Big Blue Huddle

Rangers fans were WAY too optimistic after the first three games of the series.  All were one goal wins, and two in OT.  Taking nothing away from the Rangers, as they did win, but they were not dominant in any way. 

Starting in game three especially, the Canes played with a ton of energy, purpose, and desperation.  As you would expect.  Rangers matched them pretty well in game three and won.  Didn't match them nearly as well in game four, but again, you would expect that a team down 0-3 would have a ton more energy and desperation.  And a team up 3-0 might let up a bit (even though you never should take your foot off your opponent's neck, but alas, we are human too).  Even so, except for a late penalty, we could have won.

Once they lost their first game of the playoffs, I then expected game five to have them come out looking to obliterate the Canes and for the garden to be rocking.  Neither happened.  The garden seemed quiet all night (maybe it was the ESPN audio, who knows) and the Rangers were completely listless.  Zero energy, zero offensive pressure.  I don't remember one shot on goal, except the Trouba shorty, that was a high danger shot.  And ZERO physicality, except for the Trouba hit.  This is not the old Rangers teams from the past that were small and pushed around.  Kreider, Trocheck, LaFren, Cuylle, Vesey, Rempe, Goodrow, Lindgren, Schneider, Trouba... all bigger / chippier / willing to mix it up guys, and virtually NONE were to be seen.  If the Canes want to dump and chase and hit the Rangers D, not to mention take some liberties, then I expect these guys to stand up and pummel them into the boards.  But they are letting the Canes be physical with them and have zero pushback.

This team BETTER be flying in Game 6.  Better be hitting everything that moves.  Better be driving play.  The time is now for them to be desperate, aggressive, angry.  Because this is very close to a winner take all game seven, and after the third period last night, the Canes believe 100% they can win this.  Including that arrogant punk ass DeAngelo.  Time to take care of business.... and this will be just a blip.  That this was a good thing for them to get punched in the mouth and have some adversity to overcome... better to have that when you are up 3-0 than in the next round when you don't have as much cushion.  But this team needs a leader and I am not sure we have someone that can even partially emulate Messier and get them through this.

Sorry for the length of this..... I needed to vent.

Quote from: Trench on Today at 10:31:50 AMPFF = Click bait

It's not just PFF.  You'd be hard pressed to find a projected 2024 ranking of o-lines that doesn't have the Giants in the bottom 5.  I've looked.

Quote from: Ed Vette on Today at 10:56:25 AMMaybe you haven't capitulated but I'm done with all the excuses. I supported his draft pick because he was the best QB to choose from. 2 years later it was obvious what we had, 6 years later I see him here the next two years or more. He's going to need a top-ten Oline to thrive here. Otherwise, it's dink and dunk, dink and dunk... freeze and duck, freeze and duck. I'm very disappointed in this regime right now. Maybe after a few wins, I'll be in a better mood. Unless of course, the schedule is a 2023 killer to start the season, the oline fails, he get injured through no fault of the Oline and the Defense fails to defend. Did I miss anything? 

PFF Rankings

year -- Pass blocking --- receiving
2023 -- 32nd -- 32nd
2022 -- 24th -- 27th
2021 -- 30th -- 31st
2020 -- 32nd -- 25th
2019 -- 16th -- 17th

The best DJ had was his rookie season when his on-field support was slightly below the mean.  The rest of the time DJ has had bottom 3rd (and even dead last) support both in protection and receiving.

I don't see how, from that data, we can conclude that DJ needs "top 10" to be effective.  I think accusations of making excuses hide the unrealistic expectations of those making the accusations.

DJ is like a car you stumble across with two flat tires.  The engine starts, but that's all you can learn about the car because you can't drive it with two flats.  Now, it's possible that once you fix the flats, it will turn out that the transmission is shot, and the car is still useless.  However, until you fix the flat tires, there is no way to know what the car fully does.  That's what you have with DJ.  Until you give him half a chance, you can't say with any certainty what you have.

Quote from: Ed Vette on May 13, 2024, 03:54:19 PMI all comes down to positional responsibilities. The 3/4 Mike has more coverage responsibilities and the 3/4 Edge do not. That's why I separate the LB's from the DLine. I am curious if Thibs and Burn have the sand in their pants to transition to DE responsibility. If so, the Giants are a 3 Tech away. Simmons would be my Will and McFadden my Sam.

