Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: MightyGiants on Today at 10:12:24 AMThe Giants had the worst offensive line in the league last year

Jones was pressured more frequently and quickly than any QB

Jones had no receiving threat of note

I am not sure what you define as excuses, but for those of us who try to be fair in our evaluations (we don't use charged language like "excuses"), Jones was put in a terrible situation for a QB to do well.  It's not to suggest that Jones doesn't need to step up his game, but I am not sure any QB could have done well in DJ's situation last year.
 

All the arguments against this exist on this forum. I won't reiterate them.  If you wish to ignore them for one-uppmanship - so be it.

Quote from: TONKA56 on Today at 11:15:09 AMBased on his class and work ethic, Jones is an easy guy to root for, but I have a hard time picturing him at quarterback after 2026 for a myriad of reasons.

I don't see him beyond the designed out year after 2024

Any growth will be leveraged into using his trade value to move on. 

My hunch is Jones never sees his 2025 and 2026 contract years in a Giants Uniform

Waller's gutless, uninspired brand of football is not what the team needs. 

Paying 14 mill for what little he brings to the table I think is a huge waste. 

I suspect they will cut him post June 1 so only 1.9 mill will hit this year and 5.9 next year. 

It was a nice try but a swing and miss

Quote from: MightyGiants on Today at 02:09:06 PMTrench,

In all fairness, there is only one way to read the chart.  Factually speaking, even though Jones, Taylor, and DeVito played for the same team, the chart clearly shows (there is no room for interpretation) that the three of them faced very different situations.  So, while it's technically not wrong to suggest that two backups played better than Jones, it's not accurately describing the situation.   Two backups played better in much better conditions, which would be a far more appropriate way to say that.

I am not trying to dissuade you from believing that Jones is a poor quarterback, but I do think we should all try to be fair and accurate in how we portray the facts of the situation.

I'm being very fair. I simply do not use stats as my barometer and that's my right to do so. If I use stats for my evaluations, then garbage time points and yards in low leverage situations would play too much into my decisions on who is better than who. Instead, I choose to gauge my perception on what I see, the tempo, making plays under duress and in the clutch. And lastly - who wins. It has served me pretty well thus far as a sports fan.

I saw us play better with backups. That is a fact.

To be clear, I don't perceive Jones as a poor QB. I think he's pretty good. I just don't think he's franchise level. But if I'm proven wrong this year you have my word, I'll be the first to own it guys. 

Quote from: Trench on Today at 02:02:17 PMOk since you feel the need to be aggressive, I simply read Mighty chart very differently is all. You all have your mind made up and continue to push false narratives and that's ok. Others feel opposite and that's ok too. Not sure what you mean by "keep giving the game away??"....

If the argument that our 2 backups outplayed Jones simply because Andrew Thomas was not available for Jones then I really don't know what to tell you. What I do know is we played much better with the backups (than with Jones). That is a fact.

If your argument is one person (Thomas) really makes that much of a difference, I would ask you why then you won't hold Jones as an individual to the same standard?

Trench,

In all fairness, there is only one way to read the chart.  Factually speaking, even though Jones, Taylor, and DeVito played for the same team, the chart clearly shows (there is no room for interpretation) that the three of them faced very different situations.  So, while it's technically not wrong to suggest that two backups played better than Jones, it's not accurately describing the situation.   Two backups played better in much better conditions, which would be a far more appropriate way to say that.

I am not trying to dissuade you from believing that Jones is a poor quarterback, but I do think we should all try to be fair and accurate in how we portray the facts of the situation.

Quote from: AZGiantFan on Today at 01:48:10 PMYes, 3 people just did by providing context.  But you have your mind made up and that's that.  And you keep giving the game away, like when you didn't know that the back-ups had Thomas when DJ didn't and just now when you completely misinterpreted the chart MG posted.

Ok since you feel the need to be aggressive, I simply read Mighty chart very differently is all. You all have your mind made up and continue to push false narratives and that's ok. Others feel opposite and that's ok too. Not sure what you mean by "keep giving the game away??"....

If the argument that our 2 backups outplayed Jones simply because Andrew Thomas was not available for Jones then I really don't know what to tell you. What I do know is we played much better with the backups (than with Jones). That is a fact.

If your argument is one person (Thomas) really makes that much of a difference, I would ask you why then you won't hold Jones as an individual to the same standard?

Quote from: Jolly Blue Giant on Today at 02:00:22 PMA couple of things I've read this past year:

1) Drake is DJ 2.0, except Drake was throwing to potential NFL receivers, whilst DJ was throwing to future doctors, surgeons, lawyers, nuclear engineers, and scientists

2) The tangibles between Drew Lock and JJ McCarthy are eerily similar, the intangibles, not so much

Regardless, I believe Daboll calls the shots concerning which players see the field. If Lock shows real substance and wows a few times during training, and DJ seems to struggle, I imagine Daboll puts in who he feels is the best of the two

If both show excellent form, throwing, aptitude, etc., or are both average looking, then I imagine DJ gets the nod because of his salary and starting experience

I see the possibility for Lock in the same light you do, Ric

A couple of things I've read this past year:

1) Drake is DJ 2.0, except Drake was throwing to potential NFL receivers, whilst DJ was throwing to future doctors, surgeons, lawyers, nuclear engineers, and scientists

2) The tangibles between Drew Lock and JJ McCarthy are eerily similar, the intangibles, not so much

Regardless, I believe Daboll calls the shots concerning which players see the field. If Lock shows real substance and wows a few times during training, and DJ seems to struggle, I imagine Daboll puts in who he feels is the best of the two

If both show excellent form, throwing, aptitude, etc., or are both average looking, then I imagine DJ gets the nod because of his salary and starting experience

Quote from: MightyGiants on Today at 12:32:40 PMI have heard this claim come up, but frankly it's juts not accurate as this chart clearly shows.




How quickly the pressure arrives matters a great deal and clearly the other two QBs had it significantly better than Jones

Context, context context. Time to pressure is an extremely good stat to understand just how little time he actually had to throw. Over those 1st five games I'd be hard pressed just by the eyeball test in remembering any Giant QB that was barraged as quickly and consistently as he was in the last 40 something years.

It's so comical to me that people are so bent on loving a pedestrian qb.

Jones produces the same as mills and mills gets replaced by Stroud.

Howell produces more than Jones in his first year and gets replaced immediately by jayden daniels.

But sure blame every one else for Jones not throwing beyond 10 yards..

The nfl is based on explosive plays of which Daniel jones cannot provide period. Even in his best yeat he refused to target downfield, and that isn't going to change.

So an oftinjured qb that refuses to throw downfield and now can't run..

But sure maybe just maybe he'll be the qb he's never ever been in year 6.