Are we really THAT bad?

[LennG]

As I watched yesterday's dismantling of the once proud Eagles and watched a backup QB who was able to be aggressive and throw the ball down the field, I kept thinking about why now, and look, we do have some guys here who can play this game. Then on defense, we basically shut down the Eagles and their number 1 offensive unit.
We played aggressively, both on offense and defense, and we seemed to have guys who again, played the game well.

Now I'm not saying we are on a par with the Eagles and Dallas, but it sure seemed to me if we had a QB and a game plan that played aggressive football, we do seem to have guys who can play and maybe, with a new QB we could be competitive. Sure we need help on the OL, we need a true #1 WR and a good edge, but with our band of crazy characters, we may not be as bad as we thought we really were. AND this is from the eternal pessimist. With a good draft and a new QB and a few smart FAs, we could very well turn this mess into a real football team a lot quicker than I thought.

[jgrangers2]

We're not awful. I'd say something like the 20th best team in the NFL. The big thing is we don't have a top QB. I think the right guy can do for us what Stroud did for Houston with the obvious caveat that the NFC East is not the AFC South.

[DaveBrown74]

With a good draft and a new QB and a few smart FAs

That sounds like a lot. Not exactly a minor tweak or two.

[katkavage]

The Giants are the sixth worst team in the league just like their draft position. Four of their six wins were against teams worse than they are. No way to sugar coat it. If you think they are better than their record you have to take the Giant blue sun glasses off.

[Stringer Bell]

We're not awful. I'd say something like the 20th best team in the NFL. The big thing is we don't have a top QB. I think the right guy can do for us what Stroud did for Houston with the obvious caveat that the NFC East is not the AFC South.

I keep seeing this, and it's just not true.

1) We're not just a QB away. This team needs legit #1 and #2 options in the passing game, it needs 3 new starters out of 5 on the OL, and it needs to replace its most productive offensive player in Barkley. And that's just on offense. In terms of overall talent, there's no way this team is higher than #25.

2) Stroud and Stroud alone is not why the Texans took the next step. They brought in 6 above average starters - and several key role players - in their last 2 drafts to plug holes around Stroud. That's why they took the next step. They significantly improved the overall talent on all units, not just at QB.

[DaveBrown74]

The Giants are the sixth worst team in the league just like their draft position. Four of their six wins were against teams worse than they are. No way to sugar coat it. If you think they are better than their record you have to take the Giant blue sun glasses off.

I would argue that if anything they were worse than their record. Only one of their six wins was convincing. Many of their losses were blowouts. There was nothing good about this season. I think they're still a ways off from being a legitimately good team that scares anyone.

Clearly getting a QB like Stroud can change things quickly, but that's a big if. For every Stroud there are many more Bryce Youngs, Mitch Trubiskys, and Sam Darnolds.

[Doc16LT56]

That sounds like a lot. Not exactly a minor tweak or two.

2 year rebuild this time?

[StompYouOT]

My take is they were competitive with Tyrod and even looked good yesterday.  If he was younger with time on his side I would feel good starting him Opening Day - we'd have some new pieces, maybe a true WR1 and then go from there.  I just don't think his window matches our rebuild.

So I agree with the OP, while we need talent upgrades, good QB play goes a long, long way in today's league.  Too bad we're back with DJ next year and a worse defense most likely.

[jgrangers2]

I keep seeing this, and it's just not true.

1) We're not just a QB away. This team needs legit #1 and #2 options in the passing game, it needs 3 new starters out of 5 on the OL, and it needs to replace its most productive offensive player in Barkley. And that's just on offense. In terms of overall talent, there's no way this team is higher than #25.

2) Stroud and Stroud alone is not why the Texans took the next step. They brought in 6 above average starters - and several key role players - in their last 2 drafts to plug holes around Stroud. That's why they took the next step. They significantly improved the overall talent on all units, not just at QB.

The team as a whole is really mediocre right now. Maybe I overshot calling them #20, but there's maybe a handful of teams separating themselves on either side of the spectrum and then a bunch of mediocre teams. So the Giants are on the bad side of average, but I don't think they're that far off from being on the right side of it if, for no other reason, than so few teams are actually good.

[DaveBrown74]

The team as a whole is really mediocre right now. Maybe I overshot calling them #20, but there's maybe a handful of teams separating themselves on either side of the spectrum and then a bunch of mediocre teams. So the Giants are on the bad side of average, but I don't think they're that far off from being on the right side of it if, for no other reason, than so few teams are actually good.

Besides Washington, the Pats, and Carolina, whom in the entire league can you confidently say we are better than?

[expatriot]

Yup the Giants are THAT bad. A decade of sucking.

[LennG]

Besides Washington, the Pats, and Carolina, whom in the entire league can you confidently say we are better than?

I didn't say we were better than any particular team, but I did say is we have more talent on this team, than what was apparent thru most of the year.
And I also said, put the right type of QB in there and we CAN be competitive with many teams in the league. Obviously, we aren't on the Niners, Ravens, Eagles, and Dallas level, but again, with the right QB, I think we are every bit as good as the Broncos, the Saints, the Falcons, Chargers, Bears, and several other teams. We have been in QB hell for a few years now and maybe Kafka and crew have fine-tuned the offensive game plans to go with the limited talent we have there. Look what a Tyrod Taylor did with a much more aggressive game plan against a defense that is pretty good.
Again, we are what our record says we are but with a few decent components and the right QB, we could turn this around sooner than later.

[Painter]

Besides Washington, the Pats, and Carolina, who in the entire league can you confidently say we are a better team than?

No one really. Still, I don't blame anyone for rationalizing in the name of hope with logic suggesting that the losing can't last forever. That's true, isn't? I mean, like eventually they will have 2 winning seasons back-to-back, right?

Hey, this is a franchise which has played in 5 Super Bowls and won 4 (1986 & '90, 2007 & '11) so there can't be any suggestion that losing is in its DNA. However, we have at least once before seen Our Heroes go walkabout to a quite similar extent- actually, quite a bit worse. It started just about the time in 1970 that the NFL reshaped itself into Conference and Division format which as it happened began a stretch of just 2 (non-consecutive) winning seasons in and of the Giants next 13. That's right 2-13 compared to our current 2-9. Still, chilling as that may be, they are not related situations, and so no conclusions should be drawn, nor projections made.

But returning to the question- based on the results which are the established facts, the answer is Yes! And so, we are seeing changes once again about which it could be said, it's only the best teams which might prefer the status quo.

Cheers!   

"If ifs and buts were candy and nuts, we all have a Merry Christmas" -Don Meredith, late and lamented.

[AYM]

I think in all honesty we're drafting about where we should be. All the teams drafting behind us are better, and all the teams drafting ahead of us are slightly worse. Slightly.

[Brooklyn Dave]

I don't know why everyone says the Giants need a total rebuild if they didn't ( miss a field goal against The Jets ), ( kicked the field goal at the end of the first half of The Bills game), and  made the ( 2 point conversation in Rams game at the end )

We would have made the playoffs and these kind of posts would be non existant.