- Re-watched the Giants vs Dallas game -

[MightyGiants]

I don't think the Dallas game was DJ's best game.  However, I think that DJ's regular critics have been overly harsh and lacking in fairness.   DJ was throwing against the number 1 pass defense in the NFL.  He was going against the number-one sack defense in the league.  He was doing so with 60% of his O-line being substitutes.  Plus his elite LT was so sick he was masked up when not playing.

In fairness, there were serious questions about Jones making it out of this game in one piece.

Yet, Jones came out of the game with pretty good stats, which would have looked even better had his nice TD pass not been called back on a BS illegal man downfield call.

As for the DJ to Barkley pass, I would put more of that on Barkly than Jones.  Jones could have thrown it a little better, but he was limited by the narrow throwing lane he needed to throw through (I have reviewed the play many times from multiple angles).   The reality is Barkley is not a natural catcher.  His ability as a receiver is more after the catch than making the catch.

So did Jones have a good game?  not really, BUT he did better than the conditions warranted

[Trench]

Nope. Barkley was wide open for a possible game changing TD and Jones choked on the easy throw.

I have been trying to get to a place where he should be our franchise QB...there have been too many instances this year where he has proven he isn't able to be the guy in the big spot - case in point almost every singe 2 minute drill before halftime where he has been nothing short of abysmal.

There is a complete body of work playing out before our very eyes and I can say almost without certainty if he doesn't take a team friendly 2 year deal then he is gone.

[MightyGiants]

Nope. Barkley was wide open for a possible game changing TD and Jones choked on the easy throw.

I have been trying to get to a place where he should be our franchise QB...there have been too many instances this year where he has proven he isn't able to be the guy in the big spot - case in point almost every singe 2 minute drill before halftime where he has been nothing short of abysmal.

There is a complete body of work playing out before our very eyes and I can say almost without certainty if he doesn't take a team friendly 2 year deal then he is gone.

When it comes to a polarizing figure like DJ, I try to separate the conclusion from the process.   When a fan professes to know what is going on in a player's head (in this case, "panic"), we see a flawed process, in my opinion.  Regardless of one's conclusions on Jones (or lack there of) we should at least strive for a sound process.

[Jclayton92]

We have a fine QB with all the personal tools but the team still lacks what a QB needs to perform at a high level.. this is obvious as even most Giants critics acknowledge that he is playing well, even yesterday, but somehow NY fans are weirdly critical of their players and unjustly blame Jones.

His QBR is telling us another story. It's year 4 we have to be done with the excuses and having a below 40 QBR in half our games is not good enough. His decision making isn't sound, and it's not getting better.

[Trench]

Mighty - to your point about "knowing what is going on in a players head" I point everyone to Coach Parcells interview on Michael Kay Show 2 weeks ago when asked about analytics and stats. He said the problem with analytics is "analytics don't know if it's Reggie White standing across from you or not"

Guts and "the it" factor loom large. Let's look at McConkey. He had the "it" factor. Let's look at Jim Burt also had "the it" factor. Dave Megget "the it factor"...Mario Manningham "the it" factor. Eli above all had "the it" factor.

We have not seen the "it factor" on Jones. And that is ok. He is what he is and that's an easy guy to root for of which we all are. 

[MightyGiants]

His QBR is telling us another story. It's year 4 we have to be done with the excuses and having a below 40 QBR in half our games is not good enough. His decision making isn't sound, and it's not getting better.

I talked about seperating process vs conclusion when it comes to Jones in another thread.  In this case the flawed process is taking DJ being ranked 10th in QBR and cherry picking data to spin that as a bad thing.

[MightyGiants]

Mighty - to your point about "knowing what is going on in a players head" I point everyone to Coach Parcells interview on Michael Kay Show 2 weeks ago when asked about analytics and stats. He said the problem with analytics is "analytics don't know if it's Reggie White standing across from you or not"

Guts and "the it" factor loom large. Let's look at McConkey. He had the "it" factor. Let's look at Jim Burt also had "the it" factor. Dave Megget "the it factor"...Mario Manningham "the it" factor. Eli above all had "the it" factor.

We have not seen the "it factor" on Jones. And that is ok. He is what he is and that's an easy guy to root for of which we all are.

We have witnessed the "it" factor in all those come from behind wins

[Trench]

Nobody is cherry picking. In my opinion that is a term people use to try to dismiss a difference of opinion.

[Trench]

We have witnessed the "it" factor in all those come from behind wins

Not with his throwing arm we haven't.

With his legs, I can get on board with you yes. But in order to give the green light he has to check ALL the boxes. So far he hasn't showed he is able to match the field in a minute and a half using his arm. There have been games all year at the half where he had such a chance and couldn't muster it

[Trench]

I want this guy to be our guy. But unfortunately he hasn't shown he can do it. Also on the docket and yet to be played out is can he remain healthy?

[Trench]

When it comes to a polarizing figure like DJ, I try to separate the conclusion from the process.   When a fan professes to know what is going on in a player's head (in this case, "panic"), we see a flawed process, in my opinion.  Regardless of one's conclusions on Jones (or lack there of) we should at least strive for a sound process.

An interesting question that I would ask - why and what is it would you say that makes Daniel Jones "polarizing"?

[Jclayton92]

I talked about seperating process vs conclusion when it comes to Jones in another thread.  In this case the flawed process is taking DJ being ranked 10th in QBR and cherry picking data to spin that as a bad thing.

Rich you paraded his QBR every week it's been decent, any time it's horribley you'll do an oline or Barkley thread right after the game, every game. How is saying his QBR has been horrible In half the games cherry picking when its literally half the games?

[Giantleap56]

As I watched the game. I missed all of the third as I was driving to Thanksgiving dinner. But here is my take the TD that was called back was a bogus call. And before halftime the Giants were not aggressive instead of playing to punch the ball into the end zone they played for the FG. To me that was the game instead of playing to win they played not to lose.

Refs were not very good felt CD was getting to many calls, all he had to do is flail his arms and refs threw the flag. In the other end KT was held a lot but bo calls there. There were some outright tackles by Dallas OL they didn't even bother to call.

I hate to say this but Barkley has hit a wall. That 35 carries has taken its toll on him. Maybe this week will revitalize him with extra time to heal.

[expatriot]

To me, arguments can go back and forth on Jones all day long.  He's a classic tweener...size, speed good enough arm, but has a bunch of bad habits and needs guys all around him to be a winner.  Guys defend him like he's a family member.  For me its kind of simple, when we really need him to make a play, when it is on the line ...does he do it?  The proverbial "it" factor...I just don't see that in Jones. He misses the simple five yarder, cant get the first down, he holds the ball too long...something....that's why I am not that in on Jones...hard to explain, even harder to quantify, I know.  It's just that little something that if I saw 'it' enough I could exhale...it's like, 'ok I got this'. Still waiting for that guy.

[expatriot]

I should have read more of the comments ...saw the 'it' factor after I posted....