(with apologies to Todd Rungren) explain to me WHY Josh Dobbs was not acquired by the New York Giants last week ??
A 6th round draft choice too expensive ??
His salary ?? Cut some dead wood if you have to.
This once again dysfunctional organization has driven me to eggnog addiction a month ahead of time. AGAIN.
Our ability to judge football talent is off the charts (the bottom)
Can you say 2 - 15 Mr. Mara ??
Maybe we need more captains. 10 is obviously not enough. Everyone knows the more captains you have the better your team must be.
Please I am begging to be enlightened. Are we hoping for another Duke QB savior ??
Quote from: Giant Obsession on November 06, 2023, 12:21:29 PM(with apologies to Todd Rungren) explain to me WHY Josh Dobbs was not acquired by the New York Giants last week ??
A 6th round draft choice too expensive ??
His salary ?? Cut some dead wood if you have to.
This once again dysfunctional organization has driven me to eggnog addiction a month ahead of time. AGAIN.
Our ability to judge football talent is off the charts (the bottom)
Can you say 2 - 15 Mr. Mara ??
Maybe we need more captains. 10 is obviously not enough. Everyone knows the more captains you have the better your team must be.
Please I am begging to be enlightened. Are we hoping for another Duke QB savior ??
In my opinion, they expected jones to hold it down through the end of the year. no one saw a torn acl coming. we got barkley who will be elevated this week most likely. and tyrod is back in 3 weeks if healthy. no need to waste precious draft capital for a guy who may or may not play.
IMOFWIW...
Schoen and Daboll know this season is lost, and at the time they could have picked up Dobbs, we didn't need a 4th QB because DJ was coming back. They could not foresee that DJ would go down the first day he was back
The season is lost and there's no recovery with the team we have...even if we blew some of our draft stock on Dobbs. In hindsight, Dobbs had an incredible day yesterday, but that is not his M.O.
Schoen and Dabes are looking at the future and see a bigger picture than us fans. They are not "idiots at the helm". Have a little faith, but at the same time - don't join the betting sites and put hard-earned money on the Giants this year
I share you head-scratching need for 10 captains, but that is not why this team sucks this year
Quote from: Giant Obsession on November 06, 2023, 12:21:29 PM(with apologies to Todd Rungren) explain to me WHY Josh Dobbs was not acquired by the New York Giants last week ??
A 6th round draft choice too expensive ??
His salary ?? Cut some dead wood if you have to.
This once again dysfunctional organization has driven me to eggnog addiction a month ahead of time. AGAIN.
Our ability to judge football talent is off the charts (the bottom)
Can you say 2 - 15 Mr. Mara ??
Maybe we need more captains. 10 is obviously not enough. Everyone knows the more captains you have the better your team must be.
Please I am begging to be enlightened. Are we hoping for another Duke QB savior ??
Why on earth would they have wanted him? Which is not a knock on him. Why on earth would they have wanted anybody? They're not any good. If Jones comes back and turns it all around that's great. If he doesn't they're better off letting Devito continue to do what he does so they get into the Caleb Williams sweepstakes. The only other trades they should have made at the deadline but didn't are to trade away Adoree Jackson and Saquon Barkley.
Trading any assets off in a lost season would be dumb. This season is lost. They should be building for the future. Not trading away picks.
I was surprised the Cards traded him. Perhaps Joe was not aware that Dobbs was even on the market.
Quote from: MightyGiants on November 06, 2023, 01:02:14 PMI was surprised the Cards traded him. Perhaps Joe was not aware that Dobbs was even on the market.
Cardinals have made it clear they're tanking for Caleb and Dobbs quite frankly was too good to be a part of the plan so they shipped his ass outta there. They could be the Giants top competition for the right to select Caleb.
They were expecting Jones to come back and stay healthy.
Quote from: Gmo11 on November 06, 2023, 01:42:43 PMCardinals have made it clear they're tanking for Caleb and Dobbs quite frankly was too good to be a part of the plan so they shipped his ass outta there. They could be the Giants top competition for the right to select Caleb.
Isn't Kyler close to coming back?
Even if they have decided they want to move on from Kyler, he is much better than whatever nobody they have out there at QB now. Having him back could mean they win a couple more games than we do.
Quote from: DaveBrown74 on November 06, 2023, 01:45:31 PMIsn't Kyler close to coming back?
Even if they have decided they want to move on from Kyler, he is much better than whatever nobody they have out there at QB now. Having him back could mean they win a couple more games than we do.
And he's playing for his future, either with the Cards or elsewhere. I think they'll win a couple of games.
Quote from: DaveBrown74 on November 06, 2023, 01:45:31 PMIsn't Kyler close to coming back?
Even if they have decided they want to move on from Kyler, he is much better than whatever nobody they have out there at QB now. Having him back could mean they win a couple more games than we do.
As I understand it, they don't want to play him because they are going to cut him after the year but if he plays and gets hurt there's some weird clause in his contract that they have to pay him a bunch of money. They want him gone but don't want to risk paying him that sum of money.
