Big Blue Huddle

This thread contains Ozark Season 4 Part I spoilers - proceed at your own risk!

Me and you Tim.

Where to start

Opening 3 minutes, family is happy as a pig in you know what, all laughing and then the accident. So we know at that point, everything worked out for them and they are all a family and leaving. Does anyone survive that accident?

First 7 episodes, killings galore. Really shocked me that Darlene and Wyatt get it. I really hated Darlene but she brought a certain attitude to the show that no one else had. Basically, the exact opposite of Marty and Wendy who talk their way out of everything, Darlene acts. Shoots off the guy's dick, then does away with the father. She would shoot anyone, anywhere just for the heck of it. Not any more. This was a real surprise, just like killing Helen was.

I felt the show got just a bit too talky with all this foundation stuff, but it will lead to more nail-biting action.

The nephew is one hard-ass guy and like Darlene, kills anyone who is in the way.

Did I miss something, did he make a deal with the FBI? I know they were talking about it, but did he do it?

Like to hear your thoughts.

I didn't like Darlene ever since she killed Del in S1. That was the first shocker that had me like "OH SH*T!!!!" And then she killed Grace and left Zeke for the pastor to find him, and killed her own husband. I was ready for her to get hers. Didn't expect it to be that way but she was way overdue if you ask me.

The way they set up Helen against Marty and Wendy, I knew Helen was going to die. She couldn't do what Marty was doing for Omar. He also had a thing for Wendy as well and wasn't going to kill her.

Javi the nephew did make a deal with the FBI. He's pretty much untouchable at this point. It's messed up what Agent Maya did in arresting Omar. I think she sealed her fate with that move. I can see her getting killed in the second half. Javi has to die. The only person Marty killed in the series was the pastor and that was an accident. I think Marty will kill Javi.

Jonah is really pissing me off with his attitude and diarrhea of the mouth!

As far as the car crash, I agree that they were probably on their way to Chicago. What events transpired before that is anyone's guess. I think it happens in the first couple of episodes of Part 2.

I saw something online that hinted that Rachel may be back in Part 2 as well. Gonna be interesting to see how they wrap everything up.

I agree Tim.

I wasn't positive about Javi and the FBI and why Maya did what she did. Is it to tout herself or some sort of revenge for that truck blowing up?

Seems we both haven't mentioned Ruth in this chat yet. I really don't know what to think of her role right now. Is she going back to Marty, will she take over Darlene's empire? will she retire and just run her motel (yeah right).

I am also on the shelf about the PI, Mel. At first, I thought there is no doubt he gets killed as he is nosing into too many people's lives, but who would do it, Marty, I don't think so, Wendy, no way, Ruth--why?

A lot of things to think about until the second part of this season airs, probably late 2022

Maya is an idealist. She was truly hurt and blindsided by her superiors with the Omar deal. She wanted Omar to do some time.

Ruth is definitely the wildcard. It seems like they're setting her up to go after Javi but I don't think she's going to be the one to get him. Not even sure what's going to happen with her either.

I don't quite know what to make of the PI either. I can't imagine he's just a time filler. He called Maya about Marty and Wendy. But she already knows what they're up to and have been 'absolved' by the FBI. What else could he tell her that she doesn't know?

I could have seen Darlene doing away with the PI. As I said, she would kill anyone just on a whim.

I do think Ruth takes over Darlene's 'empire' and you brought up a good point, maybe she does do away with Javi as he seems to want anyone who will impede the cartels selling of drugs, out of the way. I can see a confrontation between Javi and Ruth, Ruth wins and that does give the Byrds a way out from under the cartel.

Len,

I don't think Ruth wants any parts of Darlene's empire. Remember: the key to them cleaning the money was Jonah. Unless he somehow runs away to start a new business with Ruth, it ain't happenin'.

Also remember, with the deal sealed between Javi and the FBI, the FBI already relieved the Byrds of their obligation. The lead female agent directly told them that "we will be assuming your roles with the Navarro cartel."

I can see Wendy getting killed at some point. She has to. Not sure who's going to do it. Jonah???  :-??

