Ahem....about that Lab Leak Hypothesis

[jimmyz]

Well if we are going with your no-evidence is needed for theories, I have a theory that Elvis (who is still alive, thanks to the Illuminati) enlisted the help of Big Foot and the Loch Ness monster to develop and disseminate Covid.    If you are unwilling to spend time and money to disprove my theory that's proof of your efforts to cover things up.



You said the exact thing when people were calling out the dangerous lies about the election being stolen.  How did that turn out again????

I didn't know you then, but I suspect you had a similar view about the false theories/hypothesis that Iraq had WMDs.

Wild conspiracy theories have very real-world consequences

These are not conspiracy theories.  And you need to point out where i said something about the election being stolen.   And back then I didnt have theories about WMDs at all.  You are making some big assumptions there for a guy who claims to be a fact based scientifically oriented person.

You make claims about everyone, including yourself, that are figments of your own imagination.

[MightyGiants]

These are not conspiracy theories.

Definition of conspiracy theory
: a theory that explains an event or set of circumstances as the result of a secret plot by usually powerful conspirators


Seems your China lab "hypothesis" more than meets the definition of a conspiracy theory

[jimmyz]

Definition of conspiracy theory
: a theory that explains an event or set of circumstances as the result of a secret plot by usually powerful conspirators


Seems your China lab "hypothesis" more than meets the definition of a conspiracy theory

So explain how what I said was a conspiracy theory.  The fact the same guy who was the primary facilitator of funding the Wuhan lab gain of function research also penned the letter to immediately discount lab leak theory based on nothing but "it's just not" is highly suspicious and has nothing to do with conspiracy.  Its a cover your ass move.  I'm not saying China did it on purpose.  I'm suggesting they may have goofed up and let it leak and dont want it to get out when they're trying to roll out their "Made In China 2025" agenda...oh and thats not a conspiracy either thats an open CCP campaign slogan.  The fact that the Trump hating media gladly ate up this CYA letter without looking further is just $h1tty journalistic integrity.  I'm not saying they conspired with Daszak on the letter. 

Never said any of this is a plot.  You know what a lab leak is?  Its not a plot.  You know what denial from fear of being castigated and losing funding is?  Its not a plot.  Its a cowardly act.  You know what running with the story to bash Trump is?  It's low integrity journalism which there is a prepronderance of.  Its not a plot. 

And the idea that we're not allowed to talk about it because its dangerous?  That's just your parochial nature speaking.   

[MightyGiants]

So explain how what I said was a conspiracy theory.  The fact the same guy who was the primary facilitator of funding the Wuhan lab gain of function research also penned the letter to immediately discount lab leak theory based on nothing but "it's just not" is highly suspicious and has nothing to do with conspiracy.  Its a cover your ass move.  I'm not saying China did it on purpose.  I'm suggesting they may have goofed up and let it leak and dont want it to get out when they're trying to roll out their "Made In China 2025" agenda...oh and thats not a conspiracy either thats an open CCP campaign slogan.  The fact that the Trump hating media gladly ate up this CYA letter without looking further is just $h1tty journalistic integrity.  I'm not saying they conspired with Daszak on the letter. 

Never said any of this is a plot.  You know what a lab leak is?  Its not a plot.  You know what denial from fear of being castigated and losing funding is?  Its not a plot.  Its a cowardly act.  You know what running with the story to bash Trump is?  It's low integrity journalism which there is a prepronderance of.  Its not a plot. 

And the idea that we're not allowed to talk about it because its dangerous?  That's just your parochial nature speaking.   

Jimmy,

I didn't see any actual facts to support your claims.   As I have already said, you need facts to support your "hypothesis'.  Without facts, it's just a dangerous conspiracy theory that only serves to encourage more Asian hate crimes.   When you have factual evidence that this Covid virus was created in a lab, get back to me.  Until then, you are only pushing dangerous unfounded conspiracy theories that encourage hate crimes against Asians. 

What you seem to forget is that my public health background means I know and understand the origins of pandemics.   So I understand more than anyone on this board just how wild your accusations are.

[jimmyz]

Jimmy,

I didn't see any actual facts to support your claims.   As I have already said, you need facts to support your "hypothesis'.  Without facts, it's just a dangerous conspiracy theory that only serves to encourage more Asian hate crimes.   When you have factual evidence that this Covid virus was created in a lab, get back to me.  Until then, you are only pushing dangerous unfounded conspiracy theories that encourage hate crimes against Asians. 

