Big Blue Huddle

That is an excellent point; I'm glad you added it to the discussion, Rich.  Team's draft boards are layered; they are not just vertical but lateral as well. They will refelect player value, position value, and priority. And as I understand it, some teams color-code board entries in the the first two or three rounds to reflect what they view as higher value combinations.

Where the priority for the OG position is high enough, as many here feel it is for the Giants, it would be hard to argue that Warmack or Cooper wouldn't represent excellent value at 19. It might also be true that an available DE, OT, LB, or DB would be of no greater value; maybe lesser on a vertical scale. But, not only would priority be a factor, but also the ability to match the pick at 19 to the one at 49 in the effort to maximize value. Thus a combo with an OG at 49 with a DE or DB at 19 might tally highest in perceived value

Cheers!     

 

No one does it better than you, Ceri. Not only are the analyses enlightening but the form and content are a  the model pre-Draft reference.

In your OT review, I'll be interested in your assessment of Kevin Pugh as a potential OLG and emergency OLT, and Kyle Long as an OLT/OLG prospect.  As we all know, no team has valued and exploited versatility in their Olinemen more than Our Heroes. They have mined a lot of value from multipositional players like Dave Diehl and Kevin Boothe. But they were 5th and 6th Round picks, respectively. Pugh and Long wont last that long; certainly not past the 3rd Round.   

Much obliged.

Cheers!

  Thanks, Jian.

Cheers!

That's a good explanation of the added difficulty posed by the slot corner position. It always have been a fact; it simply has become much more significant in recent years.  Not long ago, the only time the offense put three WRs on the field was on an occasional 3rd and long, or more likely when they were trying to play catch up. Now they may do it on any down and distance, and at anytime in the game. And so the 3rd receiver, the one in the slot has become a weapon not just a sub.

Correspondingly, the third DB, the guy we have referred to in an almost dismissive manner as the Nickel Back, has become a specialist as well.  He's no longer just a Nickel Back or Nickel Corner; he's the Slot Back.

But we tend to think that the outside, the perimeter Corners have the toughest job because they may be covering the opponents best receiver. True, but when a corner is lined up on the outside, coverage actually can be easier. The opposing receiver is limited as to where he can go. He has the sideline constraining him. A good corner can use the sideline as a defender and pin receivers against it. And he almost always has a Safety behind him.

But unlike perimeter DBs who can often dictate the release of the receiver by their leverage - how far inside or outside of the receiver they line up- the slot DB needs to be quick enough to react to a

Nothing dumb about it, CAGiantFAN. The X breaks inside while W stays vertical which suggests who passes the crossing point first. And you would want it that way. The Z and W are running clear out routes. X clearly is the "read", so we might expect the W to lead, force the Safety back and so clear the deep middle for the X.

Cheers!

Great stuff, Rich.  That looks like Curt Warner and Mike Martz back in Greatest Show on Turf days. It might even be their terminology. It also could be the Eagles who run stuff like that a lot. It is not the Giants terminolgy although they run a bunch of Hi-Lo routes. Not often with a Back and TE, however. They run them with Cruz crossing underneath and a TE running a 12-15 yard square-in, and vice versa with the TE running a shallow cross; Cruz running a Hi dig-route.

In the PO game against the Niners, they began anticipating Cruz running a shallow cross, so he began pivoting and running back outside, a so called jerk-route because it makes the defender look like a jerk. That made them switch from Man to zone underneath. I don't know if it's read or not but it fits Gilbride's style.

And while on that subject, it's more likely that Gilbride would "run and shoot" a deep dig route out of Trips with Nicks isolated on the single side. Often the route is a quick ad hoc decison between Eli and Nicks to run either a streak or a bend with the underneath receiver sitting in open area of the zone. He runs the same kind of thing with an inside receiver. Not Run and Shoot but an echo.

A great QB and a really savvy OC have made stars of Nicks and Cruz; especially the latter, and has made rather ordinary TEs quite productive.

Cheers!

The switch to the T Formation was 1949, jimv.  As for the other date, Columbia ended Army's 32 game winning streak in October 1947. I was at that game with my mom who was a huge fan of Lou Little's Lions, and the reason Columbia later became my alma mater. What she didn't know at the time was that I was rooting for Army. In any case, it wasn't Pitchin' Paul Governali but Gene Rossides who threw the famous pass to Bill Swiaki who caught it with his finger tips to cut the score to 20-14. He made another 4th Quarter catch on the Army 3 yard line after which Lou Kusserow ran it in to make the final score 21-20. Rossides and Kusserow were known as the Gold Dust Twins.

Cheers!

Yes, indeed the fullback was a ball carrier- often the major one- back in the day. There were three backs behind the Quarterback who was "under the Center" in the T formation. They crossed the T which is where it is got its name. The guy in the middle might be a half to a full step deeper than the other two which is why he was called, Fullback; the others were called, Halfbacks. In those days, Mel Triplett was the fullback, Gifford and Webster, the halfbacks. Chuckin' Charlie Connery was the QB, the Giants first ever T formation Quarterback. But even before then Connerly's FBs included Gene "Choo Choo" Roberts and Eddie Price with Joe Scott, and Skippy Minisi, and Kyle Rote as the Halfbacks.


Before the Charlie Connerly era began, the Giants played the Steve Owen's "A formation" which was a variation the single wing. Paul Governali was the Wingback; Ken Strong was the Fullback, Joe Sulaitis the Blocking Back, and Howie Livingston was Tailback.

Cheers!

You got that right, king of the bronx.

Cheers!

A truly accurate assessment, Ceri.  You certainly nailed Courtney Upshaw but alas he wont be there when Giants pick, and I don't see the trade happening. In any case, I've decided to not expend any more mental energy adducing and deducing. It's close enough enough now; I can wait.

Cheers!

Really well done, and spot on as usual.

Many thanks.

Cheers!

Ceri, I share your views on RBs so closely, I need not comment except in regard to "trading out" of 32. Two things would be required for it to even be a consideration: 1. Someone would have to make them a really good offer. 2. It would not cost them a shot at a player they really wanted.     

Cheers!

I figured that might be your reasoning, Ceri.  Actually, it's what makes your board so good. It's realistic.
Teams with needs may overvalue to address those needs, most particularly when the need is for a starting (franchise?) QB. Both the Browns and 'phins may see Tannehill as their only realistic opportunity. A decision reached to pass on Richardson, Blackmon, and Floyd may depend on whether either can imagine Brandon Weeden as an Andy Dalton.

As for Cousins, I agree that 43-52 is way too high for a guy who projects as a backup on a WCO team.

Cheers!

Well done, Ceri. No room to even quibble. Maybe just a little uncertainty as to whether Tannehill with only 19 starts at QB is full value in the Top 10. Of course, that's where he may go given the needs of teams like the Browns and Dolphins. But that is franchise QB territory.

Great job, my friend.

Cheers!

Big Red always will be one of my all-time favorite Giants. I had the pleasure of having a few pops with him in Gallagher's on more than one occasion. Just a really nice man.

May he rest in peace with all the great Giants who have gone before him.