Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: sooners56 on January 14, 2024, 05:13:37 PMYou may just want to skip over this post and find a post more to your liking. But anyways, I thought it was obvious but I guess not. OBJ and Kelce are known commodities which is why I used them as examples. I feel like Nabers is an OBJ clone and Bowers is a Kelce clone.

I thought it was a fairly straightforward question. If Nabers reaches his ceiling (OBJ) and Bowers reaches his ceiling (Kelce), which would you rather add to next season's offense. It's a legitimate question.

Nabers and it's not close.

As for the hypothetical, if we're talking about 2014-2016 OBJ and not factoring in off-field, then I'm taking OBJ over any TE ever. Imagine if the Giants passed on OBJ in the draft and he somehow made it to the Saints that year. Working with a prime Drew Brees he would've rewritten the record books.

So McFadden is the only one who graded as average. Every else was below average. The four OL picks were among the lowest grades.

The question of how much is on coaching and how much in talent is the right question to ask. It's ultimately up to Joe Schoen to figure it out and find a way to improve things.

Classic 

Quote from: nb587 on January 12, 2024, 10:37:07 PMWhat type of CEO would you call Belichick?

Here are a couple videos I recommend if you have the time. Michael Lombardi has forgotten more football than I'll ever know. I also recommend his books.

One of the points Lombardi makes often on his podcast is that the league has focused on hiring talented coordinators as head coaches at the expense of leaders. Being a great head coach is about much more than gameplans and play calling. It's about having a vision, articulating that vision, and commanding the room in a way that others want to follow you. It's similar to the criteria that companies should be looking for when hiring a CEO.

https://youtu.be/VM5mcyiMdoI?si=pdGFU34egJX-ACJx

https://youtu.be/LAkHZ7hQgtk?si=HgIfRuCJZYqT6WrK

This is why I worry about Daboll's temperament long-term. Winning solves everything until it doesn't. Then you're left with a chicken and egg scenario. Did the losing cause the dysfunction? Or, did the dysfunction cause the losing? Bottom line, you need a true CEO head coach if you want to sustain success.

Quote from: TDToomer on January 12, 2024, 11:58:46 AMLOL so they just renamed the Special Teams player category on the ballot. 

This seems important to you. You should write a letter to the NFL.

This is all very discouraging. Wink being gone is a positive based on the information that's come out. But Daboll seems to have his own issues that he needs to overcome. He has to "grow up" in a sense, if his internal wiring even allows for that.

To the point of winning as a cure all, I agree that winning is an excellent deodorant. But it doesn't necessarily cure what's rotten. The point is to win, so if you're winning no one cares about the grievances of certain individuals.

But are we talking about winning Super Bowls, despite clashing personalities? If so, then everyone will sign up for that. Or, are we talking about a team that can win some games but continually fails in the playoffs because, at least in part, key staff are either not aligned, don't trust each other, or otherwise have issues working together.

I think the concerns with Daboll's personality are legit and something he's going to have to work on if he wants to succeed in NY.

Quote from: TDToomer on January 11, 2024, 09:53:26 AMHow are the not specialists? They specialize in all aspects of the Special Teams lineups right?

No, specialists do one thing and aren't considered interchangeable. There are 5 specialist jobs on special teams.. kicker, punter, kick returner, punt returner, and long snapper. Everyone else is considered a "core" player.

Agreed. It seems like we recently closed out an era of iconic QBs and now we're seeing the same with legendary coaches.

Quote from: MightyGiants on January 11, 2024, 09:19:39 AMWell put, although I couldn't help but note the glaring irony that NYG aired every single dirty linen they had while at the same time complaining that Wink didn't keep things "inhouse".

Lol, we're on the same wavelength. I thought the same thing. I suppose all is fair in love and war, etc. I'm assuming these leaks are sanctioned by Mara. Goes back to your point about knowing who signs your paycheck.

I think Wink has handled himself poorly. But I do appreciate how he values his personal freedom over money. Not many people would be willing to walk away from $3 million. To me there is honor in that. Possibly stupidity, who knows, maybe he has something better lined up, or maybe he just understands his dollar value in this league.

Either way, I don't see this as a major loss for the Giants. They could do worse than Wink but I don't see him as being irreplaceable or even very difficult to replace... at least based on the defense's poor performance over the last two seasons.

I have to say I find the Giants point of view to be totally fair. That said, the standard playbook for the Giants is to manipulate fan opinion through the media, so who really knows what went on in the building.

Bottom line for me is Daboll is HC, Wink was DC. If you can't work within the chain of command structure, then you shouldn't be here. Particularly if you're a position coach.

Daboll gets his way in the end but I don't see this as a win for Daboll. I think he's expended just about any political capital he had left. If next season gets off to a bad start, the fan base is going to turn on him fiercely. Daboll's back is now against the wall. He has to win now or likely lose his job. That's my read on the situation based on the info I've seen so far.

Quote from: TDToomer on January 10, 2024, 08:50:04 PMSo... a Specials Teams player. Weird terminology.

I think it's supposed to differentiate them from the specialists.

Quote from: TDToomer on January 10, 2024, 08:06:00 PMWhat's a Core Teamer?

Core 4 are kickoffs, punts, and the two coverage teams.