What will it take for Jones to keep the Giants from drafting another QB?

[DaveBrown74]

DB: Good points, but IMO it should depend more on how the Giants see the NFL potential of QB's in the draft.

This is more important than on how Jones plays, unless he magically erases all doubt about his shortcomings...

... or it becomes clear to the coaches, GM and owner that he'll never be good enough (not likely to happen IMO).

Bob

Bob,

Agreed, and hence why I have said in other posts that the Giants should take a QB IF they like one and have access to him. I agree that's of significant importance here.

As MG noted though, even if they still have the view that they "don't know what Jones is yet", what is not up for debate is that he has been hurt significantly in four out of his five years in the league. By itself that is problematic.

[Philosophers]

that would leave him with virtually the same passing numbers he had last year with more ints. Even then I don't think 3150, 17, 6 saves him.

My thinking is it would be a progression from where he started this season which was pretty bad.  Keep in mind that in 3 of the 5 games he played in this season he threw for under 140 yards in the game which is horrible.  However you may be right.

[MightyGiants]

I'm sort of perplexed as to why anyone thinks a decision as big as whether or not to take a QB in the first round could or should hinge on a handful of games of data on a player when we already have 59 games worth of data on that player. Especially considering that we have all just watched a very inexpensive, aging, journeyman backup play pretty effectively under all the same conditions Jones has had (actually less if you count Ezeudu getting hurt). Taylor's recent play, in my opinion at least, poses major problems for the argument that "Jones cannot be properly evaluated due to the lack of talent around him." I don't see how we can keep saying that at this point and keep kicking the can on the final evaluation process.

I would say there are two issues that should help you understand

1) Many see DJ's data set has been corrupted to a degree.  DJ had a pretty good rookie year and a good year 4.  The two years under Judge should be considered throwaways due to the poor coaching and talent levels.

2)  Tyrod has enjoyed better pass protection than what DJ saw in many of the earlier games.  This case took some effort to develop, so I made a new thread to justify my time and effort

https://giantsfans.net/message_board/index.php?topic=67983.0

[StompYouOT]

Jones is not, and never has been it. The contract was a giant mistake but we're stuck. If there is a legit franchise QB available in the draft you take him no questions asked. It's absurd not to.

If not, then it's more of this. We will be back to 15 sacks, fumbles and 30-0 deficits every week once he returns.

[Jclayton92]

Jones is not, and never has been it. The contract was a giant mistake but we're stuck. If there is a legit franchise QB available in the draft you take him no questions asked. It's absurd not to.

If not, then it's more of this. We will be back to 15 sacks, fumbles and 30-0 deficits every week once he returns.

I think Jones playing actually gives us a better chance at drafting his successor than Taylor finishing the season.

[EDjohnst1981]

If not, then it's more of this. We will be back to 15 sacks, fumbles and 30-0 deficits every week once he returns.

If that's the case. The excuses have run dry and it's time to move on.

So at least we will have our answer.

[Bob In PA]

Agreed, and hence why I have said in other posts that the Giants should take a QB IF they like one and have access to him.

DB: Yes.  I also included a similar observation in my first reply to the original post. Bob

[AZGiantFan]

If he comes back healthy and averages 80-100 YPG for Hyatt for the balance of the season I'll feel pretty good about him moving forward.

[Bob In PA]

AZR: You indirectly raise an IMO important issue regarding Jones... how well does he "mesh" with Hyatt.

To me, it appeared Taylor has had Hyatt "measured" fairly well in the two games.

I don't remember that we've seen a connection between Jones and Hyatt that was as good, although we do have to include in our consideration the fact that Hyatt is a rookie and maybe it is/was HE who needed five or six games to really get himself in the most QB-friendly status possible for a first-year player.

Bob

[MightyGiants]

AZR: You indirectly raise an IMO important issue regarding Jones... how well does he "mesh" with Hyatt.

To me, it appeared Taylor has had Hyatt "measured" fairly well in the two games.

I don't remember that we've seen a connection between Jones and Hyatt that was as good, although we do have to include in our consideration the fact that Hyatt is a rookie and maybe it is/was HE who needed five or six games to really get himself in the most QB-friendly status possible for a first-year player.

Bob

Bob,

Don't forget that Daboll limited Hyatt's snap counts early.  It was really when Taylor was the started that Hyatt's (and Wondale's) snap counts got bumped up.

[Gmo11]

I don't think there's anything he can do on the field to make the Giants think "yep, we're good here" anymore.  There's just way too much bad stuff to outweigh the good by a wide margin.  He is what he is and what he is isn't great.

However he could play well enough to win enough games to push the Giants out of contention for a QB by virtue of them just picking too late in the 1st round to take one. 

[katkavage]

I think unless Daniel Jones steps in on Sunday and leads the team to seven victories in the last ten games, the Giants will be in the market for a QB. I hope though, that unlike what Gettleman did when he reached to take Jones, they pick one they really want. Not just picking a QB for the sake of it. Find that one.

[T200]

"What will it take for Jones to keep the Giants from drafting another QB?"

From the Giants' standpoint? Nothing. If they are within reach of a QB they like, Schoen picks him.

From my standpoint? I like Jones. Always have. I've mentioned that he needs to be protected. Others have repeatedly banged the drum for the offensive line. I've always felt that despite the less-than-ideal protection he's had, there are still things that we can learn about him.

- He doesn't put the team on his shoulders.
- He's not composed in a pressured pocket.
- While he's a good scrambler, he doesn't have good field vision when plays break down.
- He's too risk averse.
- He's not a vocal leader.

His production will only get better with better protection and better play calling. It still won't be enough to keep the Giants from drafting a QB.

[Gmo11]

I think unless Daniel Jones steps in on Sunday and leads the team to seven victories in the last ten games, the Giants will be in the market for a QB. I hope though, that unlike what Gettleman did when he reached to take Jones, they pick one they really want. Not just picking a QB for the sake of it. Find that one.

I think you're underestimating Gettleman's incompetence.  Jones WAS the one he wanted.  He was the only one that wanted him in the top 10.  And if he were still here that Jones contract would be significantly worse than it already is as he tries to save face at the expense of the team.

[Jclayton92]

"What will it take for Jones to keep the Giants from drafting another QB?"

From the Giants' standpoint? Nothing. If they are within reach of a QB they like, Schoen picks him.

From my standpoint? I like Jones. Always have. I've mentioned that he needs to be protected. Others have repeatedly banged the drum for the offensive line. I've always felt that despite the less-than-ideal protection he's had, there are still things that we can learn about him.

- He doesn't put the team on his shoulders.
- He's not composed in a pressured pocket.
- While he's a good scrambler, he doesn't have good field vision when plays break down.
- He's too risk averse.
- He's not a vocal leader.

His production will only get better with better protection and better play calling. It still won't be enough to keep the Giants from drafting a QB.

Physically he has everything you look for in a Qb, it's just that he's missing the mental. Yes he's tough, but beyond that he's lacking.

That's honestly the difference in a serviceable game manager and an elite top 10 talent in my opinion.