong. 

It's a combination of a couple of things but the gist of it is he's just fun.  He make his debut in the outdoor stadium game and fights a guy in 5 seconds.  Wins the fight.  And the fans go nuts.  Then he goes on a tear fighting everybody and winning just about every fight he's in to the point that they almost had to tell him to tone it down because you can't keep fighting every single day.

His actual play is not skillful by any means but he does set a tone.  I have to admit, for the last like 5 years or so I've agreed with you that a guy like him probably isn't necessary anymore and the team would be better off with another skill guy instead taking that roster spot.  But after watching the impact that Rempe has on the team with his energy and bone crushing hits and the way the fans get going every time he's on the ice...he does provide value to the team that another 4th liner with more skill like say a Goodrow wouldn't. 

Tom Wilson, noted jackass, has terrorized the Rangers in these playoffs games for years with all of his nonsense.  Picking on guys smaller than him regularly and just being a scumbag of the highest order.  But Wilson didn't do much of anything this series besides shove Adam Fox around after the Rangers scored a goal in Game 4. And I don't know that Rempe being around had anything to do with it or not, but I know I kept waiting for Wilson to do something dirty so Rempe could put his fist through his face and it just never happened. 

Quote from: T200 on Today at 09:48:00 AMSpeaking strictly about *our* conversations, I never said he was a bust but I also said that he has not shown any traces or tendencies of being a franchise QB. He's the very definition of an average QB who is not capable of putting his team on his back and dragging them to a victory. He can get 7-9 wins but doesn't offer anything to get 12-15. He is a step down from Ryan Tannehill but with legs.

I guess that is where we differ.  I see examples of DJs being capable of being franchise QB.  I think his performance against the Vikings and even his record-setting performance against the Cards last season showed that he can be that franchise QB.   Of course, showing flashes and doing it consistently are two separate things.  Everyone sees things a bit differently, and there is nothing wrong with that.

Quote from: MightyGiants on Today at 09:38:33 AMTim,

You know I choose my words carefully.  Do you think "a sense" is the same as knowing?  When I use the words "a sense," one is less than certain.   When one is less than certain, it should limit the strength of one's statements.   I have always held the position that we can't be certain about DJ being a bust and that there is still some potential (admittedly a bit of a long shot at this point) that he can even prove to be a franchise QB.   

Speaking strictly about *our* conversations, I never said he was a bust but I also said that he has not shown any traces or tendencies of being a franchise QB. He's the very definition of an average QB who is not capable of putting his team on his back and dragging them to a victory. He can get 7-9 wins but doesn't offer anything to get 12-15. He is a step down from Ryan Tannehill but with legs.

If Jones stinks as he is very likely to do, and JJ goes on to have a great season with Minnesota (as he is also likely to have with Jefferson over there) Schoen's seat gets a little hotter but I'm not sure they fire him.

What's interesting to me is it would almost be a more fireable offense if the Giants won 7-8 games next year than it would be if they won 3.  If they end up with one of the top 2 or 3 picks in the draft next season he can take his QB and the Giants are set for a while (presuming that QB doesn't also stink which if he does he's fired soon anyway) But if they win 7 games and pick around 9 or 10 in the draft and are no longer in a position to take a QB, when he was in prime position to take one this year, and then JJ looks good in Minnesota...that to me is worse. I could see Mara and Co. asking him what the hell are we supposed to do now? And in this scenario... there's not a really good answer to that question.

I feel like Bradshaw is the James Carville of football analysis. Bald ragin Cajun's who are past their expiration date on TV.

Quote from: T200 on Today at 09:34:42 AMAnd this is where we have and continue to disagree. No need to rehash it. Just thought it was curious that you said "I believe even with disparate support, we can get a sense of how good another QB is", which is exactly why I and others have been saying.

Tim,

You know I choose my words carefully.  Do you think "a sense" is the same as knowing?  When I use the words "a sense," one is less than certain.   When one is less than certain, it should limit the strength of one's statements.   I have always held the position that we can't be certain about DJ being a bust and that there is still some potential (admittedly a bit of a long shot at this point) that he can even prove to be a franchise QB.   

Quote from: MightyGiants on Today at 09:30:59 AMTim,

I think there is a nuance on this issue.  In a dysfunctional environment, every, or nearly every, QB will look bad.   In a poor environment, people should factor in the poor environment (many do not).

More importantly, the ability to properly evaluate a quarterback is really the purview of that quarterback's coaching staff.  As Daboll once said, people don't know the play calls.  An apparent open receiver may be meaningless because they ran the wrong route.   The fact of the matter is that we can get a sense of QB play by watching the games (or better yet, reviewing the all-22 with an informed eye), but no one outside the organization can evaluate with a strong degree of certainty (lacking the play calls and the QB's instructions).

And this is where we have and continue to disagree. No need to rehash it. Just thought it was curious that you said "I believe even with disparate support, we can get a sense of how good another QB is", which is exactly why I and others have been saying.

Respectful Islanders chat for a change in this thread. I appreciate that. So I will be respectful when I ask the following honest question to you Rangers fans. Why is Rempe so overhyped? He has played 21 NHL games and has 3 points. When he is not scoring at a .14 PPG pace he is committing an ungodly amount of penalties and is on suspension watch by the league. But he is all over the ESPN like he is some prodigy Conner Bedard and their hosts and Rangers fans won't shut up about him.

What am I missing here? He seems like a one dimensional big guy who plays an outdated game when stars needed protection. Yes my team is guilty of having players like this. In fact he reminds me a bit of Matt Martin when he broke into the NHL at a similar age with similar stats. But no one overrated him and the Islanders were in a rebuild at the time with a young superstar John Tavares, not a playoff team trying to win the cup. Surely even great teams need roll players but they never get as much hype as he has gotten. The John Scott types only make sports center when they do something wrong. 

Quote from: T200 on Today at 09:27:08 AMI have been saying this every single year Jones has been in the league: he can be evaluated despite what support he has or doesn't have around him. I got a lot of pushback from you and others saying that it was too difficult to evaluate him because of the lack of quality NFL support.

Seems to me the ability to evaluate a player is subjective.

I really had an awakening when I saw DeVito's pocket awareness vs Jones.