Giants May Not Be Ready to Move On From DJ

[Ed Vette]

Ed: I think you know I already have it. lol

Regardless, on 95% of the plays when Hyatt is open, breaking into the open, or about to break into the open, the QB has already been sacked, or flushed out of the pocket, or has his first reads on the other side of the field.

There have been very few situations in which none of that was true and a golden opportunity was missed SOLELY due to QB error, QB reluctance, or QB ineptitude.  In short, if all three QB's are missing golden opportunities it says more about mindset implanted in the QB by the coaching than the identity of the QB.

Bob

There have been accuracy and timing issues and the QB has to have a leap of faith on some plays before he gets sacked. When it's one one-on-one, Hyatt will get open and he has a nice catch radius with good hands. The ball just needs to be placed properly. I recall at least two catches where Hyatt had to slow down or adjust to make the catch. Other times the pass was behind him on a crosser or a slant, short or outside when he had inside leverage. I've seen him run several different routes and the hype that he can't is just not completely accurate. I also have seen him block well downfield. Bob, I saw many instances this past weekend where the QB just put it up for his Receiver to make the contested catch. I almost feel bad for the kid that this team drafted him.

[Bob In PA]

It's time to move on, it doesn't matter if you thought he was the next Tom Brady or the next Brock Osweiler. He is clearly not the answer, it is just disappointing that it took 60+ games and we are still at a point were people think it's a good idea to continue trotting that kid out to play.

J: No one here is fighting to keep Jones & no one I know of ever thought he had a chance to be among the elite.

The question has always been (here) if he could be "good enough" to win anything.  Last year, he won something.

Optical illusion or not, it happened, despite lack of good OL play and lack of a good 4-man pass rush (two of the things every good team seems to have nowadays). So IMO that accomplishment (even against the Vikings) is nothing to be sneezed it. 

I still think he can drive a Ferrari. Like the vast majority, I never thought he could pull an Edsel.

The in-between question (hard to answer) is whether he would help or hurt and developing team. Since IMO we still lack maybe 25% of the other 21 players needed to make a legitimate starting squad, it's really a really hard question to answer.  Many of us are sure enough to answer that question today. I'm not, and IMO neither are the Giants big-wigs.

Bob

[Bob In PA]

There have been accuracy and timing issues and the QB has to have a leap of faith on some plays before he gets sacked. When it's one one-on-one, Hyatt will get open and he has a nice catch radius with good hands. The ball just needs to be placed properly. I recall at least two catches where Hyatt had to slow down or adjust to make the catch. Other times the pass was behind him on a crosser or a slant, short or outside when he had inside leverage. I've seen him run several different routes and the hype that he can't is just not completely accurate. I also have seen him block well downfield. Bob, I saw many instances this past weekend where the QB just put it up for his Receiver to make the contested catch. I almost feel bad for the kid that this team drafted him.

Ed: Can't argue with any of that. My biggest Jones complaint is accuracy.

Agree Hyatt can run any route they want. I don't discount his ability, I just don't see a truly elite guy YET.

I also saw this weekend's games and agree. Niice to have a lead and/or play with an established elite WR or two.

Bob

PS. Does the QB make a WR "elite"? Or does an elite WR makes the QB look good? Both? Neither? I believe with the right tools even an undrafted free-agent (that would be Kurt Warner) can win a championship or two.

[Jolly Blue Giant]

"I still think he can drive a Ferrari. Like the vast majority, I never thought he could pull an Edsel."

LOL...might be the best line I've ever read on this board

[Ed Vette]

Ed: Can't argue with any of that. My biggest Jones complaint is accuracy.

Agree Hyatt can run any route they want. I don't discount his ability, I just don't see a truly elite guy YET.

I also saw this weekend's games and agree. Niice to have a lead and/or play with an established elite WR or two.

Bob

PS. Does the QB make a WR "elite"? Or does an elite WR makes the QB look good? Both? Neither? I believe with the right tools even an undrafted free-agent (that would be Kurt Warner) can win a championship or two.

Both. We won't see what this kid is capable of until he gets targets.

[Bob In PA]

Both. We won't see what this kid is capable of until he gets targets.

Ed: No one wants to see that happen more than I do.  Each week I wait for it and each week I'm disappointed.

Some people see the QB's as being overly cautious (whether it's just them, or the coaches' instructions to them). 
Others see ALL three QB's (Taylor the least so, I suppose) "playing scared." 

Regardless, now that there's no doubt this season is a disaster, maybe the coaches will "turn them loose" or the QB's will grow a pair... in either of which cases we'll get our wish. lol

Bob

[LennG]

 I know basically nothing about college football and only get whatever info from here. That said, looking at the prospects for next year, I go with name only--Rattler. What could be a better name for a QB than that? Sort of like Ken 'the snake' Stabler. We could only wish he could be that.

Rattler gets my vote, No other reason than a great name.

[LennG]

Bob

 You have mentioned WR more than several times. Probably would be a great draft pick, but even combined with Hyatt, who is going to get him the ball?
Would that liken to Barkely in a way that we have basically wasted his career on a middling team> If Barkley played for a winning team he might be in contention for a gold jacket in the future. Instead, we wasted what was the best RB we have had in ages, and for what? Do you want to do the same with that WR?

