Big Blue Huddle

4th and 3 down 10-7 with a little over 3 minutes left.  Pass had to lead Slayton, it was thrown to the back of his hip making an easy play for the DB. Throw was a little late too IMO.

It's the type of thing that makes a big difference in the NFL.

Quote from: sxdxca38 on October 14, 2024, 08:38:26 AMThank you, and yes you may be correct about the middle being open and he didn't see it, but I'd have to re watch it.

This is not an excuse, but Burrow had Jamar Chase and Higgins playing, while Daniel Jones never had Malik Nabers, so it wasn't exactly a fair match up.

11 more games to go, let's see how this transpires

That's a poor reason and had absolutely nothing to do with the outcome of the game. If Nabers was healthy, Jones would have missed him deep as well.

Look at the pass chart that Ed posted. Not a single completed pass over 15 yards. Those misses were on Jones and the one to Hyatt was just Hyatt being passive.

Quote from: T200 on October 14, 2024, 08:44:09 AMThat's a poor reason and had absolutely nothing to do with the outcome of the game. If Nabers was healthy, Jones would have missed him deep as well.

Look at the pass chart that Ed posted. Not a single completed pass over 15 yards. Those misses were on Jones and the one to Hyatt was just Hyatt being passive.

This, plus despite Nabers being out. The WRs were constantly open on many occasions. He didn't make the plays, simple as that.

Very frustrating loss. Especially with the defense showing up big.

Quote from: sxdxca38 on October 14, 2024, 08:38:26 AMThank you, and yes you may be correct about the middle being open and he didn't see it, but I'd have to re watch it.

This is not an excuse, but Burrow had Jamar Chase and Higgins playing, while Daniel Jones never had Malik Nabers, so it wasn't exactly a fair match up.

11 more games to go, let's see how this transpires

Understood, but Wan'Dale and Slayton are supposed to be weapons. I personally think Theo is underutilized all around.

To be fair, Jones really made some bad throws. I watch the rookie QBs throw these lofty touch passes in stride and jones simply cannot do that. Lastly, wouldn't we be better going to a backup QB so we don't get saddled with Jones contract incentives?

Quote from: Trench on October 14, 2024, 09:22:48 AMUnderstood, but Wan'Dale and Slayton are supposed to be weapons. I personally think Theo is underutilized all around.

To be fair, Jones really made some bad throws. I watch the rookie QBs throw these lofty touch passes in stride and jones simply cannot do that. Lastly, wouldn't we be better going to a backup QB so we don't get saddled with Jones contract incentives?

https://x.com/MarshallGreen_/status/1845645785418920033

Quote from: T200 on October 14, 2024, 08:44:09 AMThat's a poor reason and had absolutely nothing to do with the outcome of the game. If Nabers was healthy, Jones would have missed him deep as well.

Look at the pass chart that Ed posted. Not a single completed pass over 15 yards. Those misses were on Jones and the one to Hyatt was just Hyatt being passive.

You really think that not having Nabers had absolutely nothing to do with the game? You mean the guy before he got injured was the #1 WR in the entire NFL. From my point of view, this seems like an unbalanced answer.

More than likely if Nabers played, he may have taken several of those slants and outs and turned them into first downs which would have increased Daniel's numbers and pro longed the drives. He also would have commanded more attention, and this would have allowed Wan'dale and others more opportunities for easy catches, and this is just the minumum.

Let me put it to this way, If Joe Burrow didn't have Chase or Higgins playing, could that possibly have affected his numbers? Could that have affected the outcome?

Quote from: Trench on October 14, 2024, 09:22:48 AMUnderstood, but Wan'Dale and Slayton are supposed to be weapons. I personally think Theo is underutilized all around.

To be fair, Jones really made some bad throws. I watch the rookie QBs throw these lofty touch passes in stride and jones simply cannot do that. Lastly, wouldn't we be better going to a backup QB so we don't get saddled with Jones contract incentives?

I agree with you that the TE's especially Theo is underutilized, I couldn't agree more. Good observation, and I was wondering why more screen passes to Wan'dale and Tracy weren't called? Just something to think about

Quote from: sxdxca38 on October 14, 2024, 11:11:41 AMYou really think that not having Nabers had absolutely nothing to do with the game? You mean the guy before he got injured was the #1 WR in the entire NFL. From my point of view, this seems like an unbalanced answer.

More than likely if Nabers played, he may have taken several of those slants and outs and turned them into first downs which would have increased Daniel's numbers and pro longed the drives. He also would have commanded more attention, and this would have allowed Wan'dale and others more opportunities for easy catches, and this is just the minumum.

Let me put it to this way, If Joe Burrow didn't have Chase or Higgins playing, could that possibly have affected his numbers? Could that have affected the outcome?

How many missed opportunities were there last night because Jones didnt look or throw to them? Look at the clip I posted above. One of many examples last night.

It definitely seemed like the Bengals D was specifically taking Wandale's short routes away.  Which was smart, because DJ absolutely locks onto him when he needs a 3rd/4th down conversion.  That inability to adapt sunk us last night, IMO.

Quote from: sxdxca38 on October 14, 2024, 11:13:25 AMI agree with you that the TE's especially Theo is underutilized, I couldn't agree more. Good observation, and I was wondering why more screen passes to Wan'dale and Tracy weren't called? Just something to think about

Agree with the screens. This year we have had more success than I can ever remember in past years utilizing the screen - but we don't stay with it. Also I'd like to see more play action

Quote from: sxdxca38 on October 14, 2024, 11:11:41 AMYou really think that not having Nabers had absolutely nothing to do with the game? You mean the guy before he got injured was the #1 WR in the entire NFL. From my point of view, this seems like an unbalanced answer.

The Giants are 1 - 3 with Nabers and 1 - 1 without him.  They average 15 PPG with him and 18 PPG without him. Isn't the issue with offense obvious?

Quote from: Trench on October 14, 2024, 11:29:12 AMAgree with the screens. This year we have had more success than I can ever remember in past years utilizing the screen - but we don't stay with it. Also I'd like to see more play action

The problem with play action is you need a QB that can sell the fake.  Some of those play action fakes by DJ last night were utterly terrible.  Struck me as odd that they could be that bad at this stage of his career.

Quote from: kingm56 on October 14, 2024, 11:32:02 AMThe Giants are 1 - 3 with Nabers and 1 - 1 without him.  They average 15 PPG with him and 18 PPG without him. Isn't the issue with offense obvious?

Jones had a top-10 pass blocking line and star wide receiver that people around here demanded he get before making judgments. What happened when he got them? The Giants struggle to score at even a league-average rate. Without the star wide receiver? The Giants struggle to score at a league-average rate. At what point do people accept what is before them? There's years of information pointing to one way and it was ignored because of the circumstances around Jones. Maybe, just maybe, he's the circumstance that limits the Giants.

Quote from: kingm56 on October 14, 2024, 11:32:02 AMThe Giants are 1 - 3 with Nabers and 1 - 1 without him.  They average 15 PPG with him and 18 PPG without him. Isn't the issue with offense obvious?

Unless the competition was radically different between those stats, hard to argue against that.

Quote from: MrGap92 on October 14, 2024, 11:21:17 AMHow many missed opportunities were there last night because Jones didnt look or throw to them? Look at the clip I posted above. One of many examples last night.

In the two clips you posted, you criticized Daniel for not staying with his first read, and then in the second one you criticized him for not looking off his first read, so which is it?

You can't have it both ways?

In the second clip his WR was open at that time of his throw, but the DB closed in on it and made a great play