Big Blue Huddle

Taking Milroe at 5, as this mock suggests, is overdrafting him by a round, IMO.  He is going to blow up the combine though and maybe Top 10 is only way to get him.

That said, if the Giants were to get him then I'd pray they get a bridge QB for a year because Milroe needs the Jordan Love, Patrick Mahomes plan.  Sit and watch and learn from experience.  People forget Mahomes sat his entire rookie year (save for a Week 17 start).  He came from a spread system and needed that year.  Milroe needs the year because he came to Alabama as an athlete playing QB and, while he has improved each year, is still an athlete playing QB - just at a higher level now.  Sitting and learning more nuances to QB position will be critical for him. Again, in my opinion.

I read a lot of posts on this board where people are discussing college QBs and they have no idea what they are talking about because I don't think they watch college football. 

Jclayton, man, you really watch college football!  Thanks for this - mostly because I agree with all of it.  lol

I am at point where there is a clear line of demarcation.  That line is Milroe.  I think Sanders has all the abilities and habits of a, potentially, elite QB.  I think Ward is a stud but is going to need an adjustment period.  You described him perfectly, "hero ball."  But insane talent.  Milroe is a project.  A lesser athlete (barely) than Richardson, but more of a QB than Richardson.  He needs to sit for a year and I wouldn't touch him before late second or third round.

After that, I like Ewers more than Dart.  That is mostly because I watched him (Dart) at USC and was never that impressed and then at Ole Miss I see him as product of system.  I admit, though, that I could be underselling Dart, but that is how I see it.  Not sure I pick either of them before fifth or sixth round and hope for Brock Purdy.  Purdy was a 4 year at starter at ISU and that has helped him so much in pros.  Both these guys will have plenty of college experience so that is why I'd throw them in Purdy bucket (late pick and hope, knowing most late picks fail).

Beck, Nussmeier and Allar are average to below average college QBs.  Daniel Jones was below average college QB at Duke.  Some teams will draft these guys based on traits that show up once out of ten plays.  Lets hope the Giants don't.  Guys who don't dominate college don't dominate the pros.  The rare exception notwithstanding.  Look for these three guys to jump up on boards during draft season.  Don't be fooled.

Anyway, it's Sanders or Ward for me and if neither is available to Giants then I wouldn't reach.  It's why I am all in on tank train.  History tells us that the probability that one of these 2 hit and one of them bust is high so you better pick the right one and the odds increase when you get the one you like more.

Quote from: Philosophers on September 28, 2024, 10:29:35 AMI think it's a great trade for the Knicks in that Towns moves and spaces better than Randle so it balances the team out.

I only wish they did not have to include DD as he was a favorite.  Given the age and relatively similar stats, I sort of thought Towns for Randle straight up (maybe include the draft pick) was enough.

Salaries.  Donte plus Randle equal 41 mill and Town is set to make 49.  They had to include another salary like Donte's to make work.

I like deal.  Towns can defend when he wants to and this lets Knicks start Hart now instead of Hart coming off bench.  Plus helps them match up better with Celtics and Sixers since Thibs was never going to play Randle at 5 against Embiid.

Quote from: kingm56 on August 30, 2024, 01:02:07 PMClearly, you're not keeping tabs on Bradberry. He had an atrocious 2023 and is injured for a significant portion of 2024.  Removing him from the roster was absolutely the correct move.

I am paying attention.  I specifically stated "when this board wanted him gone" meaning 2021. In 2022 Bradberry was an All-Pro.  And, I am only talking about signing Jackson now to a 1 year deal/Vet Minimum or similar low end salary.  Jackson played under LeBeau his rookie year (I believe) and then Dean Pees and they both run a good bit of zone, so Jackson has been familiar with concept.  My whole point is guys have bad years/bad fits in certain schemes. I don't think Jackson is done because he played horribly last year.  He might be but at certain price point its worth it (especially with what Giants have in house)

Hey, remember when this board wanted James Bradberry gone because he aged and lost a step?  Bowen plays more zone than Wink ever did so Jackson should fare much better than last year just based on that, IMO

I already bet the over on 6.5 wins.  I think 7 is minimum and Giants win 8 pretty easily.  A lot rides on the secondary - if secondary holds up and is average to slightly above average the Giants D will be legit.

