Banks on Daniel Jones

[MightyGiants]

Carl Banks routinely talks with Giants coaches, so he speaks as a man who knows things (but will not directly report his inside knowledge)


"I am, for transparency, a big Daniel Jones fan. But I will be the first to say that he took a step back this past year," Banks told Mail Sport.

"But I'll also add context to that and say, I can understand why. His offensive line was awful. He took so many hits early. And people don't want to understand that quarterbacks under duress — and I would challenge any individual who just continues to criticize the effectiveness of a quarterback who continues to get hit, I would challenge you to stand anywhere and get hit by a 2×4, about five times in a row and see if you can make great decisions."

The Giants' offensive line surrendered 85 sacks this past season, the second-most in NFL history. And all three of the team's quarterbacks — Jones, Tyrod Taylor, and Tommy DeVito — suffered injuries as a result of the porous line. It was undeniably a factor in the poor quarterback play.

"It does impair your decision-making because I was one of those guys who was doing that to quarterbacks, so I know how it impacts them," Banks said. "But he has to play better when he gets healthy. He will have to resume where he was starting to ascend to, and if he doesn't, they're gonna move on."

https://giantswire.usatoday.com/2024/02/04/carl-banks-new-york-giants-daniel-jones-has-to-play-better-2024/?taid=65bf6f9250540e000111f0af&utm_campaign=trueanthem&utm_medium=trueanthem&utm_source=twitter

[DaveBrown74]

I think if anyone is going to try to make conciliatory statements about Jones' season by passing the buck to the supporting cast, it is not particularly interesting unless they explain why the other two QBs on the roster, both of whom make either a very small or, in DeVito's case, a very tiny fraction of what Jones makes, were both clearly better than Jones in 2023 with the same teammates Jones had.

[EDjohnst1981]

I would be more than interested in hearing about, in detail, the "step back" last year.

Rather than repeating the same stuff re: the line.

Yes, the line was awful. But also, what's ignored, despite it being raised, was how DJ walked into/created some sacks himself. The Seattle game was an example. 11 of which but 5 or 6 according to a PFF podcast were created by Jones, rather than the line.

It's always the fault of someone else.

[katkavage]

We all love C Banks, but he is in the bubble just like we are. I value more opinions of outsiders whose vision are not clouded by their loyalty to their team. The offensive line excuse is a broken record. That is not to say they weren't terrible, but there comes a time when you, who are making an enormous amount of money, need to rise above the flaws of others. It never happened.

[MightyGiants]

I think if anyone is going to try to make conciliatory statements about Jones' season by passing the buck to the supporting cast, it is not particularly interesting unless they explain why the other two QBs on the roster, both of whom make either a very small or, in DeVito's case, a very tiny fraction of what Jones makes, were both clearly better than Jones in 2023 with the same teammates Jones had.

@EDjohnst1981 @Doc16LT56 @katkavage

If you are going to make a claim about other QBs being clearly better than Jones, one should do the homework and compare the performances of QBs along with the performance. of their supporting casts (as you dismissed supporting cast claims by Banks).

I did the homework, and frankly, the claims about the other QBs being "clearly better" simply don't hold up.

https://giantsfans.net/message_board/index.php?topic=68971.0

[gregf]

85 sacks this past season, the second-most in NFL history

We should be able to get a solid guard at 39.  Evan Neal at tackle is the 2nd biggest decision after QB in my view.  Do we pluck a tackle at 6 ( if top 3 qb not on board) or grab WR?  I expect we will address the o line in FA and rd 2. 

[MightyGiants]

85 sacks this past season, the second-most in NFL history

We should be able to get a solid guard at 39.  Evan Neal at tackle is the 2nd biggest decision after QB in my view.  Do we pluck a tackle at 6 ( if top 3 qb not on board) or grab WR?  I expect we will address the o line in FA and rd 2.

This is where the new O-line coach is going to earn his pay.  He will need to tell the team if Neal can become an NFL caliber RT or if he needs to move to guard (and hopefully improve)

[katkavage]

This is where the new O-line coach is going to earn his pay.  He will need to tell the team if Neal can become an NFL caliber RT or if he needs to move to guard (and hopefully improve)

The O line can be addressed and fixed concurrently with improving the QB position as well.

[MightyGiants]

The O line can be addressed and fixed concurrently with improving the QB position as well.

This claim may or may not be true.  If there is a QB 4 that the Giants can draft that is a franchise QB, then yes, you can hopefully fix both.  If, on the other hand, the Giants need one of the elite 3, they will either need to pay a king's ransom to move up (in which case they will not have the draft capital to fix the line), or they can't trade up (in which case they don't improve QB).

[Doc16LT56]

Carl Banks has no credibility when it comes to the Giants players. If he's so down on the OL he should start naming names. Is he ready to criticize Evan Neal and JMS or is he not allowed to do so just yet.

[DaveBrown74]

@EDjohnst1981 @Doc16LT56 @katkavage

If you are going to make a claim about other QBs being clearly better than Jones, one should do the homework and compare the performances of QBs along with the performance. of their supporting casts (as you dismissed supporting cast claims by Banks).

I did the homework, and frankly, the claims about the other QBs being "clearly better" simply don't hold up.

https://giantsfans.net/message_board/index.php?topic=68971.0

I watched all the games. I know what I saw.

You can squint your eyes and try to parse it any way you want, but the bottom line is they all played with the same supporting cast, and the other two each put up objectively better numbers. There is no getting around that. 

With Jones making $40mm per and the other two being an aging, career journeyman backup and an undrafted walk-on who wasn't even that good in college, it frankly shouldn't have been remotely close.

I'm kind of done with the Jones debates. We're going into year six with him for crying out loud. It has been pure hell. Or at least it has been for any Giants fan whose primary concern is winning and not a personal agenda with a specific player. Anyone who wants to continue to cling to Jones is obviously entitled to do so, but the writing is on the wall. And it's not just because he can't stay on the field.

[katkavage]

This claim may or may not be true.  If there is a QB 4 that the Giants can draft that is a franchise QB, then yes, you can hopefully fix both.  If, on the other hand, the Giants need one of the elite 3, they will either need to pay a king's ransom to move up (in which case they will not have the draft capital to fix the line), or they can't trade up (in which case they don't improve QB).

We shall see what the Giants' GM does this off season. His decisions this off season could determine the fate of his head coach and his own tenure. He has much on the line.

[MightyGiants]

Carl Banks has no credibility when it comes to the Giants players. If he's so down on the OL he should start naming names. Is he ready to criticize Evan Neal and JMS or is he not allowed to do so just yet.

Banks has a great deal of credibility with me.  First, I understand what Banks' situation is, so I understand what he can and can't say.  I also appreciate if you can listen with that in mind, there is a great deal of insider information and insights that can be gained.

It's like listening to the two beat reporters who act as Giants' mouthpieces; if you know how to interpret what they say, there is a great deal of value.

[Doc16LT56]

Banks has a great deal of credibility with me.  First, I understand what Banks' situation is, so I understand what he can and can't say.  I also appreciate if you can listen with that in mind, there is a great deal of insider information and insights that can be gained.

It's like listening to the two beat reporters who act as Giants' mouthpieces; if you know how to interpret what they say, there is a great deal of value.

Banks is Pat Hanlon with actual football knowledge. Listen to him and understand he is in the business of selling you on the team rather than teaching you anything.

[MightyGiants]

Banks is Pat Hanlon with actual football knowledge. Listen to him and understand he is in the business of selling you on the team rather than teaching you anything.

It sounds like you haven't listened to Banks all that much.  I listen to all his podcasts and follow his Twitter and he isn't even remotely like Pat Hanlon