Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on November 20, 2023, 11:29:59 AMI hate to say this, but this is Yung Joka type behavior.

Banks needs to shut up. Nobody on a 3-8 team should be bragging about anything.

I mean...Banks plays good football and plays just about every week.  So not really like that Joka fella who does neither of those things.  I personally couldn't possibly care less what he needs to be motivated to play at the level he's played at this season as a rookie no less.  If he finds motivation sticking to the Commanders at every opportunity God bless him. 

If he actually was a crappy as, say, Deandre Baker and doing this then sure that would be pretty stupid.  But he's having an excellent season that's far and away better than the guy drafted ahead of him.  So as far as I'm concerned talk yo sh*t young man!

Quote from: MightyGiants on November 20, 2023, 11:42:56 AMFor what it's worth, and admittedly with limited scouting, Caleb seems like a boom or bust type prospect.  He has some special abilities (in terms of off-schedule throws) that could make him the best QB in the league.  There are some red flags (like his crying in the stands and the like) and there is the question of how good he is as a pocket passer (you need to be a serviceable pocket passer for the improv stuff to matter) that could lead to him being a bust.

To quote the late John Fassel, you are pushing all your chips into the middle of the table if you draft Williams.

I would gladly take that hand and go all in.  If he busts he busts but that's a hand you have to play and go all in with if you can.

It's nice to have competent LB play for a change!  Even one would have been an improvement over recent years but 2??  Schoen is just spoiling us.

Quote from: BluesCruz on November 20, 2023, 09:26:11 AMi think we have our QB

if tommy continues like this. draft the best available talent   give jones a seat on the bench
as #2

Based on 1 good game, against a terrible team? 

He's a stud.  The best QB prospect in this draft to me by a comfortable margin.  All the naysayers would likely have been buying his jersey before the end of training camp had the Giants lost out and secured the number 1 pick.

Alas...it was not to be.  I'm not really sure what the Giants should do now. Maybe use those picks to try and establish a top flight defense?  Maybe try and package a bunch of them to move up 3 spots to take a QB that's not Caleb Williams?  Who knows.  I do know that what was trending towards being the easiest decision in the world just got a whole lot harder.

But but but I was told he's a bust!  Please.  The guy just performs and as many young players do appears to be getting better with reps/experience.  He's already the best pass rusher they've had since JPP so I'm excited to see how he develops.

Quote from: Torus34 on November 20, 2023, 06:06:42 AMThe New Jersey Giants showed more pure get-up-and-go yesterday than they have in previous games this season.

Mr. Thomas DeVito certainly doesn't look like a modern NFL QB. He looks like a kid bashfully trying on a football uniform. But for whatever reason, the team's responded to him and produced an unlikely and most enjoyable upset.

I say you dance with the gal what brung you. Go with DeVito, clear out the QB deadwood standing around collecting money on the sidelines and grab the best available QB wanna-be in the draft as a back-up. Mr. DeVito is durable [Ed.: Something you can't say about the other Giant QB sad sacks,] and got the dog walked.

Er, th-th-that's all, folks.

Go, Big Blue!

They literally can't get rid of Jones until after next season. He's going to be collecting money from the Giants next year one way or the other. It could have been as a backup to a highly touted prospect learning how to become the franchise QB that Jones was promised to be (Albeit promised by a buffoon) but now it's likely to be year 6 of watching Jones prove he's not very good while the Giants win about 5 or 6 games and yet again are not in a position to draft his replacement.

This is QB hell and the Giants are right in the middle of it. They had a chance to maybe pull themselves out but Tommy and the boys dragged them right back into it yesterday. It was fun watching that kid have the time of his life and Lord knows he earned some feel good this season but he also set the franchise back about 5 more years.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on November 20, 2023, 07:04:18 AMAt that point in time we weren't looking for a new QB, so it's not really the best comparison. When you can draft pure BPA it's different than when you clearly need a new QB to take the franchise forward. Unless you're of the view that you want to build around Daniel Jones moving forward and that he's proven himself to be the team's franchise QB long term.

As for "winning builds character", I think this is questionable. I mean we "won" last year and what did that do for us moving forward? We also won in 2016 (11-5 record), and then 2017 was literally one of the most disgraceful, catastrophic years in the history of the franchise. I know people like to believe that winning has some sort of carry-over effect, but I have yet to see any convincing evidence of it. Plus we're not "winning" this year. We're 3-8.

Further, if anything, people tend to say that character is built during times of adversity and that the true worth of a person is how they respond to tough times, not good times. Which kind of flies directly in the face of the claim that "winning builds character."

Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but my own is that I have concluded this whole "winning culture" cliche is a bunch of BS. You have a "winning culture" when you're winning a lot of games, and you win a lot of games by having the best possible players. Simple as that. I don't know why we try to mystify that concept into winning being some sort of surreal force in the air. It's about the caliber of talent you're putting on the field, and there is no position that is more important than QB.

So nice I wish I could like it twice.

Well said.

Panarin is off to an MVP type start to the season. I read on twitter that he has a point on 53% of all the goals the Rangers have scored this season.