Ed,

I get your point, and I think Thibs and Burns are going to spend considerable more time trying to be get in the backfield then in coverage.  I could be wrong, but from what Daboll has said about being more of an "attacking" defense, I am guessing those guys will be deployed mostly as penetrators. 

Burns did not grade out as a good run defender which, for me, is why your question/point is a good one. 

I can't help but see another Buffalo similarity here.  Buffalo's DL likes to get up field and disrupt.  And they have mostly been good at it.  Seems like that's the direction Daboll wants this D to go.

Quote from: AZGiantFan on Today at 11:06:21 AMIt's not a question of capitulation.  I'm not even a big Jones supporter.  What I am is an opponent of putting all of the blame for being disappointed with the regime for the the last 6, hell 10, years on his his shoulders and the ridiculousness of calling the sea of incompetence he's has to swim in excuses.  There is a difference between excuses and explanations.

Actually there are no excuses for the 30th ranked Defense, A failed Oline since 2013 and stupid GM decisions like drafting a RB with the second pick of the draft. How about an involved owner? The difference here is that these Jones lovers take his criticisms personally for some reason. Sometimes ya just gotta admit you were wrong. Mark my words, Jones will win games as I always said he could and be a better Regular season QB than Eli, and then choke in the playoffs.

Quote from: Painter on Today at 10:47:41 AMA savvy analysis and questioning, Ed. In any event, we should expect to see a different approach to Defense from Shane Bowen who, while more Zone-orientated on the back end, has had much more success against the run than did Wink. Still, as you suggest, it can be as much a question of personnel as of positioning.

It may be a while before we get an answer in that regard, but it will still be time better spent wondering about Burns and Thibodeaux than it is for those among us who seem unable to stop hating on Daniel Jones.

Cheers!

 

My question is will his defense do a much better job of stopping the run.  As horrifically bad as the o-line was in 2023 the run defense wasn't much better.

Quote from: Philosophers on Today at 10:30:35 AMPick whatever names you want.  Kevin Boss, Billy Ard, Jim Burt, etc.  The point is mid-late round picks who developed and became good starting players.

Well I would start with actual Giants mid-round picks and not FAs or 2nd round picks.   Sorry if my point upset you.

I also feel like when Reese was GM fans weren't calling it a development issue but a drafting issue.  He had a streak of poor 3rd rounders that never contributed and I don't recall anyone saying it was development.

There is one factor over the last 10 years that I think has probably had an effect on development - the carousel of coaching changes.  Players drafted in the mid to late rounds are drafted with a development plan in mind.  When their is new coaches in place 2 years later, they won't look at that player the same or have a role in mind for them. 

Quote from: Ed Vette on Today at 10:56:25 AMMaybe you haven't capitulated but I'm done with all the excuses. I supported his draft pick because he was the best QB to choose from. 2 years later it was obvious what we had, 6 years later I see him here the next two years or more. He's going to need a top-ten Oline to thrive here. Otherwise, it's dink and dunk, dink and dunk... freeze and duck, freeze and duck. I'm very disappointed in this regime right now. Maybe after a few wins, I'll be in a better mood. Unless of course, the schedule is a 2023 killer to start the season, the oline fails, he get injured through no fault of the Oline and the Defense fails to defend. Did I miss anything?   

It's not a question of capitulation.  I'm not even a big Jones supporter.  What I am is an opponent of putting all of the blame for being disappointed with the regime for the the last 6, hell 10, years on his his shoulders and the ridiculousness of calling the sea of incompetence he's has to swim in excuses.  There is a difference between excuses and explanations.

Quote from: MightyGiants on Today at 09:31:48 AMFor years, the Giants have substituted hope for plans when it comes to the O-line, and unfortunately, this year is no different.  The Giants hope Evan Neal can significantly improve (at least they have Eluemunor if Neal fails).  The Giants hope JMS can play significantly better than he did last season.  The Giants hope they can find a quality second guard to team with Runyan.

If hope succeeds and the new O-line coach proves to be a difference maker, this unit has a ceiling of average to high average.  Should it turn out that Bobby Johnson was unfairly blamed or both Neal and JMS don't significantly improve, this unit could be at or near the bottom again (especially if injury-prone Thomas misses significant time).

Let's not also forget the new strength and conditioning staff, led by Aaron Wellman, Frank Piraino and Drew Wilson running the show behind the scenes. They are cognizant of the injury history of this team and have already put action plans into place in order to address them and, hopefully, correct and prevent them going forward.

Peace!