Quote from: T200 on January 31, 2022, 11:44:51 AM
Len,

I don't think Ruth wants any parts of Darlene's empire. Remember: the key to them cleaning the money was Jonah. Unless he somehow runs away to start a new business with Ruth, it ain't happenin'.

Also remember, with the deal sealed between Javi and the FBI, the FBI already relieved the Byrds of their obligation. The lead female agent directly told them that "we will be assuming your roles with the Navarro cartel."

I can see Wendy getting killed at some point. She has to. Not sure who's going to do it. Jonah???  :-??

Wendy was in the mini van when it rolled over. I have to assume that that was the end of the show.

Quote from: LennG on January 31, 2022, 01:20:19 PM
Wendy was in the mini van when it rolled over. I have to assume that that was the end of the show.

It could have been but I really doubt it. I have a hard time seeing them end the series like that. Significant people have to die!!!!!  =))

One thing I've been mulling around in my head is the prominence of the women in power positions:

Wendy
Ruth
Darlene
Helen
Maya
Maya's boss

There was even mention of Omar's sister, Javi's mom, during one of their conversations. I have to wonder if she is pulling any strings behind the scenes. Is she higher up on Navarro Cartel's food chain?

Another thought crossed my mind: Early in the series, Darlene and Jacob always had a few guys guarding their gate and house. As the seasons wore on, there were fewer guys around yet she always talked about how she has people. Why was it so easy for Javi to get inside her house?

Good question, I really never thought about that.

In better times, I attend a local library where every week we discuss some of the latest TV shows. We started with Game of Thrones, the Walking Dead, the Expanse, and any others that people suggest, and we try and watch.

Ozark was a very popular show also to discuss and I remember bringing up the point of how it seemed like a real male-orientated show when it started, but somewhere around season 2 and especially in season 3, the women sort of took over. Maybe it was to get more women to watch, but it definitely was geared towards women in power positions and it certainly7 has continued into this season.

Well guys - I finally got caught up. Wow

It's close to my bed time so I'll be on in the morning. I read through all the discussions and pretty much hit all the highlights with the same questions I have. Still trying to figure out what the out of town Dick is up to and how he fits into the picture. He doesn't give up and he keeps popping up.

I lost count of the deaths, but Darlene blew two guys away before she got hers. Poor dumb Wyatt. When Darlene killed the first guy, I was saying to the TV..."Don't try to discuss with her - justs quietly get in your car and drive away"...then, "you damn fool, do not walk in front of your car towards Darlene or she'll blow your head off"...which no sooner had I said that and "BLAM"

When she killed the mob boss, I couldn't help but laugh when Wyatt wanted to know "WHY?" And she said he was "unkind". Lenn is right, Darlene brought a a certain attitude to the show that both horrified and in a dark sense, was utterly fascinating and hilarious (could be my weird sense of humor). Reminded me of the dark comedies in the Fargo series that ranks right up there with Ozark.

Oh well, I'll check back tomorrow. I have a few more questions and thoughts.

Glad you finished it, Jolly.

I don't suspect Darlene's demise is the last of the shock killings. I honestly don't think anyone is safe. As long as Javi gets his, I'm good with the rest. He has it out for Marty for whatever reason. Marty isn't a killer (except for the accidental shooting of the pastor) but I would like to see him do Javi in.

I can also see Ruth killing Wendy the Wolf B*tch lol

I'm also having a hard time figuring out the private investigator's role in all this. If all he's looking for is a signature, just grab someone to scribble on the paper and keep it moving. There's definitely something there.

Somehow the mob and Javi are going to mix it up and there will be blood - lots of it...that's what I think anyway. The private dick might also be in the middle of it and now that Ruth knows it was Javi - she will too. Somehow I also think Mia and her FBI bosses could end up on a slab as well as the woman running the big pharm company.

The way this show goes, I wouldn't be surprised if every last character ends up dead - end of show.

