Banks on Daniel Jones

[Doc16LT56]

I'm kind of done with the Jones debates. We're going into year six with him for crying out loud. It has been pure hell. Or at least it has been for any Giants fan whose primary concern is winning and not a personal agenda with a specific player.

Yep. QB hell to be exact.

[Doc16LT56]

It sounds like you haven't listened to Banks all that much.  I listen to all his podcasts and follow his Twitter and he isn't even remotely like Pat Hanlon

That tracks.

[MightyGiants]

Banks is Pat Hanlon with actual football knowledge. Listen to him and understand he is in the business of selling you on the team rather than teaching you anything.

Also, Pat Hanlon went silent years ago.  He found his brash style didn't mesh well with social media.  Hanlon is another example of Mara's valuing loyalty over competency.   The whole fiasco with Wink showed the Giants' PR chops were sorely lacking, yet Hanlon still collects his salary as VP of Communications

[MightyGiants]

That tracks.

Thank you, I pride myself on how much football and Giants information I gather on a weekly basis (with proper consideration to the biases and limitations of the sources).

[Brooklyn Dave]

This claim may or may not be true.  If there is a QB 4 that the Giants can draft that is a franchise QB, then yes, you can hopefully fix both.  If, on the other hand, the Giants need one of the elite 3, they will either need to pay a king's ransom to move up (in which case they will not have the draft capital to fix the line), or they can't trade up (in which case they don't improve QB).

Maybe I am in the minority or maybe not but the Giants should target Joe Alt with the number 6 pick, move Neal to left Guard where he would play next to Andrew Thomas, sign a right guard in free agency , hopefully Phillips can come back and sign him for depth.

I know there is love for Nabers, Odunze etc for our pick , but Jones is going to be the QB in 2024, if he is ready medically, and see what he can do with a decent OL . Most likely  McConkey, Walker, Franklin, MItchell , Legette will be available in the second round as well as possibly a QB .

We can live without a number 1 receiver but we cannot live without a decent OL and that is where our priorities should lie, in the draft and in FA.

This is just one person's opinion which is worth or worthless as anyones opinion

[Ed Vette]

I'm not so sure the Giants pick a QB in the first round but if Nix or McCarthy drop low enough, I can see them trading up from the second or if either falls, I can see them pick. Still, it's very possible they don't and just continue to build the team. If you read into Carl's language, it's in line with Schoen's comments. There is tremendous respect for Jones and the organization wants him to succeed as the face of the franchise. I don't know what the heck happened to Jones in 2023 to fall so far even in consideration of the poor protection and absence of a Run Game. It all just overwhelmed him. As for TT and TD, TT has years more experience in different situations so his quick game helped him and TD did have a better version of that Oline. As for the sacks? The % that TD absorbed was a contributing factor to that near record setting number from his initial starts.

Keep an eye on the 2025 Class.

[MightyGiants]

I'm not so sure the Giants pick a QB in the first round but if Nix or McCarthy drop low enough, I can see them trading up from the second or if either falls, I can see them pick. Still, it's very possible they don't and just continue to build the team. If you read into Carl's language, it's in line with Schoen's comments. There is tremendous respect for Jones and the organization wants him to succeed as the face of the franchise. I don't know what the heck happened to Jones in 2023 to fall so far even in consideration of the poor protection and absence of a Run Game. It all just overwhelmed him. As for TT and TD, TT has years more experience in different situations so his quick game helped him and TD did have a better version of that Oline. As for the sacks? The % that TD absorbed was a contributing factor to that near record setting number from his initial starts.

Keep an eye on the 2025 Class.

It's sort of funny the fans and pundits, who were previously strong critics, were quick to hop on the Jones is the bust train last season.

If you take a step back, Schoen and Daboll spent all of 2022 evaluating Jones.  Jones essentially played in 5 games, with 3 being terrible, one against the Dolphins being pretty good, and he had an elite performance against the Cardinals.  So, after spending an entire season (plus a second training camp) evaluating Jones, was it really realistic to think the team would do a 180 on their views of Jones for just three really poor games under the worst conditions?

