Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: Stringer Bell on May 07, 2024, 02:36:07 PMAnd yes, the rumors of trading up for Maye are telling. But what does it really say? That they really liked Maye? Yes. But not necessarily that they don't like DJ. Had that been the case, then they would have drafted JJ at 6 or tried to trade down for him, Penix or Nix if they were really low on DJ. I don't think we can call really liking a guy (Maye) an indictment of DJ when they didn't feel the need to draft any of the other 3 first round QBs available.

   

If they made a move for Maye, that pretty much says they'd rather have him than DJ. QB is not a multiple player position like WR.

They obviously didn't like JJ at and their actions showed that.

There was an obvious pecking order with the first round QBs and Jones, as far as Schoen/Daboll were concerned.

They were higher on Maye than Jones. They were higher on Jones than McCarthy/Penix/Nix.

Pretty simple.

I am shocked     Commentators are throwing barbs at DJ??? Say it ain't true! 

(that's only been going on since the second he was drafted)

I think after seeing TT clearly outperform Jones last year, that is what spurs this discussion. I think because of what they are paying him, Jones is the QB unless hurt or a total meltdown.

I don't see it happening myself. The only way Jones doesn't start week one is if he's not medically ready. And I think if they say that, it will be legitimate. Meaning I don't see Lock being able to beat out a healthy Jones for the job in camp, even if he genuinely plays better than Jones in camp.

Could a healthy Jones be pulled during the season due to poor play or the offense being dysfunctional overall? Yes, that could happen. I'm not predicting it will or won't, but I do think that's possible. I don't think it's possible that Lock starts over a healthy Jones in week one.

Jones 6 Games
Att 160
Cmpl% 68
Yards 909
Tds 2
Int 6
Yards per attempt 5.7
Yards per catch 8.4
10+ yards 33
20+ yards 9
30+ yards 1


Lock 2 Games
Att 76
Cmpl % 63.4
Yards 543
Tds 3
INT 3
Yards per attempt 7.1
Yards per catch 11.3
10+ yards 19
20+ yards 10
30+ yards 3

If Lock plays in 6 instead of 2 he'd have 706 more yards, and 7 more Tds. He would have doubled Jones 10+ yard catches, tripled his 20+ yard catches and have 8 more 30+ yard catches.

One throws down field the other does not.

Quote from: Jclayton92 on May 07, 2024, 06:07:22 PMJones 6 Games
Att 160
Cmpl% 68
Yards 909
Tds 2
Int 6
Yards per attempt 5.7
Yards per catch 8.4
10+ yards 33
20+ yards 9
30+ yards 1


Lock 2 Games
Att 76
Cmpl % 63.4
Yards 543
Tds 3
INT 3
Yards per attempt 7.1
Yards per catch 11.3
10+ yards 19
20+ yards 10
30+ yards 3

If Lock plays in 6 instead of 2 he'd have 706 more yards, and 7 more Tds. He would have doubled Jones 10+ yard catches, tripled his 20+ yard catches and have 8 more 30+ yard catches.

One throws down field the other does not.

I am curious: do you think the fact that Jones was working behind the worst pass protection in the league and throwing to the worst receivers (per PFF) might have skewed last year's numbers when you compare that to Lock having the 28th pass protection, but throwing the 7th best receiver group in the league?

Let's see what Daboll does with Lock. I don't know if he's ever had a good shot or good coaching at the NFL level before.

Quote from: MightyGiants on May 07, 2024, 07:20:07 PMI am curious: do you think the fact that Jones was working behind the worst pass protection in the league and throwing to the worst receivers (per PFF) might have skewed last year's numbers when you compare that to Lock having the 28th pass protection, but throwing the 7th best receiver group in the league?

Is there really that big of a difference in the 28th vs the 32nd to you? 

I understand you were trying to make a point that somehow there was a huge difference in the 28th vs 32nd but there isn't, not enough to jump the stats that much. Even if you want to say they have better wrs which they do, Lock still attacked down the field while Jones did not.

Daniel Jones, if healthy, and given his major share of the cap, will be the starter, not Drew Lock as was also never the intention and commitment re Taylor/ DeVito, last season.

Second guess, wear out your fingers crunching numbers, redo the Draft if you must, or whatever it takes for you to deny current reality instead of rooting and supporting all concerned until actual events bring forth a different reality, one not fueled by petty bias.

Cheers!

Quote from: Jclayton92 on May 07, 2024, 07:41:01 PMIs there really that big of a difference in the 28th vs the 32nd to you? 

I understand you were trying to make a point that somehow there was a huge difference in the 28th vs 32nd but there isn't, not enough to jump the stats that much. Even if you want to say they have better wrs which they do, Lock still attacked down the field while Jones did not.

For what it's worth, the Giants gave up 20 more sacks than the 31st place team. It could be argued that there was a giant chasm between the Giants OL and the 28th ranked line.

Quote from: T200 on May 07, 2024, 03:46:09 PMIf they made a move for Maye, that pretty much says they'd rather have him than DJ. QB is not a multiple player position like WR.

Tim: It is also possible making a move for Maye meant they'd rather have Maye than Lock (or Tommy). Bob

Quote from: Bob In PA on May 07, 2024, 09:49:54 PMTim: It is also possible making a move for Maye meant they'd rather have Maye than Lock (or Tommy). Bob

Bob,

The QB order is Jones, Lock, and DeVito. If they made a move for Maye, he'd have to be viewed as the eventual #1. If they liked Maye better than Jones, then, by extension, better than the other two as well.

I don't think they'd make a move to get to a top 3 pick to draft a backup.

Quote from: AYM on May 07, 2024, 09:30:54 PMFor what it's worth, the Giants gave up 20 more sacks than the 31st place team. It could be argued that there was a giant chasm between the Giants OL and the 28th ranked line.

You could very well be 100% right as I haven't looked at the overall pressures, rankings etc and just looked at the base ratings pff gave teams olines.

The problem though is that one qb is making pennies and one is making 8× the other qb a year. So yes does the 32nd to 28th line probably make some difference, absolutely but not enough that a guy making 8× is performing underneath a guy that shouldn't be starting.

So yes we can make all the excuses for Jones in the world as some of them are viable like the oline. Multiple backups though shouldn't look significantly better than your 40 million a year quarterback.

The fact that the media pundits, analyst, and everyone else are even discussing a backup as being a better option to a qb that is making 40 million a year is the problem.

Quote from: MightyGiants on May 07, 2024, 07:20:07 PMI am curious: do you think the fact that Jones was working behind the worst pass protection in the league and throwing to the worst receivers (per PFF) might have skewed last year's numbers when you compare that to Lock having the 28th pass protection, but throwing the 7th best receiver group in the league?

Short answer is - no

For those who are advocating for Drew Lock, and making the case that he is a better QB than Daniel Jones, I would kindly ask you to look at both players entire career stats and not just a few games.

Both players were drafted in 2019.

Here are Drew Locks career stats.

59.7% 5283 Yards 28 TD 23 Int 79.3 RTG

Now here are Daniel Jones career stats, including rushing totals.

64.3% 14,426 Yards 75 TD 40 Int 85.2 RTG

As you can see it's not even close, Daniel Jones is the superior QB.

No one can force any of you to change your mind, but you may just want to reconsider your position.

Daniel Jones will be the day one starter, while Drew Lock will be sitting on the bench.

Take care.