I don't know if you ever watched Fargo (the series, not the movie), but very similar to the piling up of deaths to the point where pretty much everyone in the show ends up dead - even the ones you were rooting for. Great series. Free on Hulu, can buy it on Prime. There's 4 seasons and each season is a complete and finished story. The first couple seasons were tops and the last couple were still good, but not like the first ones. Great cast for each season. Highly recommend

Quote from: Jolly Blue Giant on February 02, 2022, 10:36:33 AM
Somehow the mob and Javi are going to mix it up and there will be blood - lots of it...that's what I think anyway. The private dick might also be in the middle of it and now that Ruth knows it was Javi - she will too. Somehow I also think Mia and her FBI bosses could end up on a slab as well as the woman running the big pharm company.

The way this show goes, I wouldn't be surprised if every last character ends up dead - end of show.

I don't know if you ever watched Fargo (the series, not the movie), but very similar to the piling up of deaths to the point where pretty much everyone in the show ends up dead - even the ones you were rooting for. Great series. Free on Hulu, can buy it on Prime. There's 4 seasons and each season is a complete and finished story. The first couple seasons were tops and the last couple were still good, but not like the first ones. Great cast for each season. Highly recommend

I think we have discussed Fargo when the last season was on. YES, I agree completely about this show, may be one of the best and quirkiest shows ever on TV. Again I agree the first and second seasons were really Must Watch TV, and the 3rd and 4th were also much better than most shows. I fully enjoyed them all.
If anyone is interested, nothing like the movie, except for the settings.

So, as I have said, and maybe Tim has a point, I am still stuck on the overturned minivan that started the entire 4th season. Tim doesn't think it will end that way, but why not? Would that be the perfect irony after all the killings, collusions, near-death experiences they all had, to finally be able to escape and get back to living a normal life, and then they all die in a silly car accident. Would not make a lot of people happy, but I can see it ending that way.

I don't see the KC Mob and the cartel dueling it out. But we know Ruth has a huge desire to do Javi in. I also don't see the people from the FBI getting whacked same for Mia.  But I ahve been wrong on others also. Like GOT and TWD no one is safe and that's what brings so much t o these great series.

Quote from: LennG on February 02, 2022, 11:08:39 AM
I think we have discussed Fargo when the last season was on. YES, I agree completely about this show, may be one of the best and quirkiest shows ever on TV. Again I agree the first and second seasons were really Must Watch TV, and the 3rd and 4th were also much better than most shows. I fully enjoyed them all.
If anyone is interested, nothing like the movie, except for the settings.

So, as I have said, and maybe Tim has a point, I am still stuck on the overturned minivan that started the entire 4th season. Tim doesn't think it will end that way, but why not? Would that be the perfect irony after all the killings, collusions, near-death experiences they all had, to finally be able to escape and get back to living a normal life, and then they all die in a silly car accident. Would not make a lot of people happy, but I can see it ending that way.

I don't see the KC Mob and the cartel dueling it out. But we know Ruth has a huge desire to do Javi in. I also don't see the people from the FBI getting whacked same for Mia.  But I ahve been wrong on others also. Like GOT and TWD no one is safe and that's what brings so much t o these great series.

Unless in some twist of fate, the only survivor is Jonah who goes on to pursue a life of crime in the money laundering business and voila - a whole new series of Ozark like craziness, just all new characters except Jonah (and maybe Ruth as the ring leader). That would be pretty cool

Finally finished and up to date. A few thoughts....

Julia Garner (Ruth) is absolutely fantastic. She never ceases to amaze me. WOW!!

Not surprised that Darlene got whacked, in fact I expected it, you don't mess with the cartel and a mob boss. And when Wyatt made the choice to go back to Darlene instead of with Ruth I was even less surprised he was killed.

Is it just me or does nephew Javi seem very similar in style to Better Call Saul

Quote from: Sem on February 08, 2022, 12:40:21 AM
Finally finished and up to date. A few thoughts....

Julia Garner (Ruth) is absolutely fantastic. She never ceases to amaze me. WOW!!

Not surprised that Darlene got whacked, in fact I expected it, you don't mess with the cartel and a mob boss. And when Wyatt made the choice to go back to Darlene instead of with Ruth I was even less surprised he was killed.

