In your mind, is Daniel Jones now officially a bust?

[ralphpal1]

Picked too high but i wouldnt say a bust
At least we got a playoff win
That he actually caused us to.win
Not many players can say that
I didnt mind the 2 year signing
We had to be sure
Now we are
Time to move on but will it be bad for a rookie to learn under him or are those days over
Look at J love it sure didnt help.him

[Doc16LT56]

Good question, Dave. I think the meaning of the term "bust" has changed over the years. And as you said, people will define it in whatever way suits them. When I was a kid, guys like Ereck Flowers and Eli Apple weren't labeled busts. They were called below average or bad players but they were starters for a significant time so they weren't really busts. But these days they are called busts. Guys like Thomas Lewis and Derek Brown were busts because they couldn't earn their way on the field or keep a starting job.

Now part of that is in this era first round picks are handed starting jobs without earning them. But we still see examples of guys like Deandre Baker and Kadarius Toney who are gifted starting jobs they didn't earn but prove themselves to be busts anyway because they are so lousy in character and performance that they force decision makers to give up on them quickly.

The QB position is a little more complicated to assess because it's the keystone to everything else. It's hard to be an effective QB if you aren't able to elevate the play of your teammates.

By that measure, Jones is a bust. He elevates no one and he arguably makes his teammates look worse out there. But he has held a starting job for years so that puts him in the category with guys like Flowers and Apple, not with Baker and Toney.

If people want to say he's not a bust because he's been a starter, then that's fair. But in my view they'd also have to agree that Flowers and Apple weren't busts. Jones could run fast and he tried hard, so defenses had to account for him, but beyond that he didn't consistently do any of the things you'd expect from a higher tier starting QB.

To me he's a bust simply because the organization and their compliant beat writers and social media personalities tried to sell him as a franchise QB, which he's not and never has been. That's not his fault but sometimes players are a victim of their circumstances. If he was a 3rd round pick like Hostetler and made relatively little money, I have no doubt he'd be viewed in a more favorable light. He'd be thought of as an overachiever. A guy with limited talent who gave the team everything he had. But he took the money so it is what it is.

Someone raised the question of Daboll and Schoen's complicity. Yes, both men along with ownership and anyone else involved are complicit in creating the fairytale of Daniel Jones as a franchise QB who was worth franchise QB money (even if only for a 2 year commitment). That 2 years, on top of the 4 years of his rookie contract, have left this team in QB hell for what will be 6 years all because no one with any power in the organization was willing to call a spade a spade. You don't make your team better through public relations and creating a fairytale that your QB has skills that aren't there. He was never anything more than a fast guy with a ton of heart who was physically fragile and mentally overwhelmed.

In my book the contract combined with his draft position makes him a bust and yes, leadership is more than 50% to blame for this debacle.

[H-Town G-Fan]

Horrible starting record (22-36-1). Unimpressive individual results. Injury-plagued.

Good guy, but a bust all the same.

[AZGiantFan]

No.  But the Giants are, and have been for 10 years, a bust.

[Dgoodmantrublu]

It is a yes. And it is on him. Not on others. Teams laugh at how it is to still fool him with trap coverages. He's terrible. Dave Brown part 2.

[Uni]

Total bust

No 6 overall pick totally over drafted by the worst Giants GM

Injury prone, slow processor, indecisive thrower

Only distinguishing trait was running

Sent from my SM-S911U using Tapatalk

[Bob In PA]

Any member who answers "yes" MUST ALSO believe our management team and/or head coach are also busts.

Otherwise, a "yes" vote makes no sense since THEY signed the bust to a multi-year contract just this year.

So I'll ask anyone who sees this to also address THAT issue.

Bob

[Jclayton92]

If you draft a Qb in the top 10 and he ends up being a backup I don't see how he can be anything other than a bust.

