Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: londonblue on March 30, 2024, 07:37:49 AMIf Maye falls to 6 I would be astonished if we did not turn in our card in record time. His high ceiling, low floor, big body, hero ball mentality simply has to remind Daboll and Schoen of Allen. This does not mean he is or will be Allen level in NFL but to me of all the QB in this draft he is the one I think fits our HC most. Of course all the talking him down in the media may be BS and he might well go 2 or 3 with us never having a sniff at him.

I think one thing that is forgotten in the Josh Allen comparisons is just how big of an anomaly Josh Allen really was.   Josh Allen was very inaccurate in college despite his big arm (similar to Maye).  Josh did what is really seen over the past decades: an inaccurate college QB improved his accuracy at the next level.   Historically, QBs tend to be less accurate (or the same), and the next level, they don't improve.  By the NFL, their throwing mechanics are essentially ingrained.   

Drafting Maye thinking he will be another Josh Allen is like expecting lightning to strike twice.

At almost 6'5 Maye will fill in and bulk up his 230 frame but I don't see him doing some of the Superman stunts that Josh Allen does. Allen had basic mechanics issues that were obviously correctable. Maye is working on his feet and strides as evidenced in his Pro Day, although he doesn't have that extra hop step a couple of QBs have a bad habit of in this draft. He's going to need to shorten his wind-up at the next level on the quick game. What he excells at is he throws a nice catchable ball and adjusts angles at different levels. His arm on deep throws would have Jalin Hyatt salivating if he were drafted. They would have a good chance of holding up in the fall winds and cold of the Meadowlands. He reminds me more of Andrew Luck than Josh Allen. Go back and watch some AL film. Beautiful angled passes with a soft touch at all levels.

Quote from: Ed Vette on March 30, 2024, 08:53:15 AMAt almost 6'5 Maye will fill in and bulk up his 230 frame but I don't see him doing some of the Superman stunts that Josh Allen does. Allen had basic mechanics issues that were obviously correctable. Maye is working on his feet and strides as evidenced in his Pro Day, although he doesn't have that extra hop step a couple of QBs have a bad habit of in this draft. He's going to need to shorten his wind-up at the next level on the quick game. What he excells at is he throws a nice catchable ball and adjusts angles at different levels. His arm on deep throws would have Jalin Hyatt salivating if he were drafted. They would have a good chance of holding up in the fall winds and cold of the Meadowlands. He reminds me more of Andrew Luck than Josh Allen. Go back and watch some AL film. Beautiful angled passes with a soft touch at all levels.

I was listening to The Athletic podcast about these QBs. They mentioned that Maye was a three sport athlete in high school and didn't give up those sports to hone the QB craft like many do now, working with coaches and going to camps from 6th grade on. Not sure if that means anything here but I found it interesting and refreshing.

I see Maye as more like a Big Ben than a Josh Allen myself. Early in his career, Ben was mobile but he was never like Josh Allen with his legs. I think Maye will look more like Ben in terms of his in-pocket movements and his scrambling ability. I'm not saying he'll be as good as Ben as a passer, but he has that kind of "sling it all around the playground" mindset in his game the way Ben did.

We'll see how good he actually becomes. Everyone here such firm views on all these prospects like they already know the outcome. It makes me chuckle how certain everyone seems. The reality is there is a huge range of possibilities with all these players, and nobody remotely knows where any of them will land, including people employed in the league who are more qualified than any of us to make these judgments.

https://x.com/PhilSimmsQB/status/1774140982486872299?s=20

Serious question:  What does a guy like Simms see in the throwing part of pro-day?  Its scripted throws in shorts with no defense.  Do people really walk away from those impressed?  It's a dog and pony show

Quote from: uconnjack8 on March 30, 2024, 04:48:21 PMSerious question:  What does a guy like Simms see in the throwing part of pro-day?  Its scripted throws in shorts with no defense.  Do people really walk away from those impressed?  It's a dog and pony show

You compare them to the other pro days. Look to see if there are any improvements in what has been flagged from the season. There was a drop-off in play by Maye from 2022 to 2023 so what were the factors besides losing his top receiver for several games and the drop in talent around around him?

Quote from: uconnjack8 on March 30, 2024, 04:48:21 PMSerious question:  What does a guy like Simms see in the throwing part of pro-day?  Its scripted throws in shorts with no defense.  Do people really walk away from those impressed?  It's a dog and pony show

Quote from: MightyGiants on March 30, 2024, 07:54:21 AMI think one thing that is forgotten in the Josh Allen comparisons is just how big of an anomaly Josh Allen really was.   Josh Allen was very inaccurate in college despite his big arm (similar to Maye).  Josh did what is really seen over the past decades: an inaccurate college QB improved his accuracy at the next level.   Historically, QBs tend to be less accurate (or the same), and the next level, they don't improve.  By the NFL, their throwing mechanics are essentially ingrained.   

Drafting Maye thinking he will be another Josh Allen is like expecting lightning to strike twice.

Wasn't Josh Allen inaccurate in college because his receivers set records for dropped balls?

Quote from: AYM on March 31, 2024, 08:53:29 AMWasn't Josh Allen inaccurate in college because his receivers set records for dropped balls?

Quick answer, no

Remember, adjusted completion percentage factors in drops.

https://x.com/PFF_Steve/status/985357291468701696?s=20

and this article goes deeper into it

https://www.cover1.net/nfl-draft-analytic-breakdown-josh-allens-completion-percentage/

Eli Manning and Brett Farve had bad College Completion %'s and went on to improve. In fact Eli improved when McAdoo came on board with his Offense and Coaching. There are likely many examples of improved mechanics and a shorter passing game that Improved stats. Take a look at Bo Nix from Auburn to Oregon. QB's who throw deeper and in shorter windows also tend to have a lower completion percentage.

Not that any of this matters because the Giants may wind up facing Drake Maye twice a year as he carves up their secondary.

Mike Renner, the lead draft analyst at Pro Football Focus, says Allen's development changed the way he judges quarterback prospects—to a degree. He's now willing to give greater looks to flawed players who have higher-end upside. But Renner also points to Christian Hackenberg and Drew Lock as cautionary tales of teams chasing quarterbacks with big arms and big frames despite accuracy issues. Both players were second-round picks. Hackenberg flamed out of the league without ever playing a down, while Lock finished dead last in completion percentage last season. (Sound familiar?) Looking at Allen's rise as proof that a player like Lock—or a future prospect with accuracy issues—can succeed may be missing the forest for the trees.

https://www.theringer.com/2021/4/28/22406266/quarterback-development-nfl-draft-josh-allen-buffalo-bills

If Maye falls to 6, how can the Giants not take him? They can grab a wr (a true boundary one) and a cb with the first three picks.

Still cant believe he'll fall that far.  The JJ train seems to be no stopping, now maybe to # 2? Crazy.

Quote from: spiderblue43 on March 31, 2024, 09:49:29 AMIf Maye falls to 6, how can the Giants not take him? They can grab a wr (a true boundary one) and a cb with the first three picks.

Still cant believe he'll fall that far.  The JJ train seems to be no stopping, now maybe to # 2? Crazy.

That's the thing. It's very possible the Giants sit at six and take a QB of the top four or if one isn't there, a WR. Although I can see them drafting Bo Nix at six and shock the world if the other four are taken. Even if their predraft interest shows otherwise.

Josh Allen's CP has been up and down and his style as a gunslinger holds him back some years where he tries to do to get much. JJ and Daniels showed improvement in their college years. It's not improbable at all.