Is it just me or does nephew Javi seem very similar in style to Better Call Saul

Quote from: T200 on February 08, 2022, 09:03:33 AM
Steve,

I think there's definitely more to the PI. He's popping up in too many places and has too much information for someone who is just "looking for a signature" from Helen. He very well could be working for Navarro in some capacity. But if he is, why the charade of looking for Helen when Navarro had her killed.

I also think Navarro's hitman (driver and guy who killed Ben) is the one keeping tabs on the Byrdes. I think it's through him that Omar knew where Charlotte and Jonah were hiding out.

Fair points, but I don't recall seeing the driver at all when the kids went to hide out. Based on what was shown to us only the PI was observing the kids.

I was surprised at Darlene's doom. I really thought she was going to die from what appeared to be a heart attack with Ruth just watching over her. That would have been fitting. When she survived that only to be taken out as soon as she heads in the door, well, that did surprise me. I always knew she wouldn't make it to the end of the series as she pissed too many people off.

As we have discussed, I can definitely see Ruith taking out Javi.

Myself, I really don't think Mel is working for the cartel. Yes, he tells everyone he sees, where is Helen, he just needs a signature, but that is bull. I do believe he doesn't know about Helen's demise as he prods too many people to 'fill him in and he won't tell anyone'. I don't believe he is working for her ex-husband, but someone else who is searching for Helen.

As we have talked about already, but here is a great synopsis of the past 7 episodes of each character

https://www.msn.com/en-us/entertainment/news/that-explosive-ozark-ending-explained/ar-AAU4tXr?ocid=msedgntp

Quote from: LennG on February 19, 2022, 12:35:47 PM
As we have talked about already, but here is a great synopsis of the past 7 episodes of each character

https://www.msn.com/en-us/entertainment/news/that-explosive-ozark-ending-explained/ar-AAU4tXr?ocid=msedgntp

Great stuff and very insightful. Sounds like few are going to get out of this alive if this author is on point. I'm glad he did a piece on the mysterious Mel. And he nails his summation of Ruth.

Sounds like there's a lot more blood to be shed  =))

Quote from: LennG on February 19, 2022, 12:35:47 PM
As we have talked about already, but here is a great synopsis of the past 7 episodes of each character

https://www.msn.com/en-us/entertainment/news/that-explosive-ozark-ending-explained/ar-AAU4tXr?ocid=msedgntp

Thanks for the link, Len.

A couple of thoughts on some of the characters:

Charlotte: I think she may have a significant role in the second half. She put Erin on notice when she told her to not speak of her mom's death or else. Charlotte could be a player either for Marty or Wendy.

Maya: I don't see how she survives. I think Omar or Javi will take her out. Her bosses will be uspet but not terribly because she went behind their backs to arrest Omar. And where the hell is her baby's father????

Frank Jr.: He has a soft spot for Ruth. I can see him getting his mob guys to have it out with Javi and the cartel for Ruth.

Darlene: What happens to all of her land and property? Does it go to Wyatt since they were legally married? And now that Wyatt's dead, does it go to Three? Since Three is a minor, does it fall to Ruth as his guardian until he is 18? Do Ruth and Frank Jr restart the business?  :-??

Quote from: T200 on February 22, 2022, 10:14:14 AM
Thanks for the link, Len.

A couple of thoughts on some of the characters:

Charlotte: I think she may have a significant role in the second half. She put Erin on notice when she told her to not speak of her mom's death or else. Charlotte could be a player either for Marty or Wendy.

Maya: I don't see how she survives. I think Omar or Javi will take her out. Her bosses will be uspet but not terribly because she went behind their backs to arrest Omar. And where the hell is her baby's father????

Frank Jr.: He has a soft spot for Ruth. I can see him getting his mob guys to have it out with Javi and the cartel for Ruth.

Darlene: What happens to all of her land and property? Does it go to Wyatt since they were legally married? And now that Wyatt's dead, does it go to Three? Since Three is a minor, does it fall to Ruth as his guardian until he is 18? Do Ruth and Frank Jr restart the business?  :-??