Brock Osweiler
TJ Yates
Tim Tebow
Mike Tomczak
David Woodley


The list of garbage Qbs to win a playoff game is longer than that but just the ones I saw with a quick search.

[Jclayton92]

Any member who answers "yes" MUST ALSO believe our management team and/or head coach are also busts.

Otherwise, a "yes" vote makes no sense since THEY signed the bust to a multi-year contract just this year.

So I'll ask anyone who sees this to also address THAT issue.

Bob

I'll gladly answer it as I've had the same opinion since they signed him to the extension. 

From my perspective he was always a bridge Qb and the way the FO worked out his deal you could see it. Since the day they announced I thought they were buying themselves time to continue to build out the roster with the intent of grabbing their guy in 2024.

There was no one to choose from in free agency and no needle mover within their reach in the draft. So it was either Jones, Minshew, Brissett, or Mayfield and after last season they chose the devil they knew over the one they didnt.

The problem was that most thought the extension meant that Jones was the answer when he wasn't, he was just the best option at the time based on last year, to get them through until they could get their guy.

[Bob In PA]

If you draft a Qb in the top 10 and he ends up being a backup I don't see how he can be anything other than a bust.

J: I think that's a solid point. We probably view busts about the same in that regard.

Reworded, it says a guy is either a bargain, money well-invested, or a bust.

The difference between all of us here is more likely WHEN to determine it's time to "give up" on a guy.

That's the hard part, and reasonable minds can disagree, I suppose.

I'd rather wait to see when it becomes clear the Giants have given up on Jones as a starter (which was obviously what they drafted him to be) and then, with 20/20 hindsight, put a final label on the pick. To me, they have NOT given up on Jones until they announce someone other than Jones is the Giants' starting QB (in a situation where it is clear there are no other factors involved and their intention is to make a permanent change).

Bob

PS. I could have written this post with eight short words.... What's the hurry to label Jones a bust?

[H-Town G-Fan]

Any member who answers "yes" MUST ALSO believe our management team and/or head coach are also busts.

Otherwise, a "yes" vote makes no sense since THEY signed the bust to a multi-year contract just this year.

So I'll ask anyone who sees this to also address THAT issue.

Bob

Jones has had 5 years to prove himself. Schoen and Daboll have been in their positions for 2 years. (Neal is more their bust than Jones at this point... but if we give him 5 years like DJ, he's still got ample time to turn it around.) And I think it's very fair to say the Jones deal was a compromise with Mara given it was not some unequivocal, full-throated support for Jones having a reasonable out at 2 years.

So to answer your question, no, they are not busts. The success of whatever QB they draft this coming year will do far more to inform an answer to your question than a short-term deal for a QB thrust on them by an interventionist owner and drafted by an abominable GM.

[Bob In PA]

Jones has had 5 years to prove himself. Schoen and Daboll have been in their positions for 2 years. (Neal is more their bust than Jones at this point... but if we give him 5 years like DJ, he's still got ample time to turn it around.) And I think it's very fair to say the Jones deal was a compromise with Mara given it was not some unequivocal, full-throated support for Jones having a reasonable out at 2 years.

So to answer your question, no, they are not busts. The success of whatever QB they draft this coming year will do far more to inform an answer to your question than a short-term deal for a QB thrust on them by an interventionist owner and drafted by an abominable GM.

H-T: Yes. That's about the size of things, IMO. Bob

[T200]

I voted 'Yes' and wanted to elaborate but @H-Town G-Fan spoke to the exact points I wanted to make about Jones and Schoen/Daboll.

[TONKA56]

I don't think he really ever had a chance. He was overdrafted to play in an offensive system whos architect was immediately fired, and then the situation got BAD

[DaveBrown74]

I don't think he really ever had a chance. He was overdrafted to play in an offensive system whos architect was immediately fired, and then the situation got bad.

No QB who gets picked near the top of the draft is walking into a good near-term situation. Some still succeed. Others don't. Jones didn't.