The Athletic did an exhaustive poll of Giants fans and this is the result:
(https://i.postimg.cc/13g3XVPD/Giants-fan-wants.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/hXBB3jXG)
WR wins by a landslide. Kind of taken aback that 10% would trade no.6 and next year's first for Maye :-??
That's interesting, although we don't know what the price to move up will actually be.
Which Giants fans did they poll because everywhere I go the vocal majority want a fresh start at Qb and it's not close. Most seem to fear that a wr would just end up like every other receiving option we've had the past half decade.
Also they gave way to many options, should have just been wr, qb, or other.
Quote from: Jclayton92 on April 19, 2024, 11:04:46 AMWhich Giants fans did they poll because everywhere I go the vocal majority want a fresh start at Qb and it's not close. Most seem to fear that a wr would just end up like every other receiving option we've had the past half decade.
Also they gave way to many options, should have just been wr, qb, or other.
Jess,
I can't speak for fans, but I will say in the Giants Twitterverse/Podcast world, there seems to be strong agreement that it's better to draft an elite WR than reach/trade for a QB. They seem down on the whole, QB or bust, fans.
Even on our forum, while there are a few QB or bust fans among us, there seems to be a substantial portion who seem to either favor a WR or think it would be the Giants' best option under the circumstances.
Most Giants fans (and fans in general) have such a fundamental lack of understanding of draft positioning and value I couldn't imagine why we would care what they think. Most fans seem to think the addition of a wide receiver is transformative, and it's typically not. The rest of the fans think Daniel Jones sucks, and he mostly does, but they're in such a rush to get his successor that they're not really concerned with who that is, or what the team might have to sacrifice to get there. Trade up for JJ McCarthy? It only takes one team, but I would imagine most draft boards have him nowhere near the top 10 in terms of value.
Quote from: MightyGiants on April 19, 2024, 11:11:00 AMJess,
I can't speak for fans, but I will say in the Giants Twitterverse/Podcast world, there seems to be strong agreement that it's better to draft an elite WR than reach/trade for a QB. They seem down on the whole, QB or bust, fans.
Even on our forum, while there are a few QB or bust fans among us, there seems to be a substantial portion who seem to either favor a WR or think it would be the Giants' best option under the circumstances.
The only reason I am looking at Qb is because it could be 5-6 years before we could get a class that rivals this one. There are no elite Qbs in the pipeline in college right now. I mean the best 2 guys right now for next year are Sanders and Dart, right now the top 4 this year are better than those guys.
Quote from: Jclayton92 on April 19, 2024, 11:04:46 AMWhich Giants fans did they poll because everywhere I go the vocal majority want a fresh start at Qb and it's not close. Most seem to fear that a wr would just end up like every other receiving option we've had the past half decade.
Also they gave way to many options, should have just been wr, qb, or other.
That's what extreme personal bias can do to you, Jess. Ever think of that?
Cheers!
Quote from: MightyGiants on April 19, 2024, 11:11:00 AMJess,
I can't speak for fans, but I will say in the Giants Twitterverse/Podcast world, there seems to be strong agreement that it's better to draft an elite WR than reach/trade for a QB. They seem down on the whole, QB or bust, fans.
Even on our forum, while there are a few QB or bust fans among us, there seems to be a substantial portion who seem to either favor a WR or think it would be the Giants' best option under the circumstances.
Mighty,
I couldn't agree with you more. There are so many fans just on this site alone that have advocated taking the best WR available at that spot, then being desperate and trading up or getting the 4th or 5th best QB.
I would say the pole is right on the money, thanks for sharing
Quote from: Jclayton92 on April 19, 2024, 11:20:43 AMThe only reason I am looking at Qb is because it could be 5-6 years before we could get a class that rivals this one. There are no elite Qbs in the pipeline in college right now. I mean the best 2 guys right now for next year are Sanders and Dart, right now the top 4 this year are better than those guys.
A team usually drafts one QB. So I think it's more a function of how many teams need QBs vs the supply (which I don't think is all that favorable this year).
Teams have found quality QBs in draft classes that were considered weak or average. Last year's QB class was average, at best, yet the Texans scored big by drafting CJ Stroud. The 2017 QB class led by Mitch Trybisky was considered weak, but the Chiefs drafted an air-raid QB, Mahomes, and the rest is history. The 2018 QB class was considered historically good yet only the Bills and Ravens came out winners in the draft a QB in round one sweepstakes. The Browns, Jets, and Cards all came out as losers.
The top 3 were exactly as I expected them to be and precisely in line with my view. I am surprised some are surprised.
Quote from: Painter on April 19, 2024, 11:49:59 AMThat's what extreme personal bias can do to you, Jess. Ever think of that?
Cheers!
Is it Bias if it's true?
Just because I said Daniel Jones was a bad quarterback before most realized it doesn't make it a bias, just means I was correct in what I thought.
Now that everyone has come to the realization that he is bad, so now it's considered Jones bashing or Jones hating to acknowledge how bad he has been.
Wanting to draft an actual Qb that throws the ball downfield is an extreme personal bias.
Then certainly you have none eh??