What you seem to forget is that my public health background means I know and understand the origins of pandemics.   So I understand more than anyone on this board just how wild your accusations are.

No..a hypothesis is just a hypothesis.  Its not dangerous.  You dont seem to understand the scientific method much.  The danger is in ignoring as even a possibility and not looking at it for fear it might give Trump some bonus points.  And the idea that we should operate under the declaration of the administrator who facilitated funding of that very lab is seems to be a less than neutral approach.  Yeah dont look at this baseless declaration...look at this other baseless declaration.   And this idea that I have to get back to you on anything is kind of arrogant on your part.  I mean really....who are you?  An authority?

Hate crimes against Asians are on the rise and its Blacks doing the crime.

[MightyGiants]

No..a hypothesis is just a hypothesis.  Its not dangerous.  You dont seem to understand the scientific method much.  The danger is in ignoring as even a possibility and not looking at it for fear it might give Trump some bonus points.  And the idea that we should operate under the declaration of the administrator who facilitated funding of that very lab is seems to be a less than neutral approach.  And this idea that I have to get back to you on anything is kind of arrogant on your part.  I mean really....who are you?  An authority?

Hate crimes against Asians are on the rise and its Blacks doing the crime.

When you have factual evidence to support your assertion, it would be listened to.  Otherwise, you are just another person promoting dangerous and wild conspiracy theories.  In science, we TEST theories and hypotheses to determine if they are correct or not and before we accept them.  You figured posted multiple sources promoted the same unfounded fact-free conspiracy theories was handly short cut behind the show test and confirm part of science

[jimmyz]

When you have factual evidence to support your assertion, it would be listened to.  Otherwise, you are just another person promoting dangerous and wild conspiracy theories.  In science, we TEST theories and hypotheses to determine if they are correct or not and before we accept them.  You figured posted multiple sources promoted the same unfounded fact-free conspiracy theories was handly short cut behind the show test and confirm part of science

Yeah....so then the hypothesis should be explored instead of ignored.  Right?   Derrp.

And its not my hypothesis.  What part of the scientific community do you belong to in order to be able to say "In science, we TEST theories..."   I thought you were a nurse.

[MightyGiants]

Yeah....so then the hypothesis should be explored instead of ignored.  Right?   Derrp.

And its not my hypothesis.  What part of the scientific community do you belong to in order to be able to say "In science, we TEST theories..."   I thought you were a nurse.

What I see in this thread is you took a fact-free totally unsupported conspiracy theory and used it as the underpinning for your polarizing (and in my opinion un-American) attack on science, the media, Americans you consider leftists, and Trump's critics.   

When challenged that your "hypothesis" is NOTHING but a wild completely unsupported conspiracy theory you tried to turn that around and went on the attack with "Oh I am the victim!!  My theories are being ignored!!"

That is not how science works (maybe you should get to learn science before attacking it).    You have your hypothesis.   Before you ACT on it, you test and prove it to be true or not.   You skipped that part and used it as a weapon to wield against your fellow Ameircans

[jimmyz]

What I see in this thread is you took a fact-free totally unsupported conspiracy theory and used it as the underpinning for your polarizing (and in my opinion un-American) attack on science, the media, Americans you consider leftists, and Trump's critics.   

When challenged that your "hypothesis" is NOTHING but a wild completely unsupported conspiracy theory you tried to turn that around and went on the attack with "Oh I am the victim!!  My theories are being ignored!!"

That is not how science works (maybe you should get to learn science before attacking it).    You have your hypothesis.   Before you ACT on it, you test and prove it to be true or not.   You skipped that part and used it as a weapon to wield against your fellow Ameircans

Show me where I claim to be a victim?  Rich you are off the rails.

I never said ACT on the hypothesis.  I'm just saying it is gaining traction whether you or anyone else in the nursing or ambulance profession wants it to or not and its probably worth putting thru its paces.  I didnt say we need to enACT policy based on it.

You do not read words.  You try to read intentions and you suck at it because of your poor interpersonal skills. 

Oh and you are not a scientist.  I think we've all but established that.  You are some kind of medical proxy to science.  Like a security guard who thinks of himself as a cop.

[MightyGiants]

Show me where I claim to be a victim?  Rich you are off the rails.

I never said ACT on the hypothesis.  I'm just saying it is gaining traction whether you or anyone else in the nursing or ambulance profession wants it to or not and its probably worth putting thru its paces.  I didnt say we need to ACT on it.

You do not read words.  You try to read intentions and you suck at it because of your poor interpersonal skills. 

