Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on January 25, 2024, 04:05:11 PMI acknowledged that there are examples of good QBs who slip to the late first round and beyond in my post. Pinpointing a few of these examples does not automatically negate my point.

It's moot anyway. The Giants aren't drafting a first round QB this year. We'll take yet another O lineman or some other player and run it back again with Jones for his sixth year in the NFL. And like every other year we'll hear about how he is "carrying himself differently this year" during training camp, we'll get a few photos off twitter about how ripped he looks, we'll get excited about a single offensive series in a preseason game, we'll post about how crazy it is that Vegas has us a 5.5 or 6 win team, and then we can have this same conversation again a year from now when we're picking in the top 10 again. Rinse repeat.

With the worst QB support in the league, perhaps you should expand your view to more than just the QB.

https://x.com/albertbreer/status/1750639701613011406?s=46&t=1vcQIN8GqF5J2oLdxEVEJQ

https://x.com/tompelissero/status/1750637346679087209?s=46&t=1vcQIN8GqF5J2oLdxEVEJQ

It's always a good thing when players fancy themselves GMs 

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on January 25, 2024, 03:50:03 PMI understand the logic around getting your ducks in order before bringing in a QB and getting proper value of the advantage of having him on a rookie contract. That's a great strategy in theory, but in theory only. The reality, which people like to omit when they lay this strategy out, is that you can't just decide to "go get a franchise QB" any old year you want. It doesn't work that way. If you build up the rest of your roster first, that's a great way to become the Andy Dalton Bengals or the Ryan Tannehill Titans. Now compared to the dreck we have now, that might not seem so bad, but if your goal is to actually win Super Bowls again someday, that is not an appealing strategy.

I would further add that a good, very good, or great QB is a 10 to 20 year investment. Obviously, it's great if you can take advantage of the period when he's on his rookie contract and potentially win a Super Bowl then, but if you were bad enough to have had a high enough pick to get said QB, that's going to be more easily said than done. It's doable, yes, but it's not easy nor is it something you can bank on. So if you have the opportunity to get someone like Drake Maye (and I'm not saying we do), unless you already have a QB you are very bullish on for the long term, I would argue you should do it. Again, it's a 15 or so year investment if you get it right. It's not do or die in the first 3-4 years.

And I understand that great QBs are not only found in the top 5 or top 10 of the draft. I get it. But I like to deal in probabilities rather than outliers when I think strategically, and it's pretty clear that your chances of getting an excellent QB in any given draft are much better if you're picking near the top of the first round than if you're picking in the middle or near the bottom. Yes, guys like Lamar Jackson and even Aaron Rodgers sometimes slip in the first round, and sure, we all know that Brady and Russell Wilson were taken long after the first round. But for every Brady, Wilson, and Aaron Rodgers there are hundreds of Desmond Ridders, Kenny Picketts, and Paxton Lynches. Again - I am dealing in the large, telltale samples of data, not the outliers.

I don't think we will take a QB this year, mainly because the big three won't be available to us and we are picking too high to take the fourth QB off the board sixth overall. We'll see if there is a trade opportunity and if the Giants would actually be game for it, but I doubt it. So in no way am I suggesting reaching for some middling QB with the sixth pick in the draft. Our previous GM did that, and we all know what the results have been. My point with this post is to just dispute the notion that you should pass up on drafting a QB prospect you're very high on simply because the rest of your team is not fully built up. I firmly disagree with that stance for all of the reasons laid out above.

Of the 4 teams in the conference championship, three (49ers, Ravens, Chiefs) all had good teams before acquiring their QB.  Only the Lions had a poor team when they acquired Goff (a QB who had already developed).


Edit to add-  If you expand this out to the teams from last week.  3 (the Bucs, Packers, and Bills) had solid teams before acquiring their QB and only the Texans had a weak team before getting their QB (although they acquired talent and a good coach while acquiring their QB)

Quote from: T200 on January 25, 2024, 03:32:52 PMEverything about those two organizations is different.

Tim,

I am not sure what you are driving at.  Bill has near complete control in New England.  The Pats are what Bill made them to be.   How is the difference with another team (including Atlanta) relevant?

Quote from: Doc16LT56 on January 25, 2024, 03:07:00 PMThey spent the last two years righting the ship. It didn't work. If you can get one of the big-3 QBs, you go and get the QB.

I think the Jags and the Chargers are what you get when you just "go for a QB" when you lack the foundation of a solid team.  Maybe Harbough will turn the Chargers around, but there are not many coaches of his caliber available to teams.

Plus, I don't believe there is one of the 3 elite QB prospects available.  Why would a QB needy team trade away an elite QB prospect?

https://x.com/Ihartitz/status/1750260996311007353?s=20

Louis Riddick
@LRiddickESPN
Dan Campbell never called plays, isn't some QB guru, and most of you laughed at him and didn't take him serious AT ALL after his opening press conference . But he is a great leader and teacher of both coaches and players, and motivator and tactician with a great eye for football players and a great philosophy as to how the game should be played in all three phases. Any owner would want him to coach their team. Now...people can't say enough good stuff about him, as if they knew it would happen all along, but they were the same ones laughing at him when he was hired. And he will lose his off. coordinator very soon/in the near future. Think he or the Ford family or the city of Detroit cares? They are in the NFC TITLE game. Miss me with all this "he has to be a QB guru/play caller/blah blah talk."
1:12 PM · Jan 25, 2024
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141.5K
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https://x.com/LRiddickESPN/status/1750582522621124676?s=20

I believe Bill Belichick is the GOAT.

That said, I think that the physical and mental demands on coaches are so great that it's hard to maintain peak effectiveness as you get into your late 60s and early 70s.

Even if I am wrong about that, Bill has had a team that he had complete control over, and it has not done well in a couple of years now.   If Bill couldn't turn around the fortunes of the Patriots, why would he come in and change the fortunes of another team?

Quote from: TDToomer on January 25, 2024, 01:35:29 PMWhy are we crying a river for a minor league football league losing a top head coach? The adulation for college football baffles me.

College football predates the NFL by many years.

The first college football game was played in 1869 between Rutgers University and the College of New Jersey (now known as Princeton University).

The first college football rules were written Nov. 23, 1876, in Springfield, Mass., by representatives from Columbia, Harvard, Princeton and Yale.

The first college football game on the radio was the contest between West Virginia University and Pittsburgh University on Oct. 8, 1921, broadcast on Pittsburgh radio station KDKA-AM.


The NFL started in 1920 and took years to fully establish itself

Quote from: TDToomer on January 25, 2024, 01:41:27 PMI don't know but I am curious why if one of his parents is 100% Latino the focus is on his Grandparents when you don't have to go further back on his family tree.

That is a good question; I said it the way I did because that is how Dan Duggan reported it.  As you say, if both his mother's parents were Puerto Rican, then so is she.

Quote from: PSUBeirut on January 25, 2024, 01:24:48 PMWe'd want a young up and coming and by all accounts brilliant front office man to leave for some measly third round comp picks?  Sorry, I can't get on board with that.  I hope we can hang on to him, if he's really as good as it's been reported.

I will accept the claim that Brown is brilliant and up-and-coming.  If that is true, why have the Giants' first two drafts been so mediocre?  Surely the contributions of a brilliant assistant would have generated better results.

Quote from: Jolly Blue Giant on January 25, 2024, 01:19:42 PMSomehow, I can't think Kafka will get a HC job...especially after last season when Daboll had to take over play calling at times. Now if he followed up this season with a better record than last season...and our offense jumped into a top 10 offense, I'd think it was possible. Just don't see that happening

Daboll took over playcalling, but I am not sure he "had" to.   To me the biggest issue with the offense was the terrible play of the O-line and the injuries at QB.