Does Schoen lack confidence in his ability to draft quality players?

[MightyGiants]

Schoen's draft record to date can best be described as "too soon to completely judge"

Schoen has traded away a lot of draft capital that he could have used to draft low-cost young players.

Consider:

Brian Burns-  a second-rounder and a 5th-rounder next year
Darren Waller-  a third-round comp pick
Isaiah Simmons- a seventh-round pick
Boogie Basham-  Trades a 2025 sixth-rounder for a 2025 seventh-rounder

On the other side of the ledger, with the season lost, Schoen did trade Leonard Williams for a 2nd rounder.  Although, in fairness, the Giant's season was over, and they had no plans to retain him, the Giants kept McKinney and Barkley even though they didn't retain either player after the same lost season.

Schoen also traded away picks in the last draft.  Schoen gave away a 5th and a 7th round pick to move up a spot for Banks.  The Giants gave away a 4th round pick to move up for Hyatt.

If Schoen was utterly confident in his ability to draft quality players, like some of the league's better drafting teams, would he be so eager to trade away picks?

[H-Town G-Fan]

I look at those moves and see it differently. He's not moving core draft assets, but primarily (what you could consider) "bonus" or low-value draft assets. For instance:

• The second rounder in the Burns trade was the NYG natural pick, but they have another from Seattle via the Leonard Williams trade. So that trade is mainly a pick swap of the 2nd round and a low-value asset in the 5th rounder for a potential star-level edge rusher.
• Waller was via a "comp pick" that they got for trading Toney to the Chiefs (a toxic player Schoen didn't draft), so again, the Giants had a selection in the 3rd round (Jalin Hyatt).
• Simmons and Basham were 6th and 7th round picks, which have little value. Yes, some players magically hit, but the vast majority do not and Simmons was an actual contributor.

To sum it up, I see Schoen very willing to move assets provided that the Giants still maintain picks in the first four rounds. Time will tell whether its ultimately effective, but I think the methodology makes sense.

[Philosophers]

Like all GMs, Schoen wants to improve the squad using both draft and trades. 

[MightyGiants]

Like all GMs, Schoen wants to improve the squad using both draft and trades.

Most GMs will repeat the NFL truism that "you build through the draft".  Trading away picks for players sort of defies that conventional wisdom

[londonblue]

Most GMs will repeat the NFL truism that "you build through the draft".  Trading away picks for players sort of defies that conventional wisdom

The Giants have 6 picks this year post trades, 7 in 2023, 11 in 2022. Post Burns trade and assuming a comp pick for McKinney (which he clearly values as he is not spending now on eg DB or DT) we currently project to have 9 in 2025.

As it stands 33 picks over 4 drafts would not support your argument, but of course it might change. Given the state of the Giants roster a willingness to trade is sensible but so far, Schoen has not been one of those GMs willing to strip current and future drafts to bare bones.

A trade-up for a QB might change that picture but I think we all agree that QB trade-ups are a special case rather than a general indicator of GM attitudes.

[Ed Vette]

Let's see if he trades down this year.

[EDjohnst1981]

When you have so many glaring holes at various positions, either through draftees that haven't worked out or players extended who didn't hit their perceived expectations - you simply cannot merely build through the draft. You have to make trades to make your team better.

The idea is to get the core pieces in place and then build the additional weapons on both sides of the ball via the draft.

In the modern game, there's more than one way to skin a cat.

[Bob In PA]

Schoen's draft record to date can best be described as "too soon to completely judge"

Schoen has traded away a lot of draft capital that he could have used to draft low-cost young players.

Consider:

Brian Burns-  a second-rounder and a 5th-rounder next year
Darren Waller-  a third-round comp pick
Isaiah Simmons- a seventh-round pick
Boogie Basham-  Trades a 2025 sixth-rounder for a 2025 seventh-rounder

On the other side of the ledger, with the season lost, Schoen did trade Leonard Williams for a 2nd rounder.  Although, in fairness, the Giant's season was over, and they had no plans to retain him, the Giants kept McKinney and Barkley even though they didn't retain either player after the same lost season.

Schoen also traded away picks in the last draft.  Schoen gave away a 5th and a 7th round pick to move up a spot for Banks.  The Giants gave away a 4th round pick to move up for Hyatt.

If Schoen was utterly confident in his ability to draft quality players, like some of the league's better drafting teams, would he be so eager to trade away picks?

The alternate conclusion from the very same evidence, IMO, is that Schoen (probably pursuant to instructions from Mare) is in win-now mode, as Albert Breer has concluded. Bob

[MightyGiants]

The alternate conclusion from the very same evidence, IMO, is that Schoen (probably pursuant to instructions from Mare) is in win-now mode, as Albert Breer has concluded. Bob

Those are the types of moves a GM in win-now mode would make.

[B1GBLUE]

i think he is doing a little bit of a hail mary to improve the team by getting instant impact players instead of trying to hit on those mid round picks. its not the greatest way to do things, but if an impact player becomes available and you can get him for mid round picks, it could be worse.

[AZGiantFan]

Most GMs will repeat the NFL truism that "you build through the draft".  Trading away picks for players sort of defies that conventional wisdom

Most GMs don't build winning teams.  And conventional wisdom is frequently wrong. 

[GloryDays]

A smart GM who is confident in his own ability to find talent in all rounds, with input from his fine scouts, will have a fuller draft board. He would look to accumulate more picks to have a better chance of hitting on later round hidden gems. That is how you build through the draft, not to throw away picks because your board is light, with less options.

[Hadron]

Schoen wasn't allowed to trade Barkley as Mara wanted to keep him.

https://www.nydailynews.com/2024/03/27/john-mara-giants-didnt-trade-saquon-barkley-eagles/#:~:text=John%20Mara%20said%20the%20Giants,hoping%20to%20re%2Dsign%20him.

Surprised they didn't move McKinney given that they had no plans on keeping him. Of course, if the offers were subpar, then that's probably why.