Tonight was a game they could have easily lost once they went down early in the 3rd. And last year they probably do lose it. I was already feeling it that these damn devils just have the Rangers number. Thinking how important it is to not see them in the playoffs. But then Shesty knocking the rust off after a shaky first period and Panarins twisted wrister perfectly placed over the glove shoulder had me believing again.

Also a shout-out to then 4th line. Not just veseys 2 goals but numerous other shifts where they kept the pressure on and the puck in the offensive zone. Recent years that 4th line has been a liability... But not this year. This team finally goes 4 lines deep.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on November 18, 2023, 10:50:37 AMPersonally, despite this report and despite the fact that these may be legitimate direct quotes, I would put the odds of Williams not coming out this year at no higher than 5%.

Its extremely unlikely.  Herbert is the only recent example of a top QB having the chance to come out but decided to stay back an extra year.  And he would have likely been the 1st QB taken and maybe the 1st overall pick had he come out the year before, instead he got lumped in with Tua and Burrow.  Regardless of the year, if you're getting picked #1 overall you're going to a pretty lousy team. 

Having said that, if the Giants were to earn that pick Williams would be going into about as good of a situation as you can hope to go to for a team with the #1 pick.  The Giants are a QB away right from being respectable, and with 2 second round picks plus whatever they do in free agency they could be a great rookie QB away from contending if things break right.

Quote from: AZGiantFan on November 17, 2023, 08:40:45 PMIt is only a semi-rational hypothetical if we agree to completely ignore the CAP aspects.  IOW, mental masturbation.  If it is not realistic, what's the point of discussing it?  It's like one of those Big Bang Theory arguments of who would win in a fight between Superman and Captain America.

Don't be ridiculous.  Superman wins easily.

I wish the Giants were as bad as the Chargers who are 4-5 right now while having one of the most potent offenses in the entire NFL.  I imagine a lot of us would give quite a bit to be that "bad".

No you can't take one scenario and extrapolate it everybody.  Like when they said Stroud would be a bust because he came from Ohio State and they never produced QBs there.  It's a silly exercise.  But having said that, getting a real QB is the fastest path to getting the Giants back to respectability. 

And the fastest path to getting that QB is using their first pick next season on it.  They have to get the pick right, goes without saying, but if they do they're set for a decade plus.  And if they don't...they're pretty much right where they are anyway.

I totally understand why all of her colleagues are lashing out at this.  Those people are actually doing the job and trying to get real information no matter how pointless it might be.  But here comes Charissa who just makes stuff up and pretends its real?  That's ridiculous.  The truth is you could do away with those reports all together and not a soul would care, the coaches would likely to a man prefer it that way, but if they're going to keep doing them don't lie.  Just do what the reporter did when Daboll blew her off because Tyrod Taylor had just done the dumbest thing imaginable.  "Brian Daboll apologized saying he's in no frame of mind to discuss what just happened". Easy.  Done.  And most importantly honest.

Quote from: MightyGiants on November 17, 2023, 09:52:53 AMJeff,

Yesterday, I told you I thought Daniel Jones had a pretty good rookie season, with the exception of his high turnover rate.  This was how you responded:

Now Consider Josh Allen's penchant for giving the ball to the other team

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/columnist/mike-freeman/2023/11/17/buffalo-bills-quarterback-josh-allen-problems/71585981007/

I think the idea is that Allen always turns the ball over a lot...except when he was paired with Daboll and (presumably) Dorsey who is already available.  So the thinking is he goes back to the Josh Allen of the previous couple seasons would you make that deal.

Money aside because obviously you can't tie up half the salary cap with 2 QBs...you should 100% make that trade if offered.  With that #1 pick you're hoping you end up with Josh Allen, but you could end up with Josh Rosen.  So just go ahead and take Josh Allen now. 

But again it'll never happen.  Bills will never trade him, and the Giants could never afford him even if the Bills were dumb enough to make him available unless they also took Daniel Jones in the trade.  So unless they're firing their GM And hiring Gettleman...this is nothing more than a pipe dream. 

Quote from: MightyGiants on November 16, 2023, 02:44:45 PMHere is what Eli Manning said:


"They saw Daniel Jones, they were around him. They had him for a year and they trusted that, 'Hey, this is a kid that has a bunch of upside,' " Manning told Andrew Marchand and John Ourand, referring to the new Giants regime that started in 2022. "He's still in the first year of the offense, played extremely well. He can run, he's tough. He can make the throws. Just unfortunately, this was a tough year with injuries. ... And so, I think you still got to trust your quarterback.

"He's going to come back, he's going to be healthy. He works hard. He's a great teammate. He does all the intangible things really, really well, and I think they got to trust him, can put some guys, get help around them and continue to grow with these teams. I think when you sign your key guys to contracts, Saquon [Barkley], Dexter Lawrence, Daniel ... you put these guys, you keep adding guys around them and you don't just say, hey, switch it up right away because you have one bad year."

He's right in the sense you don't blow it up after 1 bad year.  But what about 4 bad years out of 5?  I think we know at this point the ceiling that Jones brings along with him.  There was at least hope after last season that maybe he was finally turning a corner with Daboll/Kafka better pieces around him would get him to that next level...but nope.  Didn't happen.  The pieces around him got better, he got worse.  It's time to move on.  They can't get rid of him completely but since they're going to be drafting in the top 2 it's time to pick a real QB to replace him.