NGT: NCAA Playoffs

[uconnjack8]

Who do you think should be in?

[Philosophers]

Who do you think should be in?

What about Ohio St?

[uconnjack8]

What about Ohio St?

Didn't think they could be legitimately considered.  Liberty was tongue and cheek.  I think I can add them

Every other team played in a conference championship.   Sorry they have a tough division.  I know some SEC West teams can empathize.

[DaveBrown74]

Didn't think they could be legitimately considered.  Liberty was tongue and cheek.  I think I can add them

Every other team played in a conference championship.   Sorry they have a tough division.  I know some SEC West teams can empathize.

ND never plays in a conf championship game and they have been in a bunch of times in the last decade.


I put in another thread that I think the teams that WILL get in are:

Mich
Wash
FSU
Bama


I think the top four teams in the country are:

1. Mich
2. OSU
3. UGA
4. Bama

If I could have a CFP where I was deciding it based on total subjectivity and not about perfect fairness, it would be the second list. Obviously though, there is no way the committee will (or should) leave power five teams who had undefeated seasons and won their conf championship games out. That would be totally unfair. I'm not advocating for unfairness. I'm just pointing out we're going to get a CFP with only two of the four best teams in the country. And if the theories that they completely leave the SEC out are true, it will be only one of the top four teams.

[uconnjack8]

ND never plays in a conf championship game and they have been in a bunch of times in the last decade.


I put in another thread that I think the teams that WILL get in are:

Mich
Wash
FSU
Bama


I think the top four teams in the country are:

1. Mich
2. OSU
3. UGA
4. Bama

If I could have a CFP where I was deciding it based on total subjectivity and not about perfect fairness, it would be the second list. Obviously though, there is no way the committee will (or should) leave power five teams who had undefeated seasons and won their conf championship games out. That would be totally unfair. I'm not advocating for unfairness. I'm just pointing out we're going to get a CFP with only two of the four best teams in the country. And if the theories that they completely leave the SEC out are true, it will be only one of the top four teams.

Comment about OSU was about this year only.  All of the teams listed were in their conference championship game.  I believe Bama or LSU have made it in to the playoff without having been in a conference championship game as has OSU one year.  Difference is that this year there is 4 teams that won a conference championship and are either undefeated or beat the SEC champion head to head.  In those past years the Big 12 and/or PAC 12 had different situations with their conference champ. 

In no way was I trying to say that in the past teams couldn't get in without a championship game appearance.

For those reasons, when I created the post that OSU would be given any real consideration given the way this year played out.

[DaveBrown74]

Comment about OSU was about this year only.  All of the teams listed were in their conference championship game.  I believe Bama or LSU have made it in to the playoff without having been in a conference championship game as has OSU one year.  Difference is that this year there is 4 teams that won a conference championship and are either undefeated or beat the SEC champion head to head.  In those past years the Big 12 and/or PAC 12 had different situations with their conference champ. 

In no way was I trying to say that in the past teams couldn't get in without a championship game appearance.

For those reasons, when I created the post that OSU would be given any real consideration given the way this year played out.

Yup I totally hear you. I guess when I look at pure resume, OSU has the two signature wins in ND and against Penn St, and they only lost by six in Ann Arbor while outgaining the Wolverines in that game. To me they're clearly one of the four best teams in the country.

Will/should they get in? No, but I do think they're a top four team that is more than capable of beating anyone. I wouldn't even completely rule out that they might be the best team.

[uconnjack8]

I really won't understand if Bama gets in and Texas doesn't.  If beating a team head to head on the road by double digits doesn't trump the other stuff, then why play tough out of conference games?



FSU should have their #2 QB back and will be a better version than last night.

[Bob In PA]

Who do you think should be in?

uconn: Got to have consistency. The teams "out" should be Ohio State, Georgia and Alabama.

Each of them has already lost to another team on the list of possibilities.

The networks and college football elitists may be unhappy, but so what?

The point is to allow all of the games to have meaning.  Using my rule, they do.

The only possible "bugaboo" with this approach is that it gives as much "weight" to the Alabama/Texas game (played long ago) as it gives to the Alabama/Georgia and Michigan/Ohio State games which were played quite recently. I think that's a small price to pay for consistency, which IMO is the hallmark of fairness in matters like this.  Again, I say, "So what?"

