Big Blue Huddle

I may be in the minority but I think Daboll and Kafka may have OVER-achieved given the level of QB play they've been handed.  You could say Jones' regression is on them but the regression was only back to his previously established level of play.  The outlier was last year when they pulled more out of him than seemingly possible. 

This year Jones stunk out loud, and then Taylor and Devito, while better than Jones, have also been mostly awful.  In the league today if your QB stinks you aren't going to score a lot of points and you're not going win. We can look around and say he should have called these plays or those plays but devito is still the one running those plays and that OL is still going to be the ones blocking for him.  I don't think we could legitimately expect more than what we've seen.

Even the Jets game where they refused to let Devito throw a pass, likely due to his 0 practice reps to that point in the season he'd taken, they were in position to win the game if the kicker had 2 functioning legs or the defense could stop Zach Wilson one more time.  So the decision worked.  Had Devito aired it out and thrown 3 miserable INTs they lose by 3 TDs.  This strategy kept them in the game and put them in prime position to win.

So I'm not of the mind that either of them deserve to be fired after this season.  I want to see them with a real qb. Which likely means drafting one this April.  If they take Daniels and he doesn't look any better than Jones or can't understand the plays, I'll be right here saying fire his ass but today, as things stand, I don't know how much we could have really asked of him.

Quote from: 4 Aces on December 20, 2023, 01:13:05 PMI absolutely do, from afar. But I have no idea what orders he's taking from his boss either. Same with Wink - what specifically are he and Daboll fighting about? Is he being ordered to play more zone than his usual man (for example)? Is he doing what he's asked? Is he not? We have no idea. For all, I know, Kafka feels exactly the same as I do but isn't allowed to carry out his vision.

That said - this offense is a joke. The scheme is pedestrian, the play-calling sucks, other teams are sitting all over everything we've done all year with zero meaningful adjustments. Every week, we trot out the same basic handful of plays like it's a preseason game. Shotgun heavy, throwing the ball around like we're Peyton's Colts. It's ridiculous.

If I was in charge, we'd have a Parcells/Coughlin power running offense with deep shot play action built in. That's the scheme that works here, we've got 4 Lombardi's in the case, and there's still no defending it. It's not guaranteed to work, but it gives you a shot.

Mike Kafka is running Brian Daboll's offense. Sure, fire him I guess, but to me, that doesn't fix the overall problem.

And in your estimation power running behind this OL that can't pick up a basic stunt would prove to be successful? 

Quote from: katkavage on December 19, 2023, 05:47:06 PMThe only certainly I have of the top 5 picking a QB is New England. Not sold Chicago or Washington will. A trade changes everything.

One certainty I have is that Caleb Williams is going #1.  If the Bears were to decide they don't want to take a QB they will trade that pick for a king's ransom to a team that will.  Agreed on the Patriots taking a QB as well.  Washington is a bit of a wild card.  I'm not 100% convinced they will but I would if I were them.  So that's why I think the Giants are gonna have to likely trade up a couple of spots if they do want to take a QB.

Quote from: katkavage on December 19, 2023, 05:05:32 PMUnless they make a trade, they won't get either of them. Daniels is in their range though.

He should be their target at this point.  They've played themselves out of a top 3 pick and it does seem likely that the top 3 will be either Williams/Maye/Harrison or Williams/Maye/Daniels depending on the final order.  If they end up 4 or 5 they should definitely do what they can to get in a spot to take one of those QBs.  It won't be cheap but it will be worth it if they pick the right guy.

Quote from: BluesCruz on December 19, 2023, 04:43:22 PMWatch it again there was helmet to helmet I believe.  I'll give you the defender needs time to pull up but you cannot target and helmet anyone, QB or no QB

Nah...square in the shoulder pad and then his head bounced off the turf.  I still would have thrown the flag cause it did seem a bit late like he might have been able to at least jump over him rather than blast him but the refs did not agree.

He didn't get hit in the head so really it comes down to was the hit avoidable or not.  Defenders are given a little bit of a break so a QB can't just slide a millisecond before the defender gets there to add 15 yards to the run.  You have to give the defense enough time to actually stop.  The refs on the field and the ref that Fox has all seemed to think there wasn't enough time to pull up.  I kinda thought otherwise myself but I'm not a referee.

Depends on who is replacing him.  I don't blame him for Jones getting hurt.  Or for giving Jones that money in the first place.  There's only so much you can do with the hand they've been dealt. If Jones is going to play that poorly there's not a coach alive that's gonna look like they're worth a crap.

