Everything COVID-19

[Bob In PA]

More like the week before the game quarterbacking as you (or anyone) can go back and see that I was citing experts well before decisions were made that it was dangerous and people would be killed if you ignored the experts and the guidelines and rushed to open up.

Rich: And other experts said the opposite.  So what?  Bob

[MightyGiants]

Rich: And other experts said the opposite.  So what?  Bob

Not exactly, the right/GOP/Trump trotted out people that said what they wanted to hear and touted them as experts.

[Bob In PA]

Is that because it's harder to doctor hospitalization numbers?

Always political.  What happened to the "truth" in science?  Is the amount of info we have on the virus only important if it helps Democrats?   Bob

[Bob In PA]

Not exactly, the right/GOP/Trump trotted out people that said what they wanted to hear and touted them as experts.

Rich: As did the left.  Bob

[MightyGiants]

Rich: As did the left.  Bob

No, Bob the rest of us simply listened to the actual experts who correctly told us not to rush to open things back up and said if we did cases would spike and you would have to start shutting things back down.

[MightyGiants]

Always political.  What happened to the "truth" in science?  Is the amount of info we have on the virus only important if it helps Democrats?   Bob

Really?!?!   Bob, I honestly think you might need to take a break my friend.   You are starting to see ghosts like Sam Darnold   

[Bob In PA]

Really?!?!   Bob, I honestly think you might need to take a break my friend.   You are starting to see ghosts like Sam Darnold   

Rich: Condescending and demeaning. Bob

[Bob In PA]

No, Bob the rest of us simply listened to the actual experts who correctly told us not to rush to open things back up and said if we did cases would spike and you would have to start shutting things back down.

Rich: The word "rush" is an opinion, so there is no "science" in your statement, just politics.  IMO not a single state rushed to open things back up because every leader wanted the best for his or her people.  Bob

[MightyGiants]

Rich: Condescending and demeaning. Bob

Sorry, you believe that Bob

[MightyGiants]

Rich: The word "rush" is an opinion, so there is no "science" in your statement, just politics.  IMO not a single state rushed to open things back up because every leader wanted the best for his or her people.  Bob

The CDC issued guidance (that Trump even labeled as his plan to open America) it was a roadmap on how to safely open up the nation.  There was other CDC guidance on how to safely open up that Trump censored (thanks to our watchdog media the document was available and I was able to download a copy).    When I used the term "rushed" I was using it in the context of states that violated the guidelines so they could open up quicker.

[Bob In PA]

The CDC issued guidance (that Trump even labeled as his plan to open America) it was a roadmap on how to safely open up the nation.  There was other CDC guidance on how to safely open up that Trump censored (thanks to our watchdog media the document was available and I was able to download a copy).    When I used the term "rushed" I was using it in the context of states that violated the guidelines so they could open up quicker.

Rich: That seems about right, but I must ask.... is there no chance some states intentionally opened up slower by implementing more precautions than the guidelines suggested were necessary?  No need to answer that. I mention it only to point out that there is another side of the story.  If some states DID go slower, good for them.  If some went faster, it was because they believed it was in the best interest of their residents to do so.  The response to a public health crisis should not be determined in a vacuum that considers ONLY one type of "health."  That's why each state has a chief executive... to determine the over-all "best" solution.  It's not a clear-cut "science only" proposition, and again that is why I refuse to criticize any of them. Bob

[FL GMAN]

Rich all I was saying is that there are major inconsistencies in the numbers that need to be investigated. You always talk about verification but in any news that runs contrary to your opinion you label it false and untrue. Let it play out. It might be insignificant or it could be a big change.

[MightyGiants]

Rich: That seems about right, but I must ask.... is there no chance some states intentionally opened up slower by implementing more precautions than the guidelines suggested were necessary?  No need to answer that. I mention it only to point out that there is another side of the story.  If some states DID go slower, good for them.  If some went faster, it was because they believed it was in the best interest of their residents to do so.  The response to a public health crisis should not be determined in a vacuum that considers ONLY one type of "health."  That's why each state has a chief executive... to determine the over-all "best" solution.  It's not a clear-cut "science only" proposition, and again that is why I refuse to criticize any of the them. Bob

It seems to me many of our elected officials shared your beliefs rather than the "let us listen to the experts" type leaders like Germany did (or even NY and NJ who got started out, when testing finally was available, with the virus widespread and getting worse).   Staying closed was not an easy option politically what with heavily armed protestors storming government buildings demanding their states reopen quickly

[MightyGiants]

Rich all I was saying is that there are major inconsistencies in the numbers that need to be investigated. You always talk about verification but in any news that runs contrary to your opinion you label it false and untrue. Let it play out. It might be insignificant or it could be a big change.

Here is how I see it.

You can't doctor hospitalizations so that is a gold standard indicator and it shows Florida is in a really bad way

As for the cases to death numbers, I am mindful of a few things:

1)   Florida had a couple of months to prepare that NY and NJ didn't have

2)  Medical treatments have improved since NY/NJ got hammered

3)  There are more PPE supplies available now than when NY/NJ got hammered and healthcare workers were forced to wear garbage bags and reuse the same mask for a week or more (or worse use a lesser mask)

4)  The explanation of the skewed cases to death ratio can also be explained by the death rates being underreported just as easily as the positive rates being over-reported

[FL GMAN]

That's what i mean, you always look at it from a point of view you already have. It's almost as if you hope it's bad to prove your point. If the rate is lower than being reported and people are not dying due to what you stated and other things, that's good isn't it?  I don't view this as a contest. I hope someone gets an answer soon and I don't care who it is.