Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: Woody on October 07, 2023, 08:56:05 AMstill remember Hebert did not want to come to Giants. Period.

Huh?  I don't remember seeing that or reading that anywhere.

Quote from: MightyGiants on October 07, 2023, 09:04:09 AMI had previously identified a lack of intellectual consistency as the reason Mike Lombardi failed as a GM.  His last podcast showed that shortcoming quite vividly.  Immediately after using DJ's bad game as proof that Jones is a bad quarterback and the Giants were foolish to have re-signed him, he goes on to make a huge number of excuses as to why Joe Burrow was performing worse than Daniel Jones.  Apparently a lack of protection is a legit reason for a QB's bad performance when talking about Burrow, but not for Jones (who has an even worse offensive line)

Here's the difference Joe Burrow's last two seasons he threw for around 4,500 yards and 35 TD's.  When has Daniel Jones ever come close to putting up a season like that?

Quote from: nicky1000 on October 07, 2023, 09:18:38 AMIf we didn't draft Jones would we have had Haskins?

No idea if another team in front of the Giants that year would have taken Jones.  The teams in front of them (excluding Arizona who took Murray) all were pretty set at QB so it would have been another team after them trading up to take Jones.  Think it's pretty clear the Mara and Gettleman were locked in on taking Jones.

Quote from: DragonSoul on October 06, 2023, 10:44:04 PMI guess you missed how well burrow & Cinci have played this year. Saw his last game and he looked bad vs that defense when the oline was an open flood gate. Reminded me of watching DJ & the Giants.

Pass YdsYds/Att   Att   Cmp   Cmp %   TD   INT   Rate   1st   1st%   20+   40+   Lng   Sck   SckY
DJ 765   5.8   131   90   68.7   2   6   69.7   35   26.7   8   1   58   22   131

JB 728  4.8   151   87   57.6   2   2   69.1   36   23.8   4   1   43   8   64

DJ actually has slightly better numbers & no number 1 wr unlike JB & look at the sacked diff. DJ is nearly sacked 3x more. And 2 ints that DJ has were SB giveaways. Thanks for brining up burrow.

Come back when Daniel Jones puts up a full regular season that Burrow has put up in each of the last two seasons then we can talk about comparing him to Burrow.  The QB's Jones should be compared to are players like Alex Smith, Geno Smith, Jimmy Garoppolo and Derek Carr.  That's the level he's on until proven otherwise.

Quote from: Woody on October 07, 2023, 08:42:18 AMWhere do you get the game tape is something different than the TV broadcast?

It's not any different.  Take a look at any of the analysis that is done after each game.

Looking at this site there doesn't appear to be a glossary for the statistic and how they calculate it.  I have never even heard of this site as it appears to be be a fantasy football database.

https://data.fantasypoints.com/nfl/tools/player/passing-advanced

Quote from: JT39 on October 06, 2023, 04:45:55 PMI asked if I can post the link from another website. I don't know what the rules are.

And I told you what it is. Percentage of throws to their first target. How is this difficult to understand?

Huh?  Do you not see all of the links that are shared here?  Post it and the source for the information if it's legit BF.

Quote from: JT39 on October 06, 2023, 04:39:56 PMThat the narrative by players, social media experts, and certain posters that Jones only throws to his first read is wrong. It's league average. And last year it was well below league average.

Huh?  That's not what I asked.  What I asked was what stat are you talking about?  Meaning what does it measure?  Does it measure frequency of times a QB goes to their first read, accuracy of them going to their first read, etc.?

You might want to provide some sort of link so we know what it measures and where the source is coming from.

https://twitter.com/art_stapleton/status/1710386408160989254?s=61

Quote from: JT39 on October 06, 2023, 04:15:15 PMIf the mods will allow me to link from a different Giants website... a poster just posted something that is pretty interest and debunks some opinions here.

Jones ranks 14th in the NFL this year in throwing to his first read.

He also ranked 40th last year.

So this notion seems more myth than reality.

What stat are you talking about?  Is it how often a QB throws to their first read, their accuracy throwing to their first read, etc.?

https://twitter.com/talkingiants/status/1710373540355064233?s=61

I'm not the biggest fans of these two but they do bring up a valid point here.

I'll just stick with the defensive side of the ball.  I would love to see them get the basics down in this game with limiting missed tackles.  When you've been as poor fundamentally as that unit has been you have to go back to and just get the simple basic task of not missing so many tackles.

No way that ball gets to Hyatt.  Need another player in the middle as Jones's check down or underneath route for him to go too cause there is little chance he's throwing to Hyatt.

Quote from: DragonSoul on October 06, 2023, 01:34:03 PMNice job with the common sense. Most seem to be lacking. Get hit 30 times a game, you get shell shocked like David Carr did in Houston. Then ur internal clock is sped way up and you trust nothing. Which in turn makes you miss potential opportunities. Or you can stay in the pocket get drilled, then injured or a concussion as another option.

The line will finally be fixed when we we have no QB who can play that position well. There will be an oline but no real qb. Now we have a QB & when we had Eli & no oline.

QB's like Burrow and Herbert have no issue sitting in the pocket stepping into throws taking a hit while making plays.  Seems like that leaves a QB just as vulnerable as it does taking off and running where you are open to taking hits. No?

Quote from: President Rick on October 06, 2023, 01:34:36 PMmake a list of the qb's you'd rather have WHO ARE actually available to the Giants.
list those you'd not want in any event.
list those in college who will surely [offer proof!!!] be better in the nfl than jones.
add water, stir, and consider.

No one has the answer.

Don't know who will be better than Daniel Jones but it's clear Jones has his limitations and is only going to be so good.  That doesn't mean the fear stops you from moving on if you have the opportunity to draft a QB you love.  Having Kerry Collins who was a solid starting QB didn't stop the Giants from acquiring Eli Manning.

Quote from: JT39 on October 06, 2023, 01:32:36 PMSnap counts per game:
Hyatt: 36%, 21%, 32%. 60%
Campbell: 67%, 66%, 42%, 31%
Slayton: 67%, 82%, 84%, 88%

I dont use one game samples. Big picture is what matters. And before you accuse me of dismissing robinson, I didnt include his numbers because he is on a pitch count and think he needs to play as much as possible as soon as possible.

There is absolutely 0 reason for Slayton to play as much as he does. 

Now you're moving the goal posts when it was shown that what you said wasn't true you bring up games where one Robinson wasn't active and second Hyatt is a rookie still learning the offense.

Looks to be like Hyatt is trending towards more snaps which you would expect a rookie to get more snaps as the season moves along and the same thing for Robinson.  Also looks to be like Campbell is trending in the opposite direction of getting fewer snaps.

Bottom line guys like Robinson and Hyatt are getting more snaps each week and need to be fed the ball.  Can't have a situation like Monday night where Campbell is seeing more targets than Hyatt despite Hyatt getting almost double the number of snaps.

Quote from: umassgrad on October 06, 2023, 01:26:55 PMDid Darren Waller forget how to get open once he joined the Giants?

The game tape has shown Waller has been open plenty.  But again we're talking about NFL Open not ACC Open.