Bob

PS. If anyone can come up with another objective rule that works, please tell me what it is.

[Bob In PA]

I think the top four teams in the country are:

1. Mich
2. OSU
3. UGA
4. Bama

DB: Agree 100 percent. But two questions presented by OUR SUBJECTIVE CHOICES have already been answered.

It may be a tough break for Ohio State and Georgia, but it is really?

Just think of Michigan/Ohio State and Alabama/Georgia as preliminary tie-breakers in a tournament of six.

Can't have Bama without Texas. Can't have Washington without Florida State.

No other objective criteria work this year.

Bob

PS. Like you, I believe my preferred result (the only one that actually makes sense) will NOT happen.

[Ed Vette]

Mich
Wash
Tx
Bama

[Philosophers]

I really won't understand if Bama gets in and Texas doesn't.  If beating a team head to head on the road by double digits doesn't trump the other stuff, then why play tough out of conference games?



FSU should have their #2 QB back and will be a better version than last night.

I think Texas gets in with no debate.  Bama could be left out but doubtful.

[DaveBrown74]

I really won't understand if Bama gets in and Texas doesn't.  If beating a team head to head on the road by double digits doesn't trump the other stuff, then why play tough out of conference games?



FSU should have their #2 QB back and will be a better version than last night.

I get it, and I agree it's controversial.

I guess I would make two points here:

(1) The game was week two. I think recency should matter. If it doesn't, then that's fine, but I disagree that it shouldn't. And historically I think it has. I feel games played after week 7 or so should matter more than games played before week 4 or 5. If you really want to strive to have the best four teams in the playoffs (while preserving fairness) then I think recency should matter. These teams evolve over the course of the season and are often different teams in early December than they were in late summer.

(2) The rest of Bama's resume is simply a lot better than Texas'. Apart from beating the number one team in the country just yesterday, they had multiple assertive, decisive wins against very respectable, nationally ranked SEC foes like Ole Miss, LSU, and Tennessee. Texas on the other hand struggled mightily with teams like Houston, K State, and TCU. I personally think it shouldn't just be about who you played and whether you won or lost, but I think the nature of the win or loss itself should matter, and it usually does. Bama has a big advatnage over Texas in this regard.

If your life depended on it, and these two teams were to play head to head next weekend in a neutral field like Pasadena, whom would you pick as the straight up winner?

Again I get that it's controversial, but I really doubt the committee shuts the SEC completely out of this. Whether it's fair or not is up for discussion.

[Philosophers]

ND never plays in a conf championship game and they have been in a bunch of times in the last decade.


I put in another thread that I think the teams that WILL get in are:

Mich
Wash
FSU
Bama


I think the top four teams in the country are:

1. Mich
2. OSU
3. UGA
4. Bama

If I could have a CFP where I was deciding it based on total subjectivity and not about perfect fairness, it would be the second list. Obviously though, there is no way the committee will (or should) leave power five teams who had undefeated seasons and won their conf championship games out. That would be totally unfair. I'm not advocating for unfairness. I'm just pointing out we're going to get a CFP with only two of the four best teams in the country. And if the theories that they completely leave the SEC out are true, it will be only one of the top four teams.

I am with you.  I always go by the eye test so to me I see Michigan, OSU, Bama and UGA as the four best.  Rest of the teams would not want to play those four.

[DaveBrown74]

I think Texas gets in with no debate.  Bama could be left out but doubtful.

I struggle to see both Bama and Texas getting in. I just don't see how they'll leave FSU out. How do you leave out a power 5 team that won all its games and won their conf champ game?

Trust me in no way do I think FSU is a top 4 team, but I simply can't see any way they get left out. They won every single game. They're not Cincy. They play in a legit conference.

If they get left out, then this thing is 100% subjective, and that should open up all kinds of other possibilities.

[uconnjack8]

FSU is an interesting case for the committee.  With their QB1 I see them as a top 4 team, or at least in that conversation.   The version of that team that played last night might not be in the top 10.  They will have QB2 back instead of the Fr. QB1. 

They are still 13-0