Big Blue Huddle

https://x.com/NYPost_Schwartz/status/1737474532737188217?s=20

Quote from: zephirus on December 20, 2023, 09:51:10 AMThere's a report on Twitter from Wesley Steinberg that Tommy Devito recently told the teams social media manager to "quit it with all the Italian s***, I just wanna play football".

If true, it sounds like he understands what's up.  Hopefully he ditches his agent and gets back to work.

Lee,

Wesley Steinberg is a parody account, not a real reporter

Quote from: T200 on December 20, 2023, 08:49:08 AMDefinitely tough to hear. I wonder if he has CTE?

It's always hard to tell.  I am mindful that most of these athletes were given extra care, protection, and guidance from an early age.  They only end up truly on their own until after they retire or leave the NFL.   Those extras they get can offset quite a few flaws.   

I think Tommy would be smart to drop his current agent.   That agent seems more intent on promoting himself than his client.

Quote from: T200 on December 20, 2023, 08:47:05 AMAre you suggesting that if Jones and Lawrence were swapped, both teams would be the same as they are now?

From all the objective measures, the answer appears to be yes.  However, the reality is that we really can't say because such a move involves many different measures and factors. 

I think the point is that my objective measures the men's performances appear to be pretty much the same.  However, because one came into the league with much fanfare and support while Jones' drafting was met with derision and scorn, the perception of their performances have varied far more than the objective measures could justify.

Quote from: T200 on December 19, 2023, 02:12:15 PMFirst thing I noticed is that they lumped the passing and rushing yards together.

Second, I'd be curious in a poll of Jags and Giants fans. How many would want the other's QB?

It sort of shows perception doesn't always match reality (as Larry @Painter alluded to)

I tried to find out what Ward was doing after football.  I saw in 2018 Ward had issues with his wife, where she alleged he put his hands around her neck and threatened to kill her.   According to his wife, he would have monthly fits of temper.

The only other mention I could find is he called into a radio show during the Brian Flores lawsuit, alleging Bill Belichick still wielded a lot of power in the Giants organization.

That's pretty much all I could find.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on December 19, 2023, 03:45:09 PMFair point. I agree that makes it harder to be missed.

Terry McLaurin is a good example of a receiver who played for a school that is just as heavily scouted as any SEC school (OSU) and ended up going in the third round. The scouts had it wrong. They thought that out of the two big OSU receivers that year, Parris Campbell was the one who was going to be the big star, not McLaurin.

Oops.

It's interesting going back and reading the reports for players like this.  In the case of McLaurin, it seems they were blinded by the lack of big production numbers

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/terry-mclaurin/32004d43-4c27-8328-8097-b130ba0e8060

Quote from: Brooklyn Dave on December 19, 2023, 02:40:01 PMI posed this question on another post  but never goit an answer. If Washington beats the Jets and we lose and Chicago wins , are we then the 4th pick or the 5th pick?

Without doing the math (the Strength of schedule math) I believe the team would end up picking 4th.  I read a Tweet today that said the Giants mathematically still have the potential to pick as high as 2nd.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on December 19, 2023, 03:28:55 PMFair and true point, but as we both know, there are plenty of very good to elite receivers who were drafted in round three or later.

It's a decently long list as far as the present day and very recent past goes. It's not just a few stragglers.

True, but how many of the finds put up top numbers (at least his final year) and attended an SEC school?  Sort of hard to miss a prospect like that.

Quote from: Jclayton92 on December 19, 2023, 02:55:16 PMSam Howell has more production Than Jones ever had in his 1st season starting so there is still a chance they go a different route.

The cards are winning games or at least competitive with kylar despite the lack of talent around him along with his contract which is 80 million more than Jones, they likely try to build around him before blowing it up.

Jess,

Maybe you're right, and the Cards and Commanders pass on a potential elite QB prospect, but it seems unlikely.  Neither team has ties with their current QBs, and I don't know many football people who wouldn't advocate grabbing a good QB (with elite potential) when their current QB is middle of the pack (and, in the case of the Cards, quite expensive).

Hell, based on your posts after the past few years, if you were GM of either team, you would draft any of the top 3 QBs if they fell to you.  Still, this is all just speculation, there are still 3 games to be played so we don't know how everything will fully shake out.

Quote from: Jclayton92 on December 19, 2023, 02:31:44 PMI only see 1 Qb needy team out of those 3.

1st Arizona is not getting rid of Kylar for several seasons, I mean if they cut him this offseason they'd have almost 90 million in dead cap. So they don't need a Qb at least for 2 years.

2nd Sam Howell is going to finish with 4,000 + yards and 20+ Tds, he isn't their problem. They need a LT, TE, and Edge badly and would have their pick of the #1 prospect at each of those positions.

3rd the bears likely take Caleb Williams who is basically Justin Fields 2.0 but their 2nd pick right before us is likely open for business and wouldn't take much to move up 1. They still however could skip QB with both picks and take WR, Corner, OLine, or Edge which they need badly.

So really we are only talking the bears and patriots before us taking Qbs which would have #3 of Maye, Williams, Daniels to fall into our laps.

Last point is if you look at most mock drafts they still don't grade daniels as a high prospect. The highest you really see him going is when we pick but beyond that he's fringe top 10.

Sam Howell

24th in QB rating

22nd in QBR

14th in EPA

27th ranked (20% passes) PFF

I don't see the Commanders passing an elite QB prospect.

Kyler Murray is in the same situation as Daniel Jones.  The Cards can't get rid of him in 2024 but they can part ways with him (for a cap savings) in 2025

Quote from: H-Town G-Fan on December 19, 2023, 12:57:57 PMTrevor Lawrence's stats are generally brought down by an abysmal rookie campaign, which one will recall was the Urban Meyer year--you know, the one where the head coach was staying behind on trips after gameday to cavort with women (other than his wife) at bars. Since then, Lawrence's performance has generally trended upward. He's even top-10 in QBR this season. But he came in to the league talked about as a generational-level talent and I think its fair to say that he has not met those lofty expectations. However, he is productive and looks to be headed in the right direction. Not to mention he has started every game since day 1 of his career in the NFL. I'd gladly have him on the Giants.

To further the comparison (see quote in bold)

Jones was 6th in QBR in 2022

For what it's worth, Hyatt lasted to round 3.  I don't think the other 31 teams just "forgot" to draft him sooner. 

Hyatt's route running is not really great.  Hyatt can also be muscled off of routes.

I tend to think Hyatt is a good part of the reason that he isn't a bigger part of the team's game plans. 

I can't imagine coaches so desperate for a spark would simply not get Hyatt involved if he was as good as many fans believe him to be.  I think Hyatt needs more work.