What would you offer the Vikings for JJ if the rumor is true?
https://x.com/NFL_DovKleiman/status/1898041275288338808
Of course, there's no way of knowing... but I'd be curious to know why they passed on him last year.
- Did they feel he didn't meet the value at 6?
- Would they have picked him if he was available in R2?
If the answers to both are 'Yes', then I'd be open to giving a 2nd rounder for him.
Quote from: T200 on March 07, 2025, 01:11:01 PMOf course, there's no way of knowing... but I'd be curious to know why they passed on him last year.
- Did they feel he didn't meet the value at 6?
- Would they have picked him if he was available in R2?
If the answers to both are 'Yes', then I'd be open to giving a 2nd rounder for him.
Mike Garafolo (who is still well connected with the Giants) recently speculated that Schoen may have passed on JJ because he didn't believe he could handle the pressure of the NYC media.
Quote from: MightyGiants on March 07, 2025, 01:13:04 PMMike Garafolo (who is still well connected with the Giants) recently speculated that Schoen may have passed on JJ because he didn't believe he could handle the pressure of the NYC media.
That's an option as well and, if that were the case, I'd then pass.
Whole bunch to consider.
1) if the Josh Rosen trade once Kyler Murray was drafted is a comp, probably a 3rd and 5th gets it done.
2) if Vikings want the #3 pick, doubt there is any interest given that JJ has one less year left on his rookie deal.
3) I have to assume if Darnold re-signs, JJ may ask to be traded.
I'd go as low as a 2nd rounder for JJ but I'd hold onto the #3 pick. Pro Bowl players are rarely traded for 1st round draft picks much less top 10 draft picks
Quote from: Philosophers on March 07, 2025, 01:18:29 PMWhole bunch to consider.
1) if the Josh Rosen trade once Kyler Murray was drafted is a comp, probably a 3rd and 5th gets it done.
2) if Vikings want the #3 pick, doubt there is any interest given that JJ has one less year left on his rookie deal.
3) I have to assume if Darnold re-signs, JJ may ask to be traded.
I'd go as low as a 2nd rounder for JJ but I'd hold onto the #3 pick. Pro Bowl players are rarely traded for 1st round draft picks much less top 10 draft picks
JJ is damaged goods at this point. I heard he lost quite a bit of weight while recovering from the knee injury. I liked JJ last year. If he can pass a physical, I would offer up the first pick in the 3rd round for him. I might do a pick swap in round 2 if that was needed to sweeten the deal.
A common refrain by draftniks is if JJ was available in this draft he would be the first player off the board.
I'd be super happy with trading our 2nd pick. Grabbing hunter or Carter at 3, JJ and Malik, I'd be pretty happy. Of course we still need to build the trenches on both sides
I would not give a 1 or 2 for JJ
I'd give a 3 but that would never happen.
Quote from: MightyGiants on March 07, 2025, 01:21:55 PMJJ is damaged goods at this point. I heard he lost quite a bit of weight while recovering from the knee injury. I liked JJ last year. If he can pass a physical, I would offer up the first pick in the 3rd round for him. I might do a pick swap in round 2 if that was needed to sweeten the deal.
A common refrain by draftniks is if JJ was available in this draft he would be the first player off the board.
I agree. That seems reasonable. You're losing a year off the rookie deal and he's coming off a fairly major knee injury. It's a big risk. So your proposal seems to be about as high as I would go too.
The Vikings to be honest would be better off waiting. If Darnold is the starter, JJ will get a lot of preseason snaps. If he lights it up, those offers go up. If he stinks, which seems unlikely but can't be ruled out, they have a cheap backup who gets to watch and learn and develop. I wouldn't be in a rush to unload him if I were them.
Quote from: Gmo11 on March 07, 2025, 01:50:05 PMI agree. That seems reasonable. You're losing a year off the rookie deal and he's coming off a fairly major knee injury. It's a big risk. So your proposal seems to be about as high as I would go too.
The Vikings to be honest would be better off waiting. If Darnold is the starter, JJ will get a lot of preseason snaps. If he lights it up, those offers go up. If he stinks, which seems unlikely but can't be ruled out, they have a cheap backup who gets to watch and learn and develop. I wouldn't be in a rush to unload him if I were them.
The only problem in waiting is acquiring JJ would impact draft choices. JJ has franchise QB potential so if they make the trade they can focus on the trenches and maybe a day 3 flyer on one of the developmental type QBs
Meniscus tear surgeries are not structural. He is far from damaged goods. So whatbif he lost weight. He's 21-22. Hit the gym and he's 15 pounds bigger in a month.
I dont believe Darnold will be re-signed. I think Kevin O'Connell will say, "I coached up Darnold like no man ther coach has. I can do the same with JJ and we use the Darnold money elsewhere."
Except no one including O'Connell, knows what you're going to get from JJ.