Quote from: MightyGiants on August 10, 2024, 06:36:28 AMI haven't seen backup O-line play that well in years

We spent a whole offseason talking about bad oline play causing Jones/Tyrod/DeVito to look bad last year and how we need to be cautious that upgrades Schoen made could be fools gold - I was always of opinion that Bobby Johnson (and before him Hal Hunter and Rob Sale) were the real problem.  Especially Johnson.  In his 2 years here the Giants could not pick up a stunt nor a blitz (its why Dallas has dominated us in Daboll's tenure).  They can now that we have a real oline coach.  Carl Banks talked repeatedly on Thursday about "connected" - that is what an oline needs to be.  That is how you adjust to stunts, to blitzes, to commotion. I can guarantee you the Giants will not be 31st in the league this year in offensive line grading (barring massive injuries to Thomas and Elumeneor).  They probably won't be Top 10 either but they will be league average - which is a huge, HUGE, upgrade from where we have been

Quote from: BluesCruz on August 09, 2024, 01:42:06 PMare you aware of his college career or just whistlin Dixie?  He was State Champ in NJ and played well at Syracuse and Illinois NOT little Duke

Look up his record before hammering.....by contrast DJ was a loser at Duke and a Loser here

This again?  I do happen to know DeVito's record.  You obviously do not so let me help you with all that you are wrong about.

First, let's address your comment about Cuse and Illini vs. Duke.  Let's use last 12 years (in other words, recent history).  In last 12 years, ACC's Syracuse has played in just 5 bowl games out of 12.  The Big 10's Illni have played in 3 bowls out of 12.  ACC's Duke has made 8 of 12 bowl games.  So not sure you can call them "little Duke."  And, for the record, I freakin hate Duke (because of their b'ball team and fan base and, well everything about them so me defending them should show how wrong you are).

Second, Daniel Jones (again, not a fan of Jones and here you have me defending him because you keep pulling stuff out of your butt) started for 3 years at Duke.  He went to 2 bowl games with them.  In 2018 he threw for 423 yards and earned Offensive player of game of the Bowl game victory and an 8-5 record.  In 2017, Jones also led to a Bowl game and a 7-6 record.  He threw for 250 yards and 2 TDs, plus a rushing TD in a win and got MVP.

Third, DeVito was in college for 5 years (4 at SU and 1 at Illinois).  He started 1 full season at SU and went 5-7.  Then the next 2 years he struggled, got injured, struggled some more and then was benched for Garrett Shrader after three games in 2021 and entered transfer portal because Shrader beat him out.  Who is Garrett Shrader?  Exactly my point.  Then he transferred to the Illini and had his best year throwing for less than 3,000 years in 13 games and, while they started 7-1, as soon as schedule got tougher, they lost 4 of their last 5.  In DeVito's only Bowl game he lost 19-10 to Mississippi St.  He passed for 250 yards and no TDs, 1 rushing TD.  He had -35 yards rushing (because of sacks).

Thus, lets recap - Jones starts for 3 years and goes to 2 bowl games and wins both of them.  Had a winning record in 2 out of those 3 years.  DeVito starts at beginning of 3 separate years, has losing records in 2 of them (and gets benched for a guy who is selling cars now) and has a winning record in 1.  He has never won a bowl game and only went to 1 bowl in 5 years of school.

Quote from: MightyGiants on July 18, 2024, 07:23:12 AMI think one thing that troubled me is that Mara's nephew answered he gave his career sacks (good), but then instead of comparing those sacks with the league he made the odd choice of comparing his sack production to the players in his draft class (I can think of no logical reason to use that as the basis of comparison)

I believe it was because those guys mentioned (Sweat, Gary and Allen) have recently either been traded and extended or just extended and he was comparing money plus sacks.

The two biggest takeaways, for me anyway, were the following:

"The second-year general manager was on the headsets for four games, from Weeks 11-15. The Giants went 3-1 during that stretch, during which time multiple sources indicated things changed. But the superstitious Schoen hung up his headset for good after a Dec. 17 loss to the New Orleans Saints.

Martindale and his defensive crew knew Schoen was listening during that time. They used code words to tip each other off to his presence, according to multiple sources who were on the headsets. Daboll was muted and more composed."

"Daboll has defensive line coach Andre Patterson working with the edge rushers and outside linebackers coach Charlie Bullen, something that wasn't done previously when Patterson and the previous regime butted heads. There was a clear disconnect between the pass rush and interior of the defensive line, which could have contributed to the Giants' trouble stopping the run (27th in NFL)."

