Big Blue Huddle

Everyone of us here have a right to be disappointed about not getting the last franchise grade QB in the draft. There is a reason QBs went 1-2-3 and then not another until pick 8 (and a surprise pick at that).

Short of that, Giants decided no QB outside of the top 3 was a clear upgrade to DJ. Whether they are right or wrong will be proven soon. We have the support pieces in place now at least in theory. An OL that was further addressed with veterans not rookies with learning curves , a legitimate OL coach and a day ready made WR1.

We as the Big Blue Fans of Folk Lore need to be rooting like heck for DJ . He is the guy with the highest talent upside of any of the QBs we have. Therefore, if he finally hits that ceiling with all the better support pieces that are in place , this team would be the best version of what it could be starting next year!

I hate to say it but Philly lost both a very good OC and DC the year before . Both were so good that the NFL teams hired them as their Head Coaches. Well guess what? That Roseman once again went for the gusto and brought in Fangio and Kellen Moore. He did a phenomenal job in not sticking with two guys that weren't performing but quickly pivoted two two proven coordinators with strong track records.

I think it's pointless to judge either Lock or DJ right now. I want to see what both look like with a better coached OL that is likely not coming close to giving up a historic 85 sacks and a WR core that now finally has what many think will be an elite WR1.

Too much muscle in a violent and sudden change of direction sport is not always a good thing. Aaron Wellman coming back hopefully will help with this faulty philosophy.

Quote from: MightyGiants on May 02, 2024, 11:59:48 AMKevin Cole

@Unexpected_Pts newsletter/pod. Previously Data Scientist @PFF, Director of Data & Analytics @RotoGrinders
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https://x.com/DanSchneierNFL/status/1786054520390266961

GM's generally shouldn't draft the lower impact positions top of round 1 (unless they have a HOF level grade and their 'greatness' transcends the lower impact of the position). However, once you get to round 2 and 35-40 picks in and you find a Kenny Phillips or a Xavier McKinney or a Chris Snee do you pass on them then too when they have a 10-year high level starter or multiple pro-bowls written all over them?


Secondly, the no-trades argument when Schoen has both traded up and traded down in the two drafts before AND it was quite evident they were heavily involved in trying to trade up for a QB in this one with an absolutely elite grade in Maye.

His argument is weak and seems like he is 'fishing ' to disparage Scheon and the Giants for click bait.

The 2nd part of Marc's quote should have been: 'But they certainly allow decent QBs to elevate their production.' or 'They certainly help prove who is a good QB or isn't'

Lombardi basically nixes NYG wanted Alt. Heard him say this morning if NYG really wanted to take Alt, they would have likely traded with Arizona and moved up to 4. Ossenfort was looking to trade but once Maye got drafted by NE, NYG was no longer interested in trading up. Arizona most likely still gets Harrison at 6 as LAC was going OL.

The leak to Schefter was supposedly to show public support for Jones

Hopefully its DJ having an equally good year behind a revamped OL and Pass catching game.

Don't know if this video was ever posted or viewed by many of those of Big Blue Folk Lore but when NYG first signed Bracillo so quickly at the outset of the off-season, I binged a bunch of videos and articles on him. I just stumbled on this one recently and its probably my favorite. If half of what this Raider beat who seems to know Bracillo quite well is true we got ourselves a winner. He follows a Hall of Fame line-up of former coaches such as: Mike Solari, Hal Hunter, Columbo, Gugliemo and Booby Johnson. The bar has been so low for so long we forgot what a good OL ball coach looks like.

Quote from: Thegratefulhead on April 30, 2024, 10:01:19 PMI think this is fair.  I wanted McCarthy at 6.  I feel Jones is an injury risk, yet, I have not seen the actual medicals and have not been present for his recovery.  From an above orbit, risk management standpoint, having Jones replacement on hand seemed valid. That said, in this offense in particular, Jones can succeed.  He can throw short passes to playmakers. The best Jones has had is crappy playmakers in a system designed to have them.  Daboll/Kafka system doesn't work without YAC.  I want to see the kid with an average OL and some playmakers.  I think his body ends up betraying him.  If Jones is healthy he will look good in this system I suspect with these playmakers.

Nabers is a beast, a true number 1 changes everything.

Jones threw down the field in Shurmur's offense and in Duke. His downfield passing according to advanced metrics was really good.

I would suspect with a Bracillo coached OL the guy who took average lines with NE and an injury riddled Raiders line last year to top 10-12 finishes gets these guys playing sound cohesively and much more technically sound as unit.

I heard an football guy once say you build your passing game like a basketball team. It's not a perfect comparison obviously but I love the analogy. Theo Johnson is your Center, Hodgins is your Power forward, Hyatt/Slayton are your 'undersized' speedy small forwards, Nabers is your electric do-it-all shooting guard, and Wan'Dale is your shifty jitterbug Point guard. A lot of gameplans can be formulated when you have so many receiving options with varied size and strengths to their games.