If we draft a Wr how is that wr going to transform our offense?
If Slayton and Hyatt got under utilized, why wouldn't this new Wr?
The weapons do not matter if you don't have someone to get them the ball. Whether that's Lock or Jones, any skill that comes in will be under served until the Qb changes.
Slayton caught 50 balls as a #1
Hyatt caught 23
Robinson caught 60
I just don't see any skill producing like people would want them to until someone is brought in to throw down the field.
Quote from: Jclayton92 on April 19, 2024, 02:14:04 PMIf we draft a Wr how is that wr going to transform our offense?
If Slayton and Hyatt got under utilized, why wouldn't this new Wr?
The weapons do not matter if you don't have someone to get them the ball. Whether that's Lock or Jones, any skill that comes in will be under served until the Qb changes.
Slayton caught 50 balls as a #1
Hyatt caught 23
Robinson caught 60
I just don't see any skill producing like people would want them to until someone is brought in to throw down the field.
Jess,
I suggest reading the thread on the 3 Ps of quarterback support. Right now, the only pillar we know the Giants' quarterback has is average to maybe above-average coaching. The O-line was historically bad last year, and among last year's pass catchers, there were none that were keeping DCs up at night.
In addition, when a team adds a true number one WR, they boost all three positions. Defenses will put their best CB on the new number one WR and may even roll coverage that way. That means guys like Hyatt and Robinson will be single-covered with less talented CBs. So, adding one elite WR boosts the entire receiving corps.
Quote from: Jclayton92 on April 19, 2024, 02:14:04 PMIf we draft a Wr how is that wr going to transform our offense?
If Slayton and Hyatt got under utilized, why wouldn't this new Wr?
The weapons do not matter if you don't have someone to get them the ball. Whether that's Lock or Jones, any skill that comes in will be under served until the Qb changes.
Slayton caught 50 balls as a #1
Hyatt caught 23
Robinson caught 60
I just don't see any skill producing like people would want them to until someone is brought in to throw down the field.
He won't significantly. You are right. Without a big play QB, the big play WR won't be much of a factor in 2024.
I don't think of it as what I want them to do, I think of it in terms of what I DON'T want them to do. There are two things I don't want them to do. I don't want them to trade up and I don't want them to spend a high draft pick on an offensive lineman. Anything else and my TV is safe.
Should we hope the GM draft what the Giant fans want? Or draft who he thinks will be best for the team in the future years?
I can sort of understand why this poll turned out the way it did.
If the Giants stay at 6, they are basically guaranteed of getting one of the big three receivers, all of whom look like future all pro caliber talents.
For the Giants to take a QB, they'll have to settle for the 4th QB off the board with either the 6th pick or potentially even trade up for the 4th QB off the board. I can understand how that's not palatable to a lot of fans.
What I will say though is that the outcome of this poll should not be confused with a claim that most Giants fans still think Jones is the guy. I don't believe that to be the case at all. Not wanting to reach for the 4th QB in the draft is not the same thing as believing Jones is the long term answer. I don't think many Giants fans think that anymore, and I also don't think the Giants themselves think that anymore. When John Mara publicly says he's supportive of drafting a QB in the first round, that's pretty telling. He has been Jones' biggest advocate in the organization since Gettleman left.
How exactly was that question presented and who did they poll? I don't know how you watch the same team we did last year and think WR is the most pressing need.
Can Nabers (or Odunze) also throw to himself? Or block for the quarterback before running his route? If so, then hell yeah I want that guy at #6. Otherwise, I'll pass.
Quote from: zephirus on April 19, 2024, 11:11:19 AMMost Giants fans (and fans in general) have such a fundamental lack of understanding of draft positioning and value I couldn't imagine why we would care what they think. Most fans seem to think the addition of a wide receiver is transformative, and it's typically not. The rest of the fans think Daniel Jones sucks, and he mostly does, but they're in such a rush to get his successor that they're not really concerned with who that is, or what the team might have to sacrifice to get there. Trade up for JJ McCarthy? It only takes one team, but I would imagine most draft boards have him nowhere near the top 10 in terms of value.
lee: I couldn't pass up a rare chance to slightly disagree with you. lol
In the case of the Giants, having a WR good enough to force the defense to put two men on him (A J Brown is an example from the recent past) can be transformative, by (1) giving the QB an outside "security blanket" and deep threat; and (2) by making it dangerious for defenses to blitz excessively and spy on running QBs.
Although I agree adding a WR generally won't change as much as fans might believe, adding a true elite NFL WR seriously boosts an offense's ability to produce points, especially when the chips are down.
Bob
Quote from: y_so_blu on April 20, 2024, 06:17:28 AMHow exactly was that question presented and who did they poll? I don't know how you watch the same team we did last year and think WR is the most pressing need.
Can Nabers (or Odunze) also throw to himself? Or block for the quarterback before running his route? If so, then hell yeah I want that guy at #6. Otherwise, I'll pass.
I suspect that fans who voted WR were talking into account the Giants' draft position and what would be available.
I want the best WR at 6 too. Every round get the BPA, worry about the QB next draft.