Those are great questions. I have no idea of course, but I was wondering about who gets Darlene/Wyatt's property myself. I assume Ruth inherits it because she's the only blood relative left since Darlene had no kids and Wyatt's family has all been killed off except Ruth. Of course the baby might be the legal person to inherit the land/business, but he's many years away from handling anything

I never thought about Maya's baby-father, but that is a really good question!  :-??

Charlotte seems insignificant in the grand scheme of things...to me anyway. Like everything else in the show, that can change in an instant

Wendy has gone off the rails and I'm curious just how deep a hole she will dig herself into. Something's gotta give there

I think Wendy and Omar walk off into the sunset together.


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Quote from: EDjohnst1981 on February 22, 2022, 10:56:05 AM
I think Wendy and Omar walk off into the sunset together.
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=)) =)) =))

You could be right. If anything in this show, there's always a big surprise!

Quote from: Jolly Blue Giant on February 22, 2022, 10:28:28 AM
Those are great questions. I have no idea of course, but I was wondering about who gets Darlene/Wyatt's property myself. I assume Ruth inherits it because she's the only blood relative left since Darlene had no kids and Wyatt's family has all been killed off except Ruth. Of course the baby might be the legal person to inherit the land/business, but he's many years away from handling anything

I never thought about Maya's baby-father, but that is a really good question!  :-??

Charlotte seems insignificant in the grand scheme of things...to me anyway. Like everything else in the show, that can change in an instant

Wendy has gone off the rails and I'm curious just how deep a hole she will dig herself into. Something's gotta give there

Wyatt's brother, Three, would get anything due Wyatt before Ruth since she's just a cousin.

Three is still around as far as I know.

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Quote from: T200 on February 22, 2022, 11:03:41 AM
Wyatt's brother, Three, would get anything due Wyatt before Ruth since she's just a cousin.

Three is still around as far as I know.

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Good catch. Forgot about "Three", named after Dale Earnhardt's car number (talk about trailer trash...probably raised in a camo diaper with "3" emblazoned on it...LMAO). He rarely makes an appearance on the show so went right by me.

Quote from: EDjohnst1981 on February 22, 2022, 10:56:05 AM
I think Wendy and Omar walk off into the sunset together.


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I don't think so as we saw in the opening clip, the entire family is together, happy and leaving before the car crash.

I also thought Wendy would get to visit Ben, but it sure didn't seem that way.

Quote from: T200 on February 22, 2022, 10:14:14 AM
Thanks for the link, Len.

A couple of thoughts on some of the characters:

Charlotte: I think she may have a significant role in the second half. She put Erin on notice when she told her to not speak of her mom's death or else. Charlotte could be a player either for Marty or Wendy.

Maya: I don't see how she survives. I think Omar or Javi will take her out. Her bosses will be uspet but not terribly because she went behind their backs to arrest Omar. And where the hell is her baby's father????

Frank Jr.: He has a soft spot for Ruth. I can see him getting his mob guys to have it out with Javi and the cartel for Ruth.

Darlene: What happens to all of her land and property? Does it go to Wyatt since they were legally married? And now that Wyatt's dead, does it go to Three? Since Three is a minor, does it fall to Ruth as his guardian until he is 18? Do Ruth and Frank Jr restart the business?  :-??

Ha Tim, you have been spending more time than the rest of us thinking this out. great questions.

Whatever business there is left from Darlene and Wyatt, Ruth has a 1/4 share so now it is hers. Does anyone think she will try and make a go of it may be with Frank Jr?

I agree, Maya shouldn't make it past the next few episodes, but who is going to take her out? The only ones really pissed at her are the Byrds and Omar and since he has backed away from the cartel and wants to go straight, would he risk bumping off an FBI agent just for revenge at this point? Javi couldn't care less if his uncle rots in prison so who else would take her out?

Just no way Javi makes it to the end of this series, but who takes him out. You have to take a number, but the #1 choice has to be Ruth.

Quote from: LennG on February 22, 2022, 11:17:18 AM
I don't think so as we saw in the opening clip, the entire family is together, happy and leaving before the car crash.

I also thought Wendy would get to visit Ben, but it sure didn't seem that way.

True.