Jones has never had a WR corps like this not even close. In fact he has never had a receiving threat that was pro bowl caliber like ever. The walking corpses of Golden Dome Tate, Kenny 'on a Holiday' Golladay, Darren 'Hit A' Wall-er or Kyle the Red-nosed Reindeer doesn't count.

In theory, this should be a drastically better receiving group and a drastically better offensive line , if nothing because of coaching alone. No rookies starting on this line either.

Again, I present all this not because I guarantee Jones balls-out but quite simply now there is finally a reasonable opportunity in place that he could.

Quote from: Jolly Blue Giant on April 30, 2024, 04:12:02 PMIf we could pick more than one option, I'd click both 3T and boundary corner, as I see them equally important...probably the 3T more, just because we didn't draft any (maybe Casey Rogers will surprise  ). Unfortunately, this draft had some good 3Ts, but they were gone fast. We might have been able to get Wingo (not sure when he went, but it was much later than expected). I was hoping for Myles Cole who is listed as an ER, but was 6'5/295 and went late (7th rd to Jacksonville). I thought he could be groomed for 3T because of his size and being a successful ER

I would like a proven boundary corner, but also would like to see Flott and Hawkins III get plenty of reps to grow into the position. They don't learn the finer nuances of the position from the bench or in front of a white board. Still, a proven vet would be nice...especially if we were "going for it" this year (which I don't think we are)

I'm pretty happy where we're at and hope Daboll will allow the rookies to get their lumps by playing them. They need as much on-field experience as possible. It requires delayed gratification, which is in short supply among most fans, but I'm all for it. I'm not expecting a run for the Lombardi and would rather lose a couple of games we could have won, but got rookies plenty of time in the game

JOLLY by GOLLY!

Who needs another DT when we got this guy?!

Get to the 4th or 5th highlight.....shades of Steve DeOssie this guy (except at DT) 


https://youtu.be/orplWj79jdc?si=29Uu-a--2FRIL7F5

New coaches or GM's that come in that inherit players they tend to treat those players as 'step-children'

At first sign of trouble they want to get rid of them.

Guys they bring in as FAs are like 'adopted children'

And guys they draft are like 'biological children' 

See how McAdoo treated Eli, TC with Kerry as couple examples of many.

That said, I still expect it to be Daniel but if Drew becomes Daboll's new 'pet project' it will be interesting if bias enters in the decision making process.

Quote from: kartanoman on April 30, 2024, 09:23:15 AMTHANK YOU for taking the time, and investing much effort, into synthesizing your analysis which all of us, including me, greatly appreciate.

Everyone here offers fair opinions but commends your body of work.

My only feedback would be to "fully" complete your analysis by including the special teams. An All-Pro Kicker will be returning from knee surgery and, as one who had total knee replacement on the same knee as Gano's surgically repaired knee, it is far from automatic that he will return to his amazing self. In fact, I'm concerned he might go the way of Brad Daluiso following his knee surgery in 1999. Time will tell. But one of the more pleasing stories of 2023 was the overall improvement of the Scottish Hammer, Jamie Gillen. Every aspect of his game improved from his first year with the club and the hope is that he will continue to improve. Adding Gunner Olszewski to the team was the best in-season signing the Giants have made since Ottis Anderson in 1986. Think about that.

You have transformed our space here in a positive way in just a short period of time. Consider yourself a friend with all of us and certainly with me.

I've thoroughly enjoyed reading your posts; please keep posting with confidence!

Peace!

I appreciate your supplementary analysis on specials Kart. It was an ommision of impatience.   

I agree with everything you said. I'll add two things:

We have brought in numerous guys who can play specials and a couple intriguing options for KR/PR including Tracy, Phillips and maybe Dante '4.27' Miller.

I worry about the unknown of Ghobriel as a ST guy and lament we missed on getting Larry Izzo (we were blocked and then he was released like a week or two later)

Quote from: MightyGiants on April 30, 2024, 12:32:40 PMI have heard this claim come up, but frankly it's juts not accurate as this chart clearly shows.




How quickly the pressure arrives matters a great deal and clearly the other two QBs had it significantly better than Jones

Context, context context. Time to pressure is an extremely good stat to understand just how little time he actually had to throw. Over those 1st five games I'd be hard pressed just by the eyeball test in remembering any Giant QB that was barraged as quickly and consistently as he was in the last 40 something years.

Even on the low end if DJ is Jared Goff, Alex Smith, Kirk Cousins etc. even these guys were pretty successful when they had a functioning well coached OL and WRs. I don't think Daniel unless he is damaged goods at this point is a QB who just 'stinks'. I think his floor is a QB that can be effective if protected well and has quality targets to throw to. Maybe his floor is he doesn't elevate the players around him but with a Nabers and a better coached offensive line I think he can be productive.

Ceiling is us fans get to see what we saw vs. numerous team likes Vikes, Colts, Tampa (rookie year), Washington multiple times happen on a frequent more consistent basis. Those weren't just 'meh' performances but there were many high end QB plays in those games. He does have talent.