I have continually been of belief that Daboll did not handle it well (with the outbursts and theatrics) but that he was pushed, prodded and systematically send there by Martindale.  Just my opinion but I think Wink wanted head coaching job here and when things started to go oh so bad he pounced and back-stabbed Dabs.  The 2 nuggets above seem to forward some of that, IMO.

Quote from: Philosophers on June 26, 2024, 08:54:09 AMWhat do you all think?  Very good all around player who fits probably every team with his shooting and defense.  Here are my 4 questions for you:

1) Assuming they re-sign OG, how do they play both simultaneously as I think both play the same position?  Wouldn't the lineup be too small if they play together?

2) Knicks gave up a huge haul of draft picks to get him potentially crippling their future rebuilding especially if guys go down with major injuries.  Was that smart to give up so much?

3) Does signing Bridges mean they lose OG?

4) if they keep OG, do they need a certain kind of center with OG and Bridges playing together along with Brunson?

Its an awesome trade.  Bridges fits.

(1) OG can guard anyone 1-5 and Bridges can guard anyone 1-3 and probably most, if not all, 4s.  Thus, yes, they can not only play together they can thrive together.  This puts Donte into the 6th man role.  And it improves D and Offense.

(2) If the Knicks are as good as I, and they, think then its not a massive overpay.  Those picks are not going to be lottery picks and most likely will be in 20s.  Plus they still have 6 or 7 1st rounders left over that time period.  There have been great players picked in the 20s of the first round.  There have been 25 times more players drafted then that are in Europe or on some teams bench. In short, bird in the hand (and an excellent bird in the hand) is way, way more valuable.

(3) No,  OG is their number 1 priority to sign.  And, like I said above, a great fit along side Brunson, Bridges and Randle.  It might mean we lose Hartenstein though.  But they have ways to overcome that (hope Mitchell stays healthy, play with Randle at 5 banking on great defensive flexibility of both OG and Bridges, draft at 24 and 25 or cheaper version of Hartenstein in free agency like Claxton).

(4) see 3

Quote from: BluesCruz on June 20, 2024, 12:30:20 PMDeVito is a winner on a losing team. Won 3 in a row including the NFL player of the week against a tough Packers team
Crushed it on all his college stops.  Jones college career was Meh

Do you even watch college football?  DeVito certainly did not "crush it" and he was not a winner in college.  He was in college for 5 years (4 at SU and 1 at Illinois).  He started 1 full season at SU and went 5-7.  Then the next 2 years he struggled, got injured, struggled some more and then was benched for Garrett Shrader after three games in 2021 and entered transfer portal because Shrader beat him out.  Who is Garrett Shrader?  Exactly my point.  Then he transferred to the Illini and had his best year throwing for less than 3,000 years in 13 games and, while they started 7-1, as soon as schedule got tougher they lost 4 of their last 5.  How is that crushing it????  How is a 16-16 record in 32 college starts a "winner?"

1.  I think Hawkins is CB2.  He showed out last year all camp and then when games began he got overwhelmed. I think, with a year under his belt (because he came from such a small ODU program), he gets that spot.  It's between he and Flott, IMO.

2. Agree that Phillips has inside track.  I will add, though, that if Flott loses out on CB2 then he could factor here as well.

3. Agree with Pinnock and Nubin being starters w/ Belton playing as third "starter"

4. McFadden on 1st and 2nd downs, Simmons on passing downs as MLB2

5. LDE - not on roster yet.  Davidson, Riley and Phillips are backups.  If 1 of them is starter then I think the Giants are in trouble.  Yeah, its only run downs (I think passing downs it's 2 DL and Thibs, Burns, Simmons and Okereke (w/ Ojulari sprinkled in somewhere - maybe Dex and one of the aforementioned have hands on ground as 2nd "DL") but Davidson, Riley, Phillips are definition of depth pieces, IMO.

6. Nabors starts day 1.  Wandale in slot, Hyatt and Slayton fight for 3rd spot. McKenzie backs up slot and last receiver spot comes down to Hodgins, Ford-Wheaton or Boykin (special teams gives him shot). UDFAs on practice squad.

7. I agree it goes Singletary, Miller and Tracy with Gray as 4th.  Tough to predict between Gray and Miller as we have not seen what Turbo can do but I think Gray is limited so Turbo has upper hand for RB2.

8. I think Waller comes back so he is TE1 w/ Bellinger and Theo as 2A and 2B

No

Max Melton and Audric Estime