Will have to wait and see. I

Quote from: LennG on February 22, 2022, 11:25:58 AM

Ha Tim, you have been spending more time than the rest of us thinking this out. great questions.

Whatever business there is left from Darlene and Wyatt, Rugh has a 1/4 share so now it is hers. Does anyone think she will try and make a go of it may be with Frank Jr?

I agree, Maya shouldn't make it past the next few episodes, but who is going to take her out? The only ones really pissed at her are the Byrds and Omar and since he has backed away from the cartel and wants to go straight, would he risk bumping off an FBI agent just for revenge at this point? Javi couldn't care less if his uncle rots in prison so who else would take her out?

Just no way Javi makes it t o the end of this series, but who takes him out. You have to take a number, but the #1 choice has to be Ruth.

Since we just finished Breaking Bad and El Camino, I've been thinking about how they will end Ozark. Some T's need to be crossed and I's dotted by the end. No doubt the writers learned from the clumsy Sopranos and Dexter series finales.

Javi definitely dies... just don't know who takes him out. I disagree that he doesn't care about Omar. Remember: Family before all, or something like that Omar said to Javi back in Mexico.

Another thought about Mel the PI is that he seems to be more into finding Helen than just a PI looking for her to sign divorce papers. I think he may be related to her which is why he's so adamant about finding her. Another twist is that he could be familiar with Javi from his investigations into Helen back in Chicago. That last part is just purely speculation on my part. Just trying to connect the dots. Javi is Omar's nephew and Helen was Omar's lawyer... She had to have known of Javi so there's a connection there.

Tim

I may be wrong but I thought Omar wasn't a fan of Javi. Yes they are related and he did say what you said about family, but didn't he also tell others Javi was looking to take over the cartel and he wouldn't trust him one bit?. He was very wary of Javi .

Quote from: LennG on February 22, 2022, 03:29:22 PM
Tim

I may be wrong but I thought Omar wasn't a fan of Javi. Yes they are related and he did say what you said about family, but didn't he also tell others Javi was looking to take over the cartel and he wouldn't trust him one bit?. He was very wary of Javi .

Omar wasn't a fan of Javi because Javi is uber-ambitious and felt Omar was getting old and soft. Omar admitted that he wouldn't have rigged the money truck to kill FBI agents. Omar was wary of Javi because Javi was ready to take over. I didn't get the sense that Javi had any animosity towards his uncle other than he felt Omar was just getting old and soft. He definitely didn't trust Marty and Wendy as much as Omar did.

S4 Part 2 available on April 29th!

Edit to add the teaser trailer

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5BE2jbszzM

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Quote from: T200 on February 24, 2022, 07:48:11 AM
S4 Part 2 available on April 29th!

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Ahhh, decisions, decisions... do we watch Ozark that we've waited for forever. Or do we watch the NFL draft???  :-??

Quote from: Jolly Blue Giant on February 24, 2022, 08:02:40 AM
Ahhh, decisions, decisions... do we watch Ozark that we've waited for forever. Or do we watch the NFL draft???  :-??

The televised draft is more about the talking heads than the actual draft picks. Stretching it out an extra day is just a money grab.

I'll pause Ozark when the Giants are on the clock

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Quote from: T200 on January 31, 2022, 04:02:40 PM
One thing I've been mulling around in my head is the prominence of the women in power positions:

Wendy
Ruth
Darlene
Helen
Maya
Maya's boss

There was even mention of Omar's sister, Javi's mom, during one of their conversations. I have to wonder if she is pulling any strings behind the scenes. Is she higher up on Navarro Cartel's food chain?

Having seen the teaser, I caught this... could it be Javi's mom that Marty is talking to?

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220224/5c5c685845897f149451e09893f30e52.jpg)

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WOW

And I thought we were going to have to wait until the Fall to see how it all ends. April is just a shade away.

Good pick up Tim. I never would have recognized her.

The thought of trying to watch all 7 episodes as soon as they drop in a way id dissappointing. Yes, I can't wait but then it's all over all too soon. Sometimes I wish they dropped them one a week to keep us talking about it for a couple of months.