Walter Football updated their QB prospect list

[Bob In PA]

Rich - I saw Joe Milton at Michigan.  He can throw it to Mars but he can't hit a house from 30 yards.  Horrible accuracy.  No sense of touch.

Phil: That's why accuracy is my number-one quality for a QB. My example is Purdy. He wasn't even on the radar because of lack of some stuff that could be taught or improved with repetition, but he ARRIVED in the NFL with great accuracy. Bob

[LennG]

As I have said before, say we go with Jones and he is having a terrific year, but in reality, with already 2 serious neck injuries, he is basically one good hot away from retiring and getting a medical compensation package. How can we put all our eggs in his basket and NOT prepare for life without him? Come on DeVito isn't the answer. We need a new plan with a healthy QB.

[DaveBrown74]

As I have said before, say we go with Jones and he is having a terrific year, but in reality, with already 2 serious neck injuries, he is basically one good hot away from retiring and getting a medical compensation package. How can we put all our eggs in his basket and NOT prepare for life without him? Come on DeVito isn't the answer. We need a new plan with a healthy QB.

Lenn,

I think at this point just about everyone here agrees Jones is not the long term answer for this team. The odds are pretty high he won't be a Giant beyond 2024 and may only play some of the season in 2024.

Still, that doesn't mean you take the 4th or 5th QB off the board with the sixth overall pick if you're only lukewarm on the guy. I'm sure you would agree with that.

We're in QB hell right now. This is what happens when you overdraft and then overpay for a mediocre talent like Jones. Because of those three Tommy Cutlets wins, which did absolutely nothing other than provide some entertainment for a few weeks and a few local Jersey sandwich shops with some nice publicity, we are not in the running for one of the top QBs. Should the use the 6th overall pick to take a middling QB talent? No way. They will need to believe they're getting a franchise-changing player if they use that pick on a QB. Otherwise draft the BPA and worry about QB in free agency and then in next year's draft. The only way around that would be if they can trade up this year, which looks very unlikely.

[Philosophers]

Phil: That's why accuracy is my number-one quality for a QB. My example is Purdy. He wasn't even on the radar because of lack of some stuff that could be taught or improved with repetition, but he ARRIVED in the NFL with great accuracy. Bob

Could not agree more Bob.  It's not a completion unless he catches it.  Throwing it out of the stadium is just an incompletion.

[Painter]

It should be quite clear that the Giants primary consideration regarding its Quarterback will be to determine whether or not Daniel Jones is to remain as such beyond this year. As most Giants fans seem to have a negative view of DJ, and thus prefer to think of it as his last- fearing only that he might actually perform well enough to make it less than certain- the question becomes, do they look for a true successor now, or simply for a backup in a latter round or FA?

There have been 41 quarterbacks drafted in the 1st Round since 2011, the year the NFL changed the collective bargaining agreement to set a wage scale for rookie deals, making it much more affordable to draft a Quarterback.

Those 41 QBs taken in Round 1 have made 1956 starts with a W-L record of 1046-1058-7 which, quite obviously is less than .500, make of it what you will. While that is not to suggest that it defines success in each of those 13 past seasons, the fact is that Patrick Mahomes is the only one of the 41 who has thus far led his team to a Lombardi. Now then, it will be up to 2016 1st overall, Jared Goff or 2018's 32nd overall, Lamar Jackson to make it otherwise. We do see the point in it, no?

In any case, of the 28 not still on their rookie deal, only 11 were given a second contract by the team which drafted them. Either they were cut or their contracts expired. All together, these 41 quarterbacks have played in a total of 215 seasons since being drafted. Yet in only 42 of those 215 seasons (19.5%) did the team that drafted the quarterback make the playoffs.

That's not the sort of thing which compels me to start picking and choosing and pro and conning the 6 or 7 or 8 names being tendered as DJ's potential successor even if we feel that he belongs in that 1 in 5 category while not being able to do more than to define a lack of success.

Cheers!

[Bob In PA]

There have been 41 quarterbacks drafted in the 1st Round since 2011, the year the NFL changed the collective bargaining agreement to set a wage scale for rookie deals, making it much more affordable to draft a Quarterback.

Those 41 QBs taken in Round 1 have made 1956 starts with a W-L record of 1046-1058-7 which, quite obviously is less than .500, make of it what you will. While that is not to suggest that it defines success in each of those 13 past seasons, the fact is that Patrick Mahomes is the only one of the 41 who has thus far led his team to a Lombardi. Now then, it will be up to 2016 1st overall, Jared Goff or 2018's 32nd overall, Lamar Jackson to make it otherwise. We do see the point in it, no?

In any case, of the 28 not still on their rookie deal, only 11 were given a second contract by the team which drafted them. Either they were cut or their contracts expired. All together, these 41 quarterbacks have played in a total of 215 seasons since being drafted. Yet in only 42 of those 215 seasons (19.5%) did the team that drafted the quarterback make the playoffs.

Larry: Many thanks for doing this.  I am too lazy to have done such superior leg-work.

My substitute for hard work, has been to keep posting (repeatedly) the bottom line (likely without proving the point to many readers)

Well, there it is: drafting a high-1st-round QB sounds great, but it's much more likely than not to prove to be a losing proposition.

Bob

PS. For doubters, I cite none other than case of our own Daniel Jones. "Insanity" has been defined (probably only semi-seriously) as doing the same thing again and again while expecting a different result than the last time. I do trust Schoen when he's acting alone, but assume (with good reason) the owners will want to get involved, and therefore I'd prefer to take a hard pass. What we have (counting all three QB's from this past season and maybe a free-agent this spring) is plenty good enough to win with a solid and COMPLETE supporting cast... which IMO we still don't have.