Oh and you are not a scientist.  I think we've all but established that.  You are some kind of medical proxy to science.  Like a security guard who thinks of himself as a cop.

"gaining traction"   

What does that mean exactly?   

"putting it through its paces"

That's just another way of saying I posted the wild conspiracy theory it's your just to disprove it.

You didn't "say" act on it, you literally acted on it as using it for justification of partisan attacks on your fellow Americans

As for your ugly personal attacks on me, that par for your side.   If I agreed with you, you would be promoting me as some sort of genius and authority on the subject.  Since I dared to disagree, you pull out insults and slander, the right's go to move.  Is it any wonder our nation is so polarized and messed up?

[jimmyz]

"gaining traction"   

What does that mean exactly?   

"putting it through its paces"

That's just another way of saying I posted the wild conspiracy theory it's your just to disprove it.

You didn't "say" act on it, you literally acted on it as using it for justification of partisan attacks on your fellow Americans

As for your ugly personal attacks on me, that par for your side.   If I agreed with you, you would be promoting me as some sort of genius and authority on the subject.  Since I dared to disagree, you pull out insults and slander, the right's go to move.  Is it any wonder our nation is so polarized and messed up?

Soooo.....not a scientist then?

[MightyGiants]

Soooo.....not a scientist then?

I have a degree in engineering from one of the top schools in our country.   I am certified in emergency medical care.  I also spent 20 years in public health emergency management (with the emergency focus on pandemics, just like the one we have, and WMD attacks)  What are your science or medical or public health qualifications?????

Edit to add:  Fl Gman pointed out how Republican Senators have weaponized this wild conspiracy theory to attack Doctor Fauci in the Senate yesterday.   I guess that was just Republicans putting the "hypothesis through its paces"

[jimmyz]

I have a degree in engineering from one of the top schools in our country.   I am certified in emergency medical care.  I also spent 20 years in public health emergency management (with the emergency focus on pandemics, just like the one we have, and WMD attacks)  What are your science or medical or public health qualifications?????

Edit to add:  Fl Gman pointed out how Republican Senators have weaponized this wild conspiracy theory to attack Doctor Fauci in the Senate yesterday.   I guess that was just Republicans putting the "hypothesis through its paces"

I also have a degree in aerospace engineering from one of the top schools in the country. 

But guess what...I dont have a degree in biology.  And I'm not a virologist.  I don't consider myself a scientist by any stretch.   Nor am I stomping around a Giants fan forum claiming to be the pre-eminent authority on science. 

You lack humility and that's why my trolling has such an unraveling affect on you. 

As for Fauci....what's your point?  Anytime someone gets put on the stage and questioned it is political in nature and your side is just as guilty of it if not more so.  And still, that doesn't mean his connection with the lab can't be questioned.  The NIH is completely willing to let the narrative that the virus came from man's intrusion and exploitation of nature.  That's a good narrative for them.  The idea that it came from their own lab is not good for them or their funding.  The fact that the virus came from Wuhan where there exists a lab that researches and manipulates such viruses and has a track record of negligence and very little monitoring from the organization that helped fund it would make anyone a bit curious.  Why not investigate the idea?  Because its dangerous?  If this were a crime, any investigator would first look in this direction instead of ignoring it and closing the case.

Where is the evidence that says this did not come from a lab when an eminent virologist (not a public health administrator) says its obviously not of natural origins?  Where?  Where is the shut-me-up facts?  Oh there isn't any.  Why can't this be investigated?  We have been told to live under the notion that this did not come from a lab but is natural and our policy making with regard to how we handle this virus should all be based on that instead?  Our research of the virus should be based on the notion that it is naturally occurring as foundational?  Because that is what we are being told.  Again, nobody is saying just assume it came from a lab but why can't the possibility be explored without being shut down?  Why can't it be discussed?

And btw....not a scientist right? 

[Bob In PA]

.... a degree in aerospace engineering from one of the top schools in the country. 

jimmy: So you're a rocket scientist, eh?      We have one in our family (a first cousin) and the guy is unquestionably brilliant (MIT). Let me know when you figure out the Giants.  LOL      Bob

[MightyGiants]

I also have a degree in aerospace engineering from one of the top schools in the country. 

But guess what...I dont have a degree in biology.  And I'm not a virologist.  I don't consider myself a scientist by any stretch.   Nor am I stomping around a Giants fan forum claiming to be the pre-eminent authority on science. 

You lack humility and that's why my trolling has such an unraveling affect on you. 

As for Fauci....what's your point?  Anytime someone gets put on the stage and questioned it is political in nature and your side is just as guