Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: ozzie on January 18, 2024, 01:53:04 PMJust goes to show that all this testing is a crap shoot.
In my uneducated opinion, the best way to assess a player is Game Tape. Watch it and see who stands out, see who's always in position, see who makes plays.

Even that can be misleading.  Remember on tape Peyton Manning and Ryan Leaf didn't look much different

Last year, this test was considered cutting-edge in determining QB talent (Brock Purdy had scored highly in the test).

Then this happened


Prior to the 2023 NFL Draft it was revealed that C.J. Stroud posted the worst S2 cognitive test score of any quarterback in that year's class.


https://www.si.com/nfl/2024/01/09/cj-stroud-response-critics-poor-test-score-nfl-draft#:~:text=Stroud%20posted%20the%20worst%20S2,level%20based%20on%20the%20S2.

Quote from: TDToomer on January 18, 2024, 11:58:03 AMI think this is coming way less common outside of pro sports. Maybe its the current crop of millenials coming out of college who are less accepting of this type of behavior from their superiors. I haven't been screamed at in a workplace in many years.

Excellent point but do we know of Mara and Tisch have greenlight above market salaries for these assistants (they should regardless)? Not only were the signed, but signed quickly and with stellar resumes.

Yeah, the screaming has long been phased out.   At this point, even raising your voice (regardless of what you say) can result in getting called on the carpet at human resources.

I found it ironic that NYG cited Parcells as justification for yelling at coaches.  The thing with Parcells is he didn't yell at everyone (player or coach).  Parcells was a master motivator.  He appreciated that everyone was different.  Some players and coaches would respond best to being yelled at, while others would perform their best with a pat on the ass.  If Parcells was head coach, I seriously doubt he would have been yelling at Wink, because he would have realized that wasn't the best approach to take with him.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on January 18, 2024, 09:47:18 AMGood way:

Banks: I knew he was very talented but I thought he was raw and would make tons of glaring mistakes in his rookie year. He was definitely better than I expected.

Pinnock: Was just consistently good all year and I didn't think much of him either way before the season.

McFadden: He was pretty bad as a rookie, and I wasn't sure if he'd make it long term. I thought he made some nice strides this year (albeit there is still plenty of room for improvement).


Bad way:

Jones: I never thought he was going to be materially better than average, but in 2022 he was at least reasonably effective within the basic system they set up for him. This year the wheels completely came off, and he was terrible. And the better play of the other two QBs under the same conditions completely eradicated the excuse foundation that had been built for Jones in past years. Moreover his reversion to having a propensity for serious injuries was a disappointment, as 2022 had been the outlier year where he managed to avoid that, and I was hoping it would mark the beginning of a much healthier run for him. It didn't.

Bellinger: I was hoping he'd take a step forward this year after a nice rookie season. I feel like he took a step back, if anything.

Ojulari: Not that I had high expectations for him but he was completely useless this year and probably has to go even though it won't save much.


I'm sure many will have Neal in the negatives. I'm not, because he was terrible last year, and I was careful not to just auto-assume he'd be solid this year. I needed to see it to believe it with him after being so dismayed as to how bad he was in year one. Unlike Thomas, he showed no late season improvement as a rookie, so that worried me about him.

I appreciate how carefully you followed the wording of my question.  I didn't ask who disappointed, but rather who surprised in either a positive or negative manner

Quote from: Ed Vette on January 17, 2024, 09:10:12 PMQuantum Computing will eventually figure out battery technology from the components to charging to life expectancy.

It's a game changer for mankind.

This isn't the first time I heard you mention quantum computing.  You inspired me to look into it.  I think this article appealed to me and my engineering (the field that converts scientific knowledge into practical applications) background.

https://www.wired.com/story/wired-guide-to-quantum-computing/

Quote from: uconnjack8 on January 18, 2024, 09:41:11 AMWe just don't know how they fit together. 

I keep thinking of that example about Daboll saying on the headset to Wink "you are going to lose this game like you lost the Jets game".  As someone who has been managing people for 25 years, that sounds awful, really awful. But we had an entire thread about context here and we don't know that part of it.  to my knowledge we have no idea what was said directly prior to that comment.


Just as an example here:  what if Prior to Daboll making that comment, Wink's comment on the radio was something to the effect of :  "Is your offense going to lose this game for us again?  Or are they going to score at all?"

It's still not a good response but its very different than just out of the blue "you lost the Jets game".  There are certainly other ways to handle that kind of stuff as a manager.

I think we have to realize that the NFL coaching jobs are not regular workplace interactions and things are said back and forth that wouldn't be acceptable in many work situations.  Again, that doesn't make what Daboll said right. 

I guess it's a long way of saying that I agree with your general assessment and that we just really don't know the extent of the dysfunction.  I think what's bothered me most of all the stuff coming out is the "staffer" telling an assistant not to come to the Giants. If true, that's bad.

Here's the thing: on game day, the coaching staff needs to work as a well-coordinated machine.  NFL playcalling is extremely demanding; in a short period of time, you need to decide the best call to play while factoring in down, distance, and game situations.  Plus, you need to consider what your opponent might do and, how predictable you are being, and how you wanted the play calling to go.

So the focus should be on the two play callers, with everything else being conducted with an eye towards supporting the play callers.  The only real exception is the head coach, who also needs to consider the game situation and be prepared to make key calls like punt or go for it.

With this in mind, the details of Daboll's finger-pointing are essentially meaningless as there simply is no place in challenging in-game environment to waste time and create a distraction by finger-pointing or the like.

Quote from: londonblue on January 18, 2024, 09:47:32 AMThere will obviously changes in personnel but the one thing I hope Bricillo can quickly improve is the mental processing of the line. We gave up too many sacks/pressures and broken run plays because our OL could not operate in unison and cannot reliably detect even the most basic stunt.

Some of that might be on the players, some of it early season was the constant change but I think a lot of it is simply not working hard enough on film study and on collective (as opposed to individual) technique on the practice field. It should be possible to significantly improve this aspect without new personnel IMO.

Our new coach has a philosophy.   Is one player makes a mistake, it's probably on the player.  If more than one is making mistakes, then it's on the coach and how he taught it.   From what I hear, the new coach is big on accountability, not just for his players but for himself as well.

Here is a Giants.com article about this


https://www.giants.com/news/senior-bowl-coaching-staff-roster-shea-tierney-mike-adams-2024-nfl-draft

Which player or players surprised you in a good way in 2023?


Which player or players surprised you in a bad way in 2023?

and assistant special teams coach Mike Adams is one of the ST coordinators

https://x.com/RandyMueller_/status/1747979502389797271?s=20

Can Carmen Bricillo, Joe Schoen clean up Giants' offensive line mess?

The Giants have been trying unsuccessfully to fix their line for more than a decade


https://www.bigblueview.com/2024/1/18/24041876/can-carmen-bricillo-joe-schoen-clean-up-giants-offensive-line-mess

Quote from: killarich on January 18, 2024, 09:16:40 AMHow sure are we that Daboll is that toxic ?

The dude was Coach of the year last year and everything was going great.


I honestly think its being over played here with the Daboll slander

I liked Wink ... and im not saying Daboll probably isnt a hardass ..but I dont think that means he isnt a good coach

Yes the schedule was weak...but we did make the second round last season ..... with Hodgins as our top WR ... and Jones at QB


Hopefully Daboll would view Rivera with a higher level of respect ... but then again I could be wrong about all this

It's only slander if it's not true.  I went into great detail about this in this post (and in this thread)

https://giantsfans.net/message_board/index.php?msg=937107

I will point out my biggest takeaway to date: neither side is disputing the claims put out by the other side.  So it would seem both side's are giving us the truth, the difference is that the two sides are supplying the facts they feel best support them and put the other side in the worse possible light.

Quote from: Ed Vette on January 18, 2024, 09:06:18 AMYup, I have more of a problem with how this team was prepared for the season and some decisions that were made in preparing the Roster and deciding on the roster as well as starting Cutlets over Taylor, which may have killed what playoff hopes they had. The Oline decisions were the real killer.

I would also say that the fiasco at the end of the half in Buffalo is the fault of both Tyrod and Daboll.  Daboll's job as a non-playing calling HC is to make sure players understand what to do in situations like the one T2 faced.   Otherwise, other than making it harder for the other coaches to do their jobs by screaming into the headsets, what value is Daboll bringing on game day?

Ron would be an interesting hire option.  Although I have serious doubts, Ron would want to come to work for Daboll.  I can't imagine a long-time head coach would want to be screamed at like he is a no-nothing coaching intern.