Big Blue Huddle

PFF had listed Phillips as the best 3rd round pick


ROUND 3
PICK 70. NEW YORK GIANTS: CB ANDRU PHILLIPS, KENTUCKY
The Giants drafted Deonte Banks in the first round of last year's draft and now add more youth to that group early in the third round this year. His career-best 23 defensive stops led all SEC cornerbacks in 2023, and his 72.9 PFF coverage grade was also the best mark of his career.

https://www.bigblueview.com/2024/5/8/24152074/pff-names-ny-giants-cornerback-dru-phillips-the-best-pick-of-the-third-round?utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=socialflow&utm_source=twitter&utm_content=bigblueview

Quote from: Uncle Mickey on Today at 12:53:48 PMThe Malik Nabers addition is going to make it difficult for defenses to shade coverage over the top of Jalin Hyatt like we saw at times in 2023.
Instead, we could be looking at a lot more rolled coverages toward Nabers & one-on-one opportunities for Hyatt to beat his man #Giants

Daboll when he came on board made a comment that we must be one of the slowest teams in the NFL. He emphasizes speed kind of like that Dolphins ball coach does.

THey have transformed team speed and Theo is pretty fast for a 6'6 255-260 pound TE too.

That is the impact a true number one WR has on an offense.  Not only does he make the QB's life easier, but his fellow WRs tend to benefit by having to face lesser defenses due to the focus on the number one guy.
 

Quote from: Uncle Mickey on Today at 12:50:43 PMMacAdoo was itching to get Geno playing over Eli so anything can happen when you are not the regime that drafted said QB.

Apart from that, I think DJ would beat out Lock if they are on level playing ground.

A lot of the outrage over the Giants breaking Eli's consecutive starting streak was due to the quarterback starting in Eli's place, Geno Smith.  I wonder if how Geno has played with the Seahawks the past two seasons might have some people reconsidering the outrage over starting Geno Smith.

Ben McAdoo has his shortcomings, but he seems to have a pretty good handle on QB assessments, or at least as well as anyone, since it's a bit of an inexact science.

Quote from: AZGiantFan on Today at 12:12:25 PMCreativity will be at a premium this year as ST coaches will have to figure out how to deal with the radical change in the kickoff rules.  A team that really nails how to deal with the new rules could reap a significant competitive advantage.  Let's hope that with a new ST coaching staff and influx of potential talent that team is the Giants.

I couldn't agree more.   This is the season, more than any other, where a team's fortunes could be greatly impacted by who they have as their special team's coordinator.

Quote from: Jolly Blue Giant on Today at 11:04:19 AMI hope Michael Ghobrial is successful, even with an unimpressive résumé. I see he spent two years at SUNY Cortland, a school where I spent a couple of years before transferring to Binghamton U., and is right in my backyard. They were D3 National Champions last season, which is neither here nor there (just putting in a plug for them) and they've been well known nationally for superior soccer, baseball, and lacrosse teams, winning a number of championships. It's the "jock school" of the SUNY system, and even though it is plugged as an "education and teachers' school", its real focus is on sports

I suspect, if Ghobrial is not pretty successful in a short time period, that he will be replaced. Schoen doesn't seem to have a lot of patience with coaches who don't make good things happen

I appreciate that resumes are only part of the story.  I have interviewed people with meh resumes who just hit it out of the park with their interviews.   I am assuming that was the case with Ghobrial.

Quote from: T200 on Today at 10:45:15 AMI understand your point, Rich.

My point is that despite his being 10th in separation yards, that statistic did not contribute to his issues. If he had held onto the majority of the passes thrown his way, 1) he'd probably still be a Giant, and 2) his separation yards would not be discussed.

I won't disagree that his untimely drops certainly were a major issue for him.

I will say that if I were the GM, I suspect I would grab a new quarterback if available (without having to pay a premium in a trade).  I think @AZGiantFan made a compelling point about the odds of success when drafting a QB.  That would give me pause.  Ultimately, it would come down to the injury issues (a healthy season doesn't erase all those concerns, and that cheaper contract.  Those are two very compelling reasons in my mind.

Quote from: H-Town G-Fan on Today at 10:37:33 AMYour conclusion about Engram may well-indeed be correct, but it's not supported by the 10-yard split metric and I think its pretty clear.