My belief as to the need to move on from Jones is the injury issues are just too much for me.  However, the Giants don't seem to care about injury-prone.  If they did, they never would have traded for Waller.

[Ed Vette]

It's sort of funny the fans and pundits, who were previously strong critics, were quick to hope on the Jones is the bust train last season.

If you take a step back, Schoen and Daboll spent all of 2022 evaluating Jones.  Jones essentially played in 5 games, with 3 being terrible, one against the Dolphins being pretty good, and he had an elite performance against the Cardinals.  So, after spending an entire season (plus a second training camp) evaluating Jones, was it really realistic to think the team would do a 180 on their views of Jones for just three really poor games under the worst conditions?

My belief as to the need to move on from Jones is the injury issues are just too much for me.  However, the Giants don't seem to care about injury-prone.  If they did, they never would have traded for Waller.

Let's see how this devastating injury affects Jones ability to run. That's a factor. Although his propensity to missing games goes against the grain of dependability.

[MightyGiants]

Let's see how this devastating injury affects Jones ability to run. That's a factor. Although his propensity to missing games goes against the grain of dependability.

That will be interesting. There have been plenty (like Barkley) who lose something after a major injury.  On the other side WonDale didn't seem worse for wear when he came back from his ACL.

[sooners56]

Jones is an injury prone QB that can't be relied on to stay healthy and when healthy, he isn't exactly lighting it up! A backup plan at the QB position should be at the top of the to do list. No matter what Banks or anyone else thinks/says.

[Ed Vette]

Jones is an injury prone QB that can't be relied on to stay healthy and when healthy, he isn't exactly lighting it up! A backup plan at the QB position should be at the top of the to do list. No matter what Banks or anyone else thinks/says.

Good point. It only matters what you think/say.

[Ed Vette]

Good point. It only matters what you think/say.

I should add that it applies to everyone. We all pretty much believe our own perspective really counts. Lol

[Jclayton92]

Good point. It only matters what you think/say.

Genuinely curious on your takes on these questions.

Did NFL teams figure Jones out last year which amplified the poor play we saw last season?

The lack of a deep game has been an ongoing issue for Jones in the Daboll Era, and it's not the offense because we see TT and TD take those shots, so why doesn't Jones take those?

What did Daboll/Schoen see in Jones in 2022 that didn't translate to 2023 and why did it not translate despite adding weapons.

I think this is just a couple of the questions the organization need to figure out before deciding what's next at QB1.

[Trench]

@EDjohnst1981 @Doc16LT56 @katkavage

If you are going to make a claim about other QBs being clearly better than Jones, one should do the homework and compare the performances of QBs along with the performance. of their supporting casts (as you dismissed supporting cast claims by Banks).

I did the homework, and frankly, the claims about the other QBs being "clearly better" simply don't hold up.

https://giantsfans.net/message_board/index.php?topic=68971.0

Tyrod and Devito won more games. They moved the ball downfield better and consistently. They certainly did not panic with the same frequency as Jones who was deer in the headlights all season long. Not even close.

[Ed Vette]

Genuinely curious on yiur takes on these questions.

Did NFL teams figure Jones out last year which amplified the poor play we saw last season?
Yes, it was a factor to some extent. So was the play calling.

The lack of a deep game has been an ongoing issue for Jones in the Daboll Era, and it's not the offense because we see TT and TD take those shots, so why doesn't Jones take those?
He is not good under pressure and is prone to freezing up and either escaping the pocket prematurely, or is slow in processing the break from containment or the play's call progression was to read short to long.

What did Daboll/Schoen see in Jones in 2022 that didn't translate to 2023 and why did it not translate despite adding weapons.
The Offensive Line had multiple injuries with poor backups and the players were not prepared to start the season at the same intensity level as Dallas, which had a psychological effect on the entire team. They were expecting a potent Offense with all the weapons they brought in.

I think this is just a couple of the questions the organization need to figure out before deciding what's next at QB1.