[MightyGiants]

It should be quite clear that the Giants primary consideration regarding its Quarterback will be to determine whether or not Daniel Jones is to remain as such beyond this year. As most Giants fans seem to have a negative view of DJ, and thus prefer to think of it as his last- fearing only that he might actually perform well enough to make it less than certain- the question becomes, do they look for a true successor now, or simply for a backup in a latter round or FA?

There have been 41 quarterbacks drafted in the 1st Round since 2011, the year the NFL changed the collective bargaining agreement to set a wage scale for rookie deals, making it much more affordable to draft a Quarterback.

Those 41 QBs taken in Round 1 have made 1956 starts with a W-L record of 1046-1058-7 which, quite obviously is less than .500, make of it what you will. While that is not to suggest that it defines success in each of those 13 past seasons, the fact is that Patrick Mahomes is the only one of the 41 who has thus far led his team to a Lombardi. Now then, it will be up to 2016 1st overall, Jared Goff or 2018's 32nd overall, Lamar Jackson to make it otherwise. We do see the point in it, no?

In any case, of the 28 not still on their rookie deal, only 11 were given a second contract by the team which drafted them. Either they were cut or their contracts expired. All together, these 41 quarterbacks have played in a total of 215 seasons since being drafted. Yet in only 42 of those 215 seasons (19.5%) did the team that drafted the quarterback make the playoffs.

That's not the sort of thing which compels me to start picking and choosing and pro and conning the 6 or 7 or 8 names being tendered as DJ's potential successor even if we feel that he belongs in that 1 in 5 category while not being able to do more than to define a lack of success.

Cheers!

Larry,

My views on this issue have evolved over the years.  I know believe the failure rate at QB is more a function of teams drafting QBs when they are not in a position to develop them, rather than the prospects are lacking in talent or the NFL is incapable of scouting prospects.  Drafted QBs need to be developed.  The environment for QBs to develop is behind an NFL-caliber O-line or better, solid receiving targets and a quality, stable coaching environment.  Teams that draft QBs while having what is needed to develop a QB prospect tend to enjoy success more often than not, while those lacking the tools to develop a QB will see failure most of the time.

Worse, the QB developmental window does close, so a QB prospect who has the misfortune of being drafted by an ill-prepared team rarely gets a second chance to fully develop with another team.  You had posted the scouting report for Daniel Jones, and it was pretty much what most QB reports look like; there are foreseeable paths to success and failure.  The teams prepared to develop tend to put their prospects on the path to success, while those not prepared or incapable tend to see their prospects head down that path to failure.

Perhaps the bigger issue is if the Giants are ready to develop a QB.  They seem to have the coaches and the receivers but the O-line is a huge issue.

[BluesCruz]

I still like Penix Rich

His last game was a disaster but Michigan was unstoppable. Everyone has a bad game once in a while.  His accuracy, quick release and strength are peerless

The Texas game he looked like a QB version of Jim Brown.  He would be the perfect candidate to sit behind Jones this year with Devito as #2 or 3.

Work him in for the last few games

I have no faith Jones will re-birth.  I think he is shell shocked
and damaged goods

[MightyGiants]

I still like Penix Rich

His last game was a disaster but Michigan was unstoppable. Everyone has a bad game once in a while.  His accuracy, quick release and strength are peerless

The Texas game he looked like a QB version of Jim Brown.  He would be the perfect candidate to sit behind Jones this year with Devito as #2 or 3.

Work him in for the last few games

I have no faith Jones will re-birth.  I think he is shell shocked
and damaged goods

You will be able to see more of Pennix at the Senior Bowl.  I did a prep post for the Senior Bowl here

https://giantsfans.net/message_board/index.php?topic=68917.0

[BluesCruz]

You will be able to see more of Pennix at the Senior Bowl.  I did a prep post for the Senior Bowl here

https://giantsfans.net/message_board/index.php?topic=68917.0

February 3rd, 2:30 on NFL Network
put it in my Iphone calendar

[Stringer Bell]

I still like Penix Rich

His last game was a disaster but Michigan was unstoppable. Everyone has a bad game once in a while.  His accuracy, quick release and strength are peerless

The Texas game he looked like a QB version of Jim Brown.  He would be the perfect candidate to sit behind Jones this year with Devito as #2 or 3.

Work him in for the last few games

I have no faith Jones will re-birth.  I think he is shell shocked
and damaged goods

No offense, but this analysis is a disaster. Penix has "peerless" accuracy? His lack of accuracy is one of his biggest minuses. Every one of the top QB prospects except Maye have a higher completion percentage than Penix - Nix by more than 10%.

And DJ is "damaged goods" and yet your answer is Penix and his twice torn ACLs? Makes no sense.

Penix is easily the worst of the top 6 QB prospects with his poor footwork, accuracy woes, and injury history. He's not even on my board.

[BluesCruz]

No offense, but this analysis is a disaster. Penix has "peerless" accuracy? His lack of accuracy is one of his biggest minuses. Every one of the top QB prospects except Maye have a higher completion percentage than Penix - Nix by more than 10%.

And DJ is "damaged goods" and yet your answer is Penix and his twice torn ACLs? Makes no sense.

Penix is easily the worst of the top 6 QB prospects with his poor footwork, accuracy woes, and injury history. He's not even on my board.

Don't mind me.  Speak to Phil Simms
I like Nix too

Don't care for Dan Jones

[Stringer Bell]

Don't care for Dan Jones

Yeah, that's fine. But calling him damaged goods then calling for the team to draft someone with 2 torn ACLs makes no sense at all.