Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: Rambo89 on October 09, 2023, 01:58:31 PMEd if I may I did find this.  So RT is correct about his concern about the line.  But was also incorrect at the reaction to his concern which wasn't as harsh as it was portrayed.  The response to his point were made were about the amount of resources the Giants have and that pouring more resources into the line would have come at a cost of other needs they had and still have.

The abuse came when I stated I don't see why fans have trust with Schoen and Dabs after just one season especially without improving the oline during this off season.
Thanks for trying and you weren't one of the assholes. 

Quote from: Ed Vette on October 09, 2023, 01:44:42 PMThere was plenty of Oline discussion and concerns.

https://giantsfans.net/message_board/index.php?topic=65809.0
https://giantsfans.net/message_board/index.php?topic=65777.15
https://giantsfans.net/message_board/index.php?topic=66102.15
https://giantsfans.net/message_board/index.php?topic=66265.0
https://giantsfans.net/message_board/index.php?topic=66405.0

Thanks for trying but like I said I have nothing to prove and now I'm just coming off as a whining XXXXXXX. My responses were in August and those were earlier.
Enjoy the moment..

Quote from: Ed Vette on October 09, 2023, 12:57:38 PMThen you would be vindicated. Please show us the posts.

How do I search?

Quote from: Ed Vette on October 09, 2023, 11:09:38 AMWhy is it that our little group of Informed Fans knew that there was a failure to upgrade the Offensive Line this offseason with only the drafting of a starting Center? The Giants did not.


Very disappointing. Five Head Coaches and three GM's later and this Offensive line remains Offensive.
 

I'm call xxxxxxxx with the fans out here knowing this could happen!
I joined maybe a month before the season and made claims I don't "trust Scoen or Dabs because they did very little to upgrade the oline and wasted $10 million on two average WRs instead of investing that capital to the oline.

I was called stupid and a troll for making these posts from a handful of the regulars out here.
I hate that I was correct but never in could've imagined they would be this bad!

Time to restart the rebuild this off season which means a few more years of not being competitive with the better teams!

With a top 2 a QB
After that I would go pass rusher

Brightwell hasn't shown me to be a good enough player and when he starts adding the penalties I would like to see him released.

Quote from: fromthebside on October 04, 2023, 10:24:23 AMHe's worth it more than Jones.  Barkley is a proven commodity.  When he's on, he is a weapon.  Get him in space and he'll get you yardage.  He makes the play action work.  Right now, there is no threat of a run game or any threat coming out of the backfield.  But on the flip side, he has a high ankle sprain and isn't playing again. 

Come on now it's fine to make a mistake and sign Barkley long-term because another mistake of a long-term contract was signed by another player

Quote from: fromthebside on October 04, 2023, 10:01:03 AMHe didn't have to sign him to that big deal.  He should have let him test free agency if he was asking for more than he was worth.  People have this notion that what he got was the going rate for QBs.  You pay the player, not the position.  He was never worth the contract.  They should have either franchised him or given him a 2-year 55 million dollar contract with incentives.  Now they're stuck with him till next year with a major chunk of the cap.  You could have signed Barkley long-term and it would have cost less than Jones' contract.  He's just not the guy.  He shows glimpses of good play and then turns around and makes bone head decisions.  The entire Giants organization needs to be questioned at this moment.

Barkley isn't worth a long-term deal either.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on October 04, 2023, 09:42:35 AMThe results are obviously not good enough right now but there are two parallel discussions (or critiques here). One is the idea that Schoen "hasn't done enough" to improve the O line. The other is that what Schoen has done for the line has not yet yielded satisfactory results. I think the latter is totally fair, but the former is not. In two offseason he has made big investments in the line. He spent the only money he had in the 2022 offseason on a free agent starting guard, and he used three picks including the 7th overall on the unit. And then he used a 2 on the line in this draft. He also gave a huge contract to the incumbent left tackle. How many of the 31 other franchises have invested ih their O lines more than that since the end of the 2021 season?

I will again disagree. They need to address it until they actually fix it!
Glow was a mistake they need to be able to recognize and moved forward from him being a starter.
The left overs like Peart and the frenchman have never been good yet that's  who they went into the season with.
The Thomas contract has nothing to do with this conversation unless signing him has caused them a cap problem.

Just step back without looking at the investments and look at what the results were.
They were a real bad group and the only thing they did to improve it was to draft a center. They needed to address having back ups or god forbid bringing in some competition.
We've been watching this since 2011 as Giants fans and they have put high stock in draft picks during this span with only one good player to show for it.
When is it going to be time to make sure the group is functionable so they can be a decent offense? Is everyone fine with hoping the coaches can make these players servicable? It seems like other teams have been successful like the Hawks were on Monday so the issues could be with the coaching staff and blocking schemes.   

Quote from: Rambo89 on October 04, 2023, 09:44:29 AMThis is also the price you pay when you invest more cap space into the QB position.  It leaves you less cap space to address other area's on the roster.  Unless you wanted to let Jones walk and bring in someone to play QB with less of a cap hit it would have been impossible to make the additional investments you are talking about.  And like with the other big draft capital investments in the offensive line there is no guarantee you would have gotten better results.

What? Do you have a Jones agenda?

Quote from: Rambo89 on October 04, 2023, 09:08:51 AMSchoen has invested a ton of draft capital into the offensive line in just two seasons as GM.  You can critique them for not getting the ROI on those investments but you can't see they didn't do enough or haven't tried hard enough to address the offensive line.

I disagree and the bad results are now on display.
They only added a rookie Center this off season for a group that was in the bottom of the league the previous season.
Not signing a back up tackle instead of a couple of average WRs was a mistake as of now.

Quote from: Rambo89 on October 04, 2023, 08:08:46 AMI don't think it was so much trust of the new regime that they were going to get it right as it was a breath of fresh air being the Giants for the first time in 40 years hired an outsider with a different approach to team building.  There was (and still is) no guarantee they'll get it right but at least they were going about things in a different way rather than the old failed outdated approach.

You can sugar coat it but I voiced my concerns they didn't do enough with the oline this off season which could derail this season. It reminded me of the season that Getty didn't do anything either claiming they trust the players to improve. That seems a lot like the old fasion way to me.
I wonder if those fans are now trusting them. LOL

Quote from: MightyGiants on October 04, 2023, 07:52:00 AMRight now, Neal is looking Eric Flowers level bad in terms of a very high O-line draft bust

Flowers was the better player at this point in their careers.
I know that's not saying much but Flowers would have stretches of games where he didn't give up a sack. I have to admit I don't recall how many hurries he gave up though with Neal just looks so out matched at times.

When I 1st joined this place I was posting that I don't understand how fans could trust this new group after one magical season.
I was called a troll and a joke by a few regulars and now the team is setting records for being terrible.
I hope they can grow from this and learn from their mistakes becaue they will have a 3rd year minimum.

Quote from: Rambo89 on October 04, 2023, 07:03:47 AMNot all of these sacks on the offensive line

https://twitter.com/danorlovsky7/status/1709323680130494468?s=46

Ouch..
Thanks for posting this.