Having said that if Daboll sees another coach that's been let go that he would rather work with for whatever reason then fine.  I don't know what's going on behind the scenes.  But for me this season is mostly a wash due to Jones being hurt for half the year and totally miserable for the other half. 

Quote from: Ed Vette on December 18, 2023, 11:40:32 AMThe more I reflect the more I lay this ass kicking on the entire Coaching Staff.

I just can't do that.  They have an undrafted 3rd string QB playing and they managed to win 3 games in a row with that guy.  Coaching probably had a little something to do with that.  So they forgot how to coach this week?  They are doing the best they can with this circumstance but there's only so much they can do.  They won't be winning any games unless the opponent helps them out.  For 3 game in a row they got that extra help...yesterday they didn't.  So they lost.  I don't believe any different play calls any different blitzes or coverages or anything else would have changed that result unless Carr just decided to throw it to the wrong team a couple teams.

Quote from: coggs on December 18, 2023, 10:31:53 AMSo, you are accepting a loss on opening day next year?

Not if Daniels is starting!

Turns out when the opponent doesn't make monumentally stupid turnovers multiple times a game it's harder to win huh? Kayvon still catching strays for no good reason aside...of course they're not going to be successful against the eagles or really any other opponent the rest of the season. Devito didn't play and worse than the previous 3 weeks...he is who he is
.. The difference was this week the opposition didn't shoot themselves in the foot over and over again.

This is what that team looks like when Herbert is dragging those bums to respectability!  That team is hot garbage.  Happy for Antonio Pierce though.  I'll always be rooting for that guy...except when he's coaching against the Giants of course.  They better give him that damn job full time after the season by the way.

Maybe I'm making this up in my head but does it seem to anybody else that disproportionately with this team or rather with Igor in particular that once a puck gets by him more often than not another one is coming within the next 3 mins?  Even if the first one wasn't his fault.  I just get this pit in my stomach after a shot goes in where I'm like crap here comes another.  And I could be totally wrong but so often I see a team score, I see Igor sad, and can't help but brace on the next shot until I see him actually make the save.

Quote from: TDToomer on December 12, 2023, 08:48:46 AMWith his and Hyatts speed why aren't we calling more duo post & fly route plays.

Two things...lack of pass protection holding up long enough to get the guys downfield and open along with QB play of which Jones refused to throw deep and Devito does but just without the elite arm strength/accuracy to do it consistently. I think the way they're handling this is about as good as we can ask.  Don't make this kid have to go and win games on his own, let him play within himself with what he is capable of doing and hope the defense wins the games which...has been working.

Quote from: BluesCruz on December 12, 2023, 07:39:15 AMIf I might inject.....that is a strange thing to say about a QB who is improving by the game

Has us on a playoff possible trajectory and has everyone in the organization turned around

What would you like to see?  Walk on water?

Yesterday was extremely windy and did not lend itself to long downfield passing which I predict will be his next transformation. Who thought he could run the ball like that? He has a magical arm. Elite? Close enough

If you want to call someone out its Barkley
He fails to advance the ball on 80% of his carries, cannot break a tackle and yesterday fumbled the ball with no one near him nearly costing us the game

Tommy had to pull one more rabbit out of his hat to correct that hot mess.

Barkley should be part of a rotation.  This desire to keep him out there for 99% of the snaps despite his faults is mindboggling- making Tomy's job unnecessarily more difficult

I submit our inability to sustain drives comes directly from Barkleys inability to run to a manageable 3rd down attempt.  We are always in 3rd and long

Barkley literally broke through a tackle to score one of his...checks notes...two TDs in the game.  He screwed up at the end but there wouldn't be an end to screw up if not for him.

Your cousin Tommy is not playing great...he's just not the train wreck the Giants were dealing with before.  If not for a ridiculous amount of turnovers by the opposition these past few weeks they'd still be losing games.  It's not like the offense is carrying this team, if anything the defense is. That last TD was the first time I looked at him and thought THAT is what a QB should look like.  And it's great that he did it.  But we are far away from handing him the keys to the castle.

Quote from: kingm56 on December 12, 2023, 12:58:39 AMI'm trying to decipher if this thread is more about DJ than Devito.  To be clear, you would start the latter over the former?

With each win it becomes more and more likely that next year that will be the choices: Jones or Devito. And if those are the only two options available to me I'm picking Devito.