Since you put so much effort into trying to prove me wrong, I guess I should acknowledge your efforts.  Yes, it does take some digging to see how the 10-yard split indicates a lack of acceleration compared to his 40 times; you are correct. A look at the number with no other work being done wouldn't jump out at you in terms of there being a problem.   Congratulations
 

Quote from: T200 on Today at 10:33:27 AMI don't recall a single fan complaining about Engram's speed when he was here. It was his hands.

Tim,

When the Giants drafted Engram in round one, Reese talked about how he was going to be nearly impossible to cover with that 4.42 speed.  Yet, if you look at NFL's Next Gen stats, while Engram is the fastest (or top 3), his separation yardage puts him around 10th among NFL TEs. 

That was my issue. Engram was always undersized, and his hands were suspect, but we were sold on the idea that LBs and Safeties (who usually cover TEs) would never stand a chance against him (because of that 4.42 speed).

Here is a link to Next Gen Stats if you are interested.

https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/stats/receiving/2021/REG/all#average-separation

Quote from: H-Town G-Fan on Today at 10:25:09 AMYes, I guess it would place him 4th... by .01 seconds:

You are dealing with small numbers at 10 yards so even 0.1 is significant.  I hope you appreciate that while Egram's 10 yard split wasn't "bad" by RAS standards, what it is is slower than what one would expect from a 4.42 40 and shows Engram's acceleration wasn't that good, which is why he hasn't played like one would expect a TE with a 4.42 40 to play

No doubt the Giants added talent to their ST unit.  I have never been that impressed with Thomas McGaughey as a special teams coordinator.  I don't think he was bad, but he seemed to be unimpressive.  In terms of a replacement, I am not sure if the Giants ST Coordinator or the Assistant Coordinator has the better resume.




Michael Ghobrial, who spent the previous three seasons as an assistant on the Jets' staff, has been hired as the Giants' new coordinator.

Ghobrial, who will turn 36 on Feb. 9, was a special teams coordinator on the collegiate level for five seasons before joining the Jets. He replaces Thomas McGaughey, who was dismissed on Jan. 8 after six seasons as the Giants' coordinator.

With the Jets, Ghobrial coached under coordinator Brant Boyer and fellow assistant Leon Washington as the team fielded one of the NFL's best special teams units.

In 2023, the Jets' kickoff coverage led the league by allowing an average of just 15.3 yards a return. Their opponents' 40.4-yard net punting average ranked seventh in the NFL. Kicker Greg Zuerlein made 35 of 38 field goal attempts, including five-of-six from 50+ yards, a .921 percentage, and scored 120 pounds. Rookie Xavier Gipson was second in the league with a 23.2-yard kickoff return average and tied for 12th with a 9.7-yard punt return average, including a game-winning 65-yard touchdown in the season opener vs. Buffalo. Ashtyn Davis was among the league leaders with 12 special teams tackles (nine solo) and forced and recovered a fumble.

The previous season, special teams captain Justin Hardee was selected to his first Pro Bowl after posting a career-high 14 tackles. He became just the sixth Jets special teamer to be selected to the Pro Bowl since 1970 and the only core special teamer. Two of the six were chosen during Ghobrial's tenure. Zuerlein kicked three of the four longest field goals in franchise history and became one of four Jets to convert multiple field goals of 55+ yards as a Jet.

In 2021, the Jets were the only team in the league to finish in the top five in both kickoff and punt return average that season. Wide receiver/return specialist Braxton Berrios was selected as an All-Pro after he led the NFL in kickoff return average and finished second in punt return average.

Before joining the Jets, Ghobrial served as the special teams coordinator at Washington State (2020), Hawai'i (2018-19) and Tarleton State (2016-17). Following his first season at Tarleton State, he spent training camp with the Detroit Lions as part of the Bill Walsh Diversity Coaching Fellowship.

Ghobrial began his coaching career at his alma mater, UCLA, first as an undergrad assistant (2009-10), then as a quality control coach (2011), and finally as a graduate assistant (2012-13). Following his time with the Bruins, he coached at Syracuse (2014) and Colorado Mesa (2015), serving as the team's co-special teams coordinator in addition to coaching the defensive line and outside linebackers.

Ghobrial played defensive end for two seasons at UCLA, where he earned his bachelor's degree in history and a master's degree in social science and comparative education.


Cameron Achord

Personal information
Born:    February 4, 1987 (age 37)
Brookhaven, Mississippi, U.S.

