Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: Jolly Blue Giant on November 24, 2023, 01:10:59 PMLet's not forget that Devito shined against the Commanders, not a good team. And even though the Commanders traded away Chase Young and Montez Sweat, they still blew through our offensive line for 9 sacks and 11 QB hits. And the Commanders' with Sam (turnover) Howell at the helm, allowed the Giants' defense to take the game away

I'm not knocking Devito, just saying that we won because of a crap load of turnovers and in spite of an offensive line that couldn't stop my 92-year-old mother (who uses a walker, BTW) from getting to the QB. I like Devito, but I'm also a huge SU fan and watched him play for years...and all I can say, is that his play last Sunday was an aberration from his college days (I hope it continues, but it's hard to forget what I watched in Syracuse). I say, "good for him...he's got some game to him", but our problem is not DJ, who seems to be the favorite target of frustrated fans' wrath along with big mouth pundits who need to stay on the bandwagon they started when he was drafted. Meanwhile, the coaches, GM, and every single one of the Giants' players have 100% faith in DJ and believe in him as a future winner. Fans think that if we only had Justin Herbert, he would/could carry this team on his back regardless of the players around him. This is a team sport, and it takes the whole team. It's not the PGA or pro-tennis

Our problems go much deeper than QB...even though it's true that QB is a problem with us having to rely on a third string undrafted rookie. Just don't think that Devito is the second coming of Brady, and don't get your hopes up when he plays against teams like the Eagles. Must keep in mind that this win was against a very poor Commanders' team

And another thing - QB hell (IMHO) is also a team with a QB who folds like a cheap suit in the most important games and is unable to rise to the occasion at the end of the season (know what I'm saying Dak?)

I don't think any reasonable person wants DeVito as QB1 on this team. We just don't want Jones either.

I don't disagree with your point about Dak. I wouldn't describe the situation in Dallas as QB hell but I wouldn't be confident with him as my starting QB going into the playoffs either.

Quote from: Jolly Blue Giant on November 24, 2023, 11:47:49 AMTruer words have rarely been spoken

We are not in "QB hell"...we are in "OL hell". No QB can overcome playing the game on his back and playing sore and/or injured and running for his life. We could break the all-time record this season for getting sacked, a record set back in the 80s by the Eagles. We're only about 40 sacks away from that record, and we've got six games to go. At the current pace, we'll break it and it's a record that would probably never be broken...right up there with DiMaggio's hit streak and Rose's 4,256 career hits. It is UNACCEPTABLE by any measure!!! No QB, no matter how good, can win games when there is no time to throw and running for his life. When I think of QB hell, I think of the Commanders, the Browns, the Jets (although Rogers would've been a good band aid to stop the bleeding), and I think the Patriots have a foot all the way in the QB hell pit, etc. I don't think the Giants are there yet. We can't even figure out what we have until the offensive line is fixed once and for all

Jones was sacked 30 times in six games this year before a season ending injury. Devito got sacked 9 times in the last game and the clock is ticking on his durability at that rate. Our offensive line is a sieve

This team is in QB hell because of the Jones contract, not because of DeVito. All DeVito has done in his handful of games is shown the world that he is more effective behind this OL than Daniel Jones.

Daniel Jones is the problem. Wasting 5+ years trying to "evaluate" Jones is the reason we're in QB hell. QB hell is the bumbling idiot Gettleman's legacy.

This isn't going to be a serious debate by draft day and that's taking nothing away from Maye. I'm willing to bet the one scout in this group wasn't being honest about his true thoughts.

https://twitter.com/WBG84/status/1724802727312798043?t=twVj58X5RrBO_MQFRgSzLg&s=19

Quote from: uconnjack8 on November 21, 2023, 09:16:41 AMI wasn't referencing any of this stuff as to why teams may draft someone else higher.  The noise of the pre-draft stuff is nonsense.  The conversations that are had with GMs and HCs and owners is more of what I was mentioning.  Williams may do great in that regard and show another reason why he should be the #1 pick.  I don't know him or any of the other prospects and either do any of the people in this forum.  When telling the story of drafting Manning over Leaf, Bill Polian mentions that even the scouts only have about 80% of the information.  That's more of where my point lies.  There is a lot of unknowns about all these prospects when it comes to their mental makeup.

It's great that Eisen has strong feelings about Williams, and he may be right, but I don't think a chasm exists between he and some other prospects in this draft like there was from Trevor Lawrence to Zach Wilson.

The chasm between Caleb and everyone else will be clear by draft day. Any GM who passes on him will be taking a career and reputation threatening risk. It won't be like passing on Allen or Mahomes.

Quote from: uconnjack8 on November 21, 2023, 08:37:06 AMNot so sure about that.  It's not just about film but about interviews and the whole mental/emotional aspect that can make a difference this year. 

