Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: MightyGiants on December 28, 2022, 02:21:56 PMYet, when you list stats they are not for just the starters

You're getting upset because our 4th TE and 7th Wr has a 50 pff. Just not sure why you're making such a big deal of players that aren't actively involved in the game..

Quote from: Gman329 on December 28, 2022, 02:27:15 PMOne, the production will continue to increase and two, as I ask above, what are the alternatives?  I sure as hell don't want to start over with a rookie project out of the draft.  So for those who want to move on from DJ, who do you see or want as the Giant QB next year?

What do you think that organizations do when a new regime comes in? The Raiders just benched Derek Carr who has been night and day a better Qb than Jones his whole career. Carr, Tannehill, Jimmy G, Wentz they all fail... signing an average starter for big money always fails. I'm perfectly fine with going backwards next year if it means going forward the next 15 years. There are a ton of Qbs that can match Jones' production for one year at a fraction of the cost.

Quote from: MightyGiants on December 28, 2022, 02:11:40 PMWhy are you ignoring all the receivers with grades in the 50s and 60s?  Also, why ignore the TE and RB receiving grades?

Most of the guys in the 50s aren't starting... And we all see the balls Jones throws to Barkley, no wonder his PFF is 58.

Quote from: MightyGiants on December 28, 2022, 12:22:58 PMJones has the second worst contribution of WAR from his supporting cast of any QB in the NFL, yet he is one game away from making the playoffs.  I am not sure how anyone can say that isn't good enough

To be retained at 30 million, because that's what it'll take to resign him. So you're paying Jones 30 million a year content with the production he has now?

Quote from: MightyGiants on December 28, 2022, 08:57:51 AM3:20 Analyzing Daniel Jones' Season + Future

Genuinely seems from the portion that i watched that he's trying to find reasons to like him and then does the same thing we do with Jones every freaking season "well, umm... I want him to be more aggressive NEXT year" "you can't be 11th in QBR (counting his rushing) and have the worst 2-3 pass offense".

It's always until next year, at one point are we going to realize it never materializes NEXT year.

You rarely know what a TE is until year three. That's when they all tend to blossom into what they become as a pro for the remainder of their career.

Quote from: AP44 on December 27, 2022, 04:10:44 PMMahomes is gonna go down as one of the greatest ever. There's nothing wrong with saying he makes others around him better.

Tannehill is and always been an average QB who plays in a run first system.

Burrow had 8 TDs and 3 INTs without Chase in 4 games. Very small sample size. In those 4 games - he had a monster game (against Pitt with 4 TDs)- the other 3 were average games for him.

If you want to see what Hopkins meant for Murray - go check out what Arizona did with and without him last year. This year was a wasted year with Murray being banged up and Hopkins missing the first 6 games.

Isn't that Jones though? An average QB In a run first offense. That sums him up perfectly as Tannehill is the Jones ceiling comp for most fans and pundits alike.

Devante adams joining the Raiders helped Josh Jacob's more than it helped anyone.

I have a hard time deciding if a true number one would help or hurt Jones.

In Jones career he's never been one to feed a Hot hand, the opposite In fact he tends to spread the ball around evenly or follow the game plan. Would getting a number one actually hurt him because he feels the need to force him the ball? There are a ton of variables that you just wouldn't know until it happened.

Quote from: AP44 on December 27, 2022, 03:40:11 PMSo in the interest of this discussion we should attach the word irrelevant as well.

I have no clue what you're even talking about I was just giving you the definition of a saying you asked the meaning to.

Quote from: AP44 on December 27, 2022, 03:30:05 PMWhat does this even mean?

Game, set, match:An expression indicating finality, announcing that a series of events—usually involving some form of rivalry—has reached a conclusion.

Lol who's pumping up Nick Foles or Baker Mayfield?

I would however say that Baker Mayfield, Jones, and Murray are all in the same group of average yet uninspiring NFL starters.

Quote from: AZGiantFan on December 27, 2022, 01:15:47 PMMaybe that's because Mahomes' receivers get open?  They lost one of the top 3 receivers in the league and still have a receiving corps that is light-years better than the Giants'.

I wasn't arguing one way or another just giving examples on time to throw and how people use it.

Quote from: AZGiantFan on December 27, 2022, 01:02:23 PMFunny thing, I feel like I am one of the defenders of DJ, and I've probably made the strongest case for letting him (and Barkley) move on while they focus their CAP space on extending their stars like Dexter and Thomas, and picking up mid-pay-range FAs at lower value position like ILB and IOL, and maybe one big FA signing if there's someone they really like at one of our myriad positions of need.

I will give you that all day. Where most people try to act neutral you are neutral from what I've seen in discussions. Even though you and I have different perspectives on Jones, we both feel the same about the future of the team. Ie Should have traded Barkley, let Jones walk, acquire solid pieces at cheaper positions in FA and draft for premium.

Quote from: AZGiantFan on December 27, 2022, 12:51:00 PMSo it's not particularly relevant, since it includes the time he's running for his life.

In my opinion and from what I've read from professionals that use next Gen stats for clearer picture of what's going on with an offense "Time to Throw" doesn't give a ton of information on its own. Only when it's coupled with other next Gen stats like actual Air Yards, and intended air yards can you get a better picture.

For example:

Patrick mahomes has a bad time to throw stat but his air yards and intended air yards are way above average borderline really long, and his 20+ and 40+ plays are tops in the league then we can assume from the data that his time to throw is bad not because of the offensive line or anything he's doing but because he is holding the ball longer to allow for routes/plays to develop.

Daniel Jones Bad time to throw stat and his Inteded air yards, and actual air yards are extremely short, that he's holding the ball and not throwing it far when he does release suggests a disconnect in the offense. 

If that helps, but yeah time to throw doesn't offer much without context of other stats involved.

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