Big Blue Huddle

At some point before, teams chose whether they'd be say a man power scheme versus zone.  The argument was they were different skill sets and body types.

When did it change that teams run all of them now?

Seems to me that may be a reason for worse rushing performances.

Quote from: Philosophers on October 14, 2024, 10:46:37 AMAt some point before, teams chose whether they'd be say a man power scheme versus zone.  The argument was they were different skill sets and body types.

When did it change that teams run all of them now?

Seems to me that may be a reason for worse rushing performances.

Phil: The argument "for" running all schemes... every opponent does not play the same defense, and each type of defense is most susceptible to different OL blocking formulations.

The argument "against"... teams that do primarily only one type blocking get more "practice" at it... jack of ONE trade may increase the likelihood of mastering it.

My attitude: Vince Lombardi and the Packers not only relied on a single blocking scheme (for the run-game), they only had about four or five TOTAL running plays, which they could and would run to either side of the field (to avoid the opponent's bast run defenders), and which they practiced "ad nauseam." The players hated the amount of repetition coach required of them, and they found practice extremely boring... til they discovered that they NEVER GOT BORED WITH WINNING.  I believe "jack-of-all-trades, master of none" is a true axiom which should be applied here.

Bob

IMOFWIW...you need stout, strong, big guys ("people movers") for traditional blocking schemes. For zone, you need guys who are very smart, strong, fast, and very agile for their size. The best in the business at zone blocking that I've ever seen is Zack Martin...and I don't think there's anyone in the NFL who can top him. Although, his age is catching up to him, but if ever there was an offensive lineman who should go to the HOF, it's Martin. It's a damn shame he ended up on the Cowboys 

Quote from: Jolly Blue Giant on October 14, 2024, 02:15:00 PMIMOFWIW...you need stout, strong, big guys ("people movers") for traditional blocking schemes. For zone, you need guys who are very smart, strong, fast, and very agile for their size. The best in the business at zone blocking that I've ever seen is Zack Martin...and I don't think there's anyone in the NFL who can top him. Although, his age is catching up to him, but if ever there was an offensive lineman who should go to the HOF, it's Martin. It's a damn shame he ended up on the Cowboys 

Jolly: Good post. Zack Martin's best days are behind him, IMO, but I do agree with what you said about him.

Quote from: Bob In PA on October 14, 2024, 01:57:42 PMI believe "jack-of-all-trades, master of none" is a true axiom which should be applied here.

Bob

The full quote is  "Jack of all trades, master of none, though oftentimes better than a master of one"

Teams have a mix of skill sets in players and certain plays require different blocking schemes. Why do you think it used to be one way or another?

Quote from: babywhales on October 15, 2024, 10:14:32 AMThe full quote is  "Jack of all trades, master of none, though oftentimes better than a master of one"

Chris: Choosing whether to use one or multiple OL blocking schemes is a very difficult decision!!!  Bob

Quote from: Ed Vette on October 15, 2024, 10:56:23 AMTeams have a mix of skill sets in players and certain plays require different blocking schemes. Why do you think it used to be one way or another?

Ed: Because it's a natural tendency of human beings who find themselves with a lot of time on their hands and a ton of money at stake to over-complicate things. LOL

Be

Quote from: Ed Vette on October 15, 2024, 10:56:23 AMTeams have a mix of skill sets in players and certain plays require different blocking schemes. Why do you think it used to be one way or another?

Because when zone first came onto the scene, it was one or the other and stayed that way for a while.

Quote from: Philosophers on October 15, 2024, 01:50:59 PMBe
Because when Zone first came onto the scene, it was one or the other and stayed that way for a while.

Ok, back when Gibbs made it prominent most teams were Gap or Angle blocking in the NFL, so it was unfamiliar to most Offensive Line Coaches to employ it I imagine. As time went on, Zone developed into what it is today, a complex system of variable spin-offs, like Inside or Outside Zone or Split. Gap is just as complicated with pin and pull, power and counter.

Taking this discussion to another level, the Giants have switched their attack by game to either a balance or to dominate one or the other.

Game 1 Minn- +3 Gap
Game 2 Wash- +12 Gap
Game 3 Clev- +2 Gap
Game 4 Dall- +8 Zone
Game 5 Seat- +8 Gap
Game 6 Cinn- +2 Zone

It appears to me that when the giants don't match up physically, they run more Zone. I think they execute better when they practice more of a style leading up to the game. Against Washington and Seattle, they executed better in Gap. Against Dallas and Cinn., they were better in Zone. I think that Tracy has better vision so they may run more Zone with him. Jones has had more runs in the last two games with 11 attempts each and Gap suits that because of Read Option and RPOs that open up the inside runs and the outside runs reading the Edge/DEs. I also think the Oline has gotten better at running blocking as the season progressed.

If I had to guess, I can see the Giants running a balance against the Eagles. Singletary is better in Gap and Tracy will split snaps if DS plays. The Eagles are bad against the Run, up front. What do you think?