[Jclayton92]

J: No one here is fighting to keep Jones & no one I know of ever thought he had a chance to be among the elite.

The question has always been (here) if he could be "good enough" to win anything.  Last year, he won something.

Optical illusion or not, it happened, despite lack of good OL play and lack of a good 4-man pass rush (two of the things every good team seems to have nowadays). So IMO that accomplishment (even against the Vikings) is nothing to be sneezed it. 

I still think he can drive a Ferrari. Like the vast majority, I never thought he could pull an Edsel.

The in-between question (hard to answer) is whether he would help or hurt and developing team. Since IMO we still lack maybe 25% of the other 21 players needed to make a legitimate starting squad, it's really a really hard question to answer.  Many of us are sure enough to answer that question today. I'm not, and IMO neither are the Giants big-wigs.

Bob

The problem is that Good enough, or even good Qb play won't win in the modern NFL. It's a different sport now than it was when Eli went on his runs. Now you either have Elite Qb play or your not in the conversation whatsoever and won't be. Yes a team might get lucky and make it to a playoff game, win one, and then be done but there won't be any longterm sustained success over a length of time without an Elite Qb.

[GloryDays]

I think due to his salary cap, we should keep him for at least next year. If we wanna spend our first on a new QB fine, but the number one task should be to fix the O line (new scouts and coach) so the rookie has a chance too. Let DJ compete with the new kid behind a decent line. Then at the very least, he has trade value also.

[Uni]

I think due to his salary cap, we should keep him for at least next year. If we wanna spend our first on a new QB fine, but the number one task should be to fix the O line (new scouts and coach) so the rookie has a chance too. Let DJ compete with the new kid behind a decent line. Then at the very least, he has trade value also.

We would have to trade DJ PLUS a draft pick to get some team with lots of cap space to take on his salary. This can't even be done until 2025 anyway because of the dead money, but no one will trade for him because he will be cut after 2024 anyway. Unless Gettleman ends up a GM somewhere, maybe he would do something real dumb like that

[kingm56]

I think due to his salary cap, we should keep him for at least next year. If we wanna spend our first on a new QB fine, but the number one task should be to fix the O line (new scouts and coach) so the rookie has a chance too. Let DJ compete with the new kid behind a decent line. Then at the very least, he has trade value also.

As UNI perfectly articulated, DJ has zero trade value as his production over 60 games, relative to his salary, offers a terrible return on any team's investment. 

[DaveBrown74]

Agreed on the trade value. I am confident nobody would take him off our hands right now at his full contract, even if they could do it for literally zero in return (ie not even give us a 7th round pick). I think we all know that not a soul would touch that contract. He will definitely be a Giant in 2024 unless we trade him and eat a huge portion of it, which they're simply not going to do. So it's correct that we're not going to "move on from Daniel Jones" in 2024. Whether we want to or not, we can't. Simple as that.

[StompYouOT]

This article is hilarious suggesting The Giants haven't seen enough to evaluate Jones.  Are you serious??  Do they need 10 years?  He's not it.

If they pass on a QB it's not about Jones, it can only be about the prospect pool.  QBs bust.  Don't waste the pick on a guy who will only make it worse, if that's even possible.  I want Maye or Pennix.  If things don't work out perfectly or they don't like the QBs enough then trade back and add more talent that way.  We're gonna be bad again next year most likely. 

[AZGiantFan]

All but 4 likely come out this year. 2025 will be a horrible draft for Qbs. likely a 1 man show with Aller as none of those other guys are any good.

I kind of wonder why these guys will come out early under the new rules.  They aren't going to get picked in the prime draft spots because the 'regular' 2024 QB class is as strong as it is.  And getting picked moderately high because the regular 2024 guys got picked before them will cost them millions in their rookie contract.

Here is how the slotting worked for 2023:
No. 1: $41.2 million
No. 2: $39.4 million
No. 3: $38.2 million
No. 4: $36.9 million
No. 5: $34.5 million
No. 6: $30.4 million
No. 7: $27.02 million
No. 8: $23.7 million
No. 9: $23.5 million
No. 10: $22.6 million
No. 11: $21.2 million
No. 12: $19.2 million
No. 13: $18.7 million
No. 14: $17.8 million
No. 15: $17.5 million
No. 16: $16.5 million
No. 17: $16.2 million
No. 18: $15.7 million
No. 19: $15.5 million
No. 20: $15.4 million
No. 21: $15.3 million
No. 22: $15.2 million
No. 23: $14.99 million
No. 24: $14.7 million
No. 25: $14.5 million
No. 26: $14.3 million
No. 27: $14.16 million
No. 28: $14.07 million
No. 29: $13.4 million
No. 30: $13.05 million
No. 31: $12.75 million

The particular numbers will be different for 2024 and 2025 but the pattern will be the same.  If you could hope to be a top ten pick in 2025 but you come out early and get picked 25th in 2024 you cost yourself 7 million on your rookie contract.  Plus, under the new college rules you can pick up a nice piece of change playing that extra year in college.  It's not NFL money, but its not chump change.  A top college QB can make a couple of million.