I think some of the online scouting media is already putting Maye ahead of Williams. 

Rich Eisen explains it better than I can.

https://youtu.be/cspenpIkOfA?si=orQZ4l0Su5q6GgNu

Quote from: shadowspinner0 on November 20, 2023, 11:48:16 PMThe same way the Jets won two meaningless games against the Rams and Browns the next year and settled for the 2nd pick to draft.....Zach Wilson over Trevor Lawrence. 

Good point. For every example of draft position not mattering, there is an example of draft position mattering a lot. I'll never understand why people think drafting later doesn't have any impact on a team's likelihood of drafting a franchise QB.

Daniel Jones can't be cut due to cap constraints but he can potentially be traded. The Giants would have a ton of dead cap but would actually have a lower cap hit assuming they could find someone desperate enough to pick up Jones' guaranteed $36 million next season.

I think it's safe to assume they won't find anyone willing to take a flier on an expensive QB with such a poor track record and coming off an ACL. Pray for Washington to bring Gettleman out of retirement. It would take something that wacky to move Daniel Jones.

Quote from: Jclayton92 on November 19, 2023, 11:05:12 PMThe teams that have actually hit on qbs recently were all playoff teams the ÿear before the draft in the Eagles, Bill's, and Chiefs. With Burrow, Lawrence, and Herbet being the exceptions but still. The odds are better if you let the Qb come to you whether it's whenever you pick in the 1st or in the 2nd-7th than reaching into the top.

You're sharing some good data but keep in mind the Chiefs and Bills did trade up for Mahomes and Allen. They didn't move up into the top-5 but they didn't let the draft come to them either. They knew who they wanted and gave up draft capital to get their guy.

Wesley Steinberg may be a parody account but he's probably as credible as any other Giants beat reporter these days.

Good for DeVito on today's game. He deserves a ton of credit. Just please tell Schoen not to overreact and give him a $40 mil per extension.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on November 19, 2023, 04:50:38 PMSix turnovers really is ridiculous. I'd love to know how many times that a team has turned it over at least six times in an NFL game in the past, oh I don't know, 25 years. I'm sure it has happened, but I bet it's a very small number.

https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/most-combined-turnovers-in-an-nfl-game-since-2000

The 2000 Titans Browns game must've been wild. Steve McNair had 6 turnovers himself yet they somehow pulled the game out behind Eddie George.

This is now life as a Giants fan. The Parcells and Coughlin eras are distant memories. Since Coughlin was so unceremoniously pushed out we are stuck in a loop of debating whether winning a meaningless game against a bad team is worth it. We debate whether we've seen enough of a mediocre (on a good day) QB going into his 6th season to determine whether he is actually mediocre or not.

Thank you, Mr. Mara for your steadfast leadership. If there was a Dave Gettleman lifetime achievement award for excellence in incompetence, John Mara would be a finalist every year.

Quote from: Philosophers on November 19, 2023, 04:51:56 PMOk you realize that your sample size to make your point was 1 game right?

That's one game Daniel Jones hasn't produced in the last 4 years. The point is an undrafted rookie walked in the door and is immediately more productive than Daniel Jones with 6 TD passes in his 3 starts. That doesn't mean DeVito is the answer. It's just further confirmation that Daniel Jones is an enormous part of the problem for the Giants.

Again, the QB can make plays regardless of his circumstances. It won't happen consistently if the team isn't good enough. But if DeVito can throw for 6 TDs in 3 games, then no reasonable person should continue making excuses for Daniel Jones.

Quote from: Philosophers on November 19, 2023, 03:22:01 PMNo QB would do well under DeVito's 9 sack assault.  We might as well draft a kicker to play QB.

How long has it been since Daniel Jones threw for 3 TDs in a game? He hasn't done it in the last 4 years.

The QB isn't as helpless as you pretend in order to justify the Daniel Jones experiment.

Quote from: andrew_nyGiants on November 19, 2023, 09:35:43 AMHaskins is dead, and passed at a very early age. So please, a modicum of respect.

No one knows whether or not he would've turned it around with Tomlin's guidance, and we never will.

RIP YOUNG MR HASKINS


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Please don't do this. We all understood what he was saying. As a "draft prospect" Haskins did not grade out as high as Williams and Maye. That's not a controversial statement and has nothing to do with being respectful of the dead.

Quote from: Gmo11 on November 18, 2023, 03:38:58 PMI wish the Giants were as bad as the Chargers who are 4-5 right now while having one of the most potent offenses in the entire NFL.  I imagine a lot of us would give quite a bit to be that "bad".

I would trade every win the Giants have cobbled together over the last 5 years to have Justin Herbert as my starting QB going into 2024.