Career information
High school:    Brookhaven Academy
College:    Belhaven
Position:    Special teams coordinator

Career history
As a coach:
Southern Miss (2010–2011)
Special teams graduate assistant
Southern Miss (2012)
Offensive graduate assistant
Southwest Mississippi CC (2013–2016)
Special teams coordinator, quarterbacks coach, running backs coach & tight ends coach
Southwest Mississippi CC (2017)
Offensive coordinator, special teams coordinator, quarterbacks coach, running backs coach & tight ends coach
New England Patriots (2018–2019)
Assistant special teams coach
New England Patriots (2020–2023)
Special teams coordinator

Career highlights and awards
Super Bowl champion (LIII)

Achord is a graduate of Brookhaven Academy. He graduated from Belhaven University with degrees in computer information science and sports administration in 2009. He received a master's degree in sports management from the University of Southern Mississippi in 2011.



Stephen Thomas, whose 16 years of coaching experience include five in the NFL, is in his first season as a Giants' assistant special teams coach.

Thomas spent the previous four seasons as the Detroit Lions' defensive quality control coach.

He joined the Lions in 2019 after spending six of the previous seven seasons (2012-14, 2016-18) at Princeton University, including the last two as the Tigers' special teams coordinator/inside linebackers coach.

In his final season at Princeton in 2018, Thomas coached a pair of first-team All-Ivy League linebackers (Mark Fossati and Tom Johnson). The Tigers' defense was fourth in the nation in points allowed and seventh in rushing defense. Thomas was Princeton's inside linebackers coach in 2016, when the Tigers led the league in scoring, total and rushing defense.

In-between his two stints at Princeton, Thomas was the Philadelphia Eagles' defensive quality control coach in 2015.

Prior to his initial tenure at Princeton, Thomas was a graduate assistant who worked with the offensive line at Southern Mississippi in 2011, and the linebackers (2010) and secondary (2009) at Delaware. He began his coaching career at Cortland State, where he mentored the cornerbacks in 2007 and the entire secondary the following season.

A native of Brooklyn, Thomas played defensive back and earned a degree in chemical and biological engineering at University at Buffalo. He also earned a master's degree in sport Mangement from Cortland.

Thomas and his wife, Erin, have a son, Justin, and a daughter, Olivia.

THOMAS AT A GLANCE

2007 Cortland State University cornerbacks

2008 Cortland State University defensive backs

2009 University of Delaware graduate assistant/secondary

2010 University of Delaware graduate assistant/linebackers

2011 University of Southern Mississippi graduate assistant/offensive line

2012-14 Princeton University inside linebackers

2015 Philadelphia Eagles defensive quality control

2016 Princeton University inside linebackers

2017-18 Princeton University special teams/inside linebackers

2019-22 Detroit Lions defensive quality control

2023 New York Giants assistant special teams

Quote from: Philosophers on Today at 10:11:25 AMGiven how bad they were, Giants need real production from say 4 draft picks for a) this draft to be considered very successful and b) to help get out of the sub 0.500 doldrums.

Nabers - easy pick
Nubin - likely pick
Phillips - hopeful pick
Johnson - dark horse pick
Tracy - should given poor RB pool on team

4 out of 6 would be an impressive batting average even for the best GMs

Quote from: H-Town G-Fan on Today at 10:02:35 AMEngram's 10-yard split was strong:


That 10-yard split is within tenths of a second of Odunze and Nabers. Engram's numbers (PFF and counting stats) have been much better since he transitioned to Jacksonville and had Trevor Lawrence throwing him the ball.

Have you considered that Engram's 4.42 40 time was a record at the time he ran it, yet his 1.56 split would put him 4th in just this year's combine with just a handful of TEs and none of them coming close to Engram's 4.42?
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-r-niHtaYTpDE3ydHJXyV4QfWQ2HZWnRXUVbaMTK3C0/edit#gid=1749729294

Quote from: Jclayton92 on Today at 09:37:37 AM@kingm56 just the other day posted multiple examples of Qbs playing at an elite level despite having one of the worst olines in the NFL

Quarterback support is a three-legged stool.  Those legs consist of coaching/scheme, pass protection, and receiving targets.   What exactly do we learn focusing exclusively on a single leg of the stool? 

I am going to add one thing.  I suspect we should also be looking at 10-yard splits as they will reflect a receiver's suddenness/acceleration, which is as important if not more important than their long speed. 

Take Evan Engram.  He had an impressive 40 time, but he wasn't that sudden and it took him time to reach top speed.  As a result, the defense didn't really struggle to cover him as much as his 40 times would suggest.