Everyone is so quick to anoint this kid just based on his surprisingly high draft position.
I can tell you as a BIG10 fan, JJ had his moments, but he was no top 10 pick and he wasn't a consistent producer. He leaned heavily into a great UM run game. He never carried the team on his back.
I think when O'Connell drafted him, he thought he could develop him into a solid QB in 2 years. Except he lost one of those years when the kid went down last year.
Landing McCarthy might be a better option than moving up to draft Ward first overall. Ward is the only quarterback in this class that makes sense in the top three so to be able to draft the BPA at third overall and get a future quarterback for a second this year and possibly our third next year would be manna from heaven, which is precisely why it won't happen as we have no good luck, unlike Howie Roseman.
Jordon Love was drafted in 2020 and didn't start until 2023. For you Rodgers advocates, remember his remark that it's not his job to develop a QB. The kid worked hard on his own and became a pretty good starter. That may be the plan for the Vikings.
Quote from: Gmo11 on March 07, 2025, 01:50:05 PMI agree. That seems reasonable. You're losing a year off the rookie deal and he's coming off a fairly major knee injury. It's a big risk. So your proposal seems to be about as high as I would go too.
The Vikings to be honest would be better off waiting. If Darnold is the starter, JJ will get a lot of preseason snaps. If he lights it up, those offers go up. If he stinks, which seems unlikely but can't be ruled out, they have a cheap backup who gets to watch and learn and develop. I wouldn't be in a rush to unload him if I were them.
Where this major knee surgery started is anyone's guess. He had meniscus surgery, like many of us. It is minor surgery and takes 4 weeks to recover. If there is nothing else wrong he could pass a physical with flying colors.
If he were available in this year's draft, where would he be drafted? #1? behind Ward or ahead of him? If anyone thinks he would be drafted ahead of Ward, then why shouldn't we offer a #1 for him? If we decide to move up in the draft for Ward, we will give up a lot more than a #1 draft pick for that move.
In a hearbe at I would do a #2 and another lower round pick and take BPA at #3.
Quote from: T200 on March 07, 2025, 01:11:01 PMOf course, there's no way of knowing... but I'd be curious to know why they passed on him last year.
- Did they feel he didn't meet the value at 6?
- Would they have picked him if he was available in R2?
If the answers to both are 'Yes', then I'd be open to giving a 2nd rounder for him.
Pretty sure they passed on him because they knew Nabers was an easy, low risk pick. And they still had a year with the great Danny Dimes under contract. If Maye or Daniels were there they would have taken them because they were less of a gamble than McCarthy. Picking McCarthy at 6 would have been scrutinized while no one debated Nabers talent.
Not exactly the same situation, but similar enough to remind us of the dilemma which confronted Schoen as consequence of Daniel Jones's sudden regular season and playoff game winning success after 3 previous with a cumulative 12-25 QBRec. And that's without considering any sort of thumbing of the scale from Daboll's COTY or Mara seeing his next Eli in DJ.
So, do we think that after 6 seasons with a 21-35 QBRec, the Vikes have discovered the real Sam Darnold, the one who was suddenly nearly unbeatable until a glitch in his final 2 games? If they don't keep him and he goes on to be a championship-level QB for someone else, hell to pay wouldn't do it justice.
Without comparing him to Daniel Jones- have previously so- or imagining anything similar going forward, there is nevertheless the possibility of a Darnold reversion to the mean. Of course, unlike the Giants, the Vikings have had McCarthy as their QB1 starter-in-waiting for the past year now. Thus, the dilemma if there is to be one, may be in choosing between Darnold and McCarthy if they don't decide to keep both and the big bucks involved.
Cheers!
We can parse phrases all we want from Schoen or Dabs but we have no idea what they would have done at 6 under various scenarios. Maybe they just loved Nabers. If so, great decision. He's delivered. Wr need a QB. We will find one.
Quote from: katkavage on March 07, 2025, 04:56:44 PMPretty sure they passed on him because they knew Nabers was an easy, low risk pick. And they still had a year with the great Danny Dimes under contract. If Maye or Daniels were there they would have taken them because they were less of a gamble than McCarthy. Picking McCarthy at 6 would have been scrutinized while no one debated Nabers talent.
It's anyone's guess. As I said, we may never know.
In all honesty, I think Minny would be foolish to trade him barring a king's ransom for him.
https://x.com/TomPelissero/status/1898373561590448150
KOC wants to prove he can develop another QB into a productive starter. Management will give him that chance.
Saw this article about what JJ was doing during the 2024 season. Good read. He is not sitting idle.
https://www.thedickinsonpress.com/sports/pro/will-vikings-hand-keys-over-to-j-j-mccarthy#:~:text=After%20he%20reportedly%20lost%20more,is%20back%20over%20200%20pounds.