Quote from: B1GBLUE on November 06, 2023, 12:37:45 PMIn my opinion, they expected jones to hold it down through the end of the year. no one saw a torn acl coming. we got barkley who will be elevated this week most likely. and tyrod is back in 3 weeks if healthy. no need to waste precious draft capital for a guy who may or may not play.
That's exactly the point. This could not have been foreseen. The neck injury has/had nothing to do with the ACL, nothing.
And making these statements in hindsight is always easy. Let's always keep in mind that the Coach and the GM need to decide BEFORE and not after the fact.
Why not give Colt McCoy a call? The Viking were interested in him but traded for Dobbs.
Quote from: TDToomer on November 06, 2023, 02:17:16 PMWhy not give Colt McCoy a call? The Viking were interested in him but traded for Dobbs.
Wouldn't be at all surprised to see him and Wentz in for a work out.
Quote from: Gmo11 on November 06, 2023, 01:53:04 PMAs I understand it, they don't want to play him because they are going to cut him after the year but if he plays and gets hurt there's some weird clause in his contract that they have to pay him a bunch of money. They want him gone but don't want to risk paying him that sum of money.
Will business considerations keep the Cardinals from playing Kyler Murray in 2023? (https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/will-business-considerations-keep-the-cardinals-from-playing-kyler-murray-in-2023)
"if he suffers an injury this season and can't pass a physical by March, the Cardinals will be on the hook for his $37 million in 2024 (that's unavoidable at this point) and another $29.9 million in 2025. (Murray also has another $26.8 million in 2026 injury guarantees.)"
To me, very simply the Cards had benched Dobbs and put him on the available market.
Fine that Jones had been cleared and was now available to start. That still left us with only DeVito as a backup.
Dobbs had started and at least showed some talent for the position before being relegated to the bench.
Meanwhile the Giants are scurrying around giving the likes of Matt Barkley a tryout and ultimately a contract and a place on the practice squad.
What makes no sense to me is WHY if Dobbs is on the market and the Giants in REALITY need a backup did we not grab Dobbs.
I am not talking hindsight here. For next to no loss of draft capital the Giants could have acquired a QB, a young QB mind you, with at least some professional experience to plug and play if necessary. Not like we did against the Jets.
I have to believe Dobbs is at minimum a much better pro level QB than a green, untrusted DeVito.
And those facts hold true without any use of hindsight.
Very little risk, possibly no future reward, but then again...
Why take the chance you ask and give up a 5th or 6th round draft choice for a roster necessity ??
WELL, if that is the stumbling block......
Why give up a 3rd rounder for a 31 year old oft injured TE when you are supposed to be rebuilding ??
Why sign then jettison an experienced accomplished PR and competent WR without even giving him a try?
Why keep trotting out a damn good K with a bad PLANT leg for half a season, ultimately costing us 2 wins ? With NO backup plan.
These are not hindsight questions....these are COMMON SENSE questions.
What is this obsession with Caleb, as if he is Joe Burrow?!! I have watched him in a few games and he seems to have some issues, definitely not a top-5 talent, imo.
If the Giants had a crystal ball and could tell the future, getting Dobbs would make sense. Who knew Jones was going to have a season-ending injury? Plus, you'd get Taylor back in 3 games and you still have DeVito.
And look, the Giants are in rebuilding mode, AGAIN. They sold off Williams because they knew they were not going to pay his asking after this year, but a contending team doesn't trade one its best DL with a lot of the season left. Trading assets for a journeyman QB so he can win you one or two more games doesn't make a ton of sense.
And I disagree with the assessment that Schoen is bad at picking players. Everyone has misses, but his ledger is still in the black.
...(with apologies to Todd Rungren)
"Somehow, someday, we need just one victory
and we're on our way":
Quote from: GloryDays on November 06, 2023, 05:10:58 PMWhat is this obsession with Caleb, as if he is Joe Burrow?!! I have watched him in a few games and he seems to have some issues, definitely not a top-5 talent, imo.
Which QBs playing in college right now strike you as better?
Quote from: GloryDays on November 06, 2023, 05:10:58 PMWhat is this obsession with Caleb, as if he is Joe Burrow?!! I have watched him in a few games and he seems to have some issues, definitely not a top-5 talent, imo.
He's going to be the #1 pick in the draft unless he gets some sort of debilitating injury. And even then...maybe. So it's not just people here it's across the football world. He's off the charts talented. We'll see what happens in the NFL but there's very little doubt he's going to be the #1 pick to somebody... hopefully the Giants.
Quote from: GloryDays on November 06, 2023, 05:10:58 PMWhat is this obsession with Caleb, as if he is Joe Burrow?!! I have watched him in a few games and he seems to have some issues, definitely not a top-5 talent, imo.
obsession is right .. and wrong. thinking any rookie qb is going to come in and fight the ship is wishful thinking at best
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Quote from: SUPERSEE on November 06, 2023, 08:11:40 PMobsession is right .. and wrong. thinking any rookie qb is going to come in and fight the ship is wishful thinking at best
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Obviously no player at any position is even guaranteed to be a competent starter, let alone to save a franchise.
But some prospects are more promising than others. This guy happens to be one of the more promising QB prospects we have seen in the last couple of years. Could he be a total bust? Of course. But so could anybody. So what?
Franchise QBs turn teams around all the time. If they are the right guy.
Leave it to the Giants to win the last game against a Philly team that is resting everyone and we lose our once again
Quote from: SUPERSEE on November 06, 2023, 08:11:40 PMobsession is right .. and wrong. thinking any rookie qb is going to come in and fight the ship is wishful thinking at best
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Seems to have worked out pretty well for the Texans.
Quote from: LennG on November 06, 2023, 09:08:18 PMLeave it to the Giants to win the last game against a Philly team that is resting everyone and we lose our once again
Yes. And they'll pat themselves on the back about it and talk about "building a winning culture" and how that win will "carry into next year" etc.
Quote from: SUPERSEE on November 06, 2023, 08:11:40 PMobsession is right .. and wrong. thinking any rookie qb is going to come in and fight the ship is wishful thinking at best
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I suspect you're not paying attention to recent NFL trends; drafting the right QB can fundamentally change your teams trajectory. Just off the top of my head:
1. CJ Stroud – In just 8 games, Houston already has one more win than last year and competing for a wildcard.
2. Robert Griffin – Went from 5-11 to 10-6 and a playoff berth; too bad he got injured
3. Cam Newton – Went from 6-10 to 12-4 in a year
4. Justin Herbert – Went from 5-11 to 7-9, 9-8, 10-7
5. Russel Wilson – Went for 7-9 to 11-5 and a playoffs; won a SB a year later
6. Joe Burrow – Went from 2-4 to 10-7 in his first full year as a starter (injured during his rookie year)
7. Anthony Richardson – Was 2-2 on a team that was 4-12-1 last season; they looked very competent before he was injured
8. Mahomes – KC was a good team; however, since Mahomes arrived, the Chiefs have played in 5 straight Championship games and won two SBs, which a big improvements over a teams that could never get past a divisional round
9. Trevor Lawrence – Went from 1-15 to 3-14 to 9-8 (Playoffs); currently on pace for a 13-4 record
10. Andrew Luck - Took a 2-14 team to 11-5 and playoff run.
The game has fundamentally changed; QBs typically demonstrate their abilities after 20-to-26 games. It no longer takes multiple years for QBs to develop; to that point, drafting the right QB can quickly change a team's trajectory.
BTW, what's the alternative, to retain DJ and hope he magically becomes something he's never been in YEAR SIX? IMO, this is an unwise COA.
Quote from: kingm56 on November 07, 2023, 06:45:56 AMBTW, what's the alternative, to retain DJ and hope he magically becomes something he's never been? IMO, this is an unwise COA.
This is the part I'm struggling to understand as well.
Obviously, no QB you draft is a guarantee to be good. Far from it. That's a given and everyone knows that. But that doesn't mean you don't draft one in this situation. What alternative are people suggesting? That we draft a run stuffing defensive tackle 4th overall and roll out a hobbled DJ (who, let's face facts, played terribly this year other than two quarters against one of the two worst teams in football playing without their best defensive player) and Taylor again? Is that really a better plan than taking a shot on one of these top QB prospects after doing our due diligence?
Both the New Jersey Giants and the New Jersey Jets teams have the pleasure of playing football while watching mega-buck quarterbacks standing idly on the sidelines for the rest of the season.
It's a bit like walking to work while Mercedes, Bentleys and Rolls Royce's glide past you.
Regards, and keep the faith.
Quote from: DaveBrown74 on November 06, 2023, 06:32:42 PMWhich QBs playing in college right now strike you as better?
I have not watched more than 8-10 college games, so i can not claim to know who is really good; however, being in LA, I have watched 2 plus a half games of USC. He didn't look great to me.
In the games I watched the TarHeels QB (Maye?) looked very intriguing.
Quote from: MightyGiants on November 06, 2023, 01:02:14 PMI was surprised the Cards traded him. Perhaps Joe was not aware that Dobbs was even on the market.
Rich. I think they are tanking, thats the only thing that makes sense
Anyone still wondering about Dobbs? I believe he has been benched in Minnesota after some horrendous play.
Quote from: Giant Obsession on November 06, 2023, 12:21:29 PM(with apologies to Todd Rungren) explain to me WHY Josh Dobbs was not acquired by the New York Giants last week ??
A 6th round draft choice too expensive ??
His salary ?? Cut some dead wood if you have to.
This once again dysfunctional organization has driven me to eggnog addiction a month ahead of time. AGAIN.
Our ability to judge football talent is off the charts (the bottom)
Can you say 2 - 15 Mr. Mara ??
Maybe we need more captains. 10 is obviously not enough. Everyone knows the more captains you have the better your team must be.
Please I am begging to be enlightened. Are we hoping for another Duke QB savior ??
Funny but I was just at Todd Rundgren's house on Kauai about 3 month's ago for a benefit of the Kauai Humane Society.
Quote from: Philosophers on December 17, 2023, 03:39:53 PMFunny but I was just at Todd Rundgren's house on Kauai about 3 month's ago for a benefit of the Kauai Humane Society.
Did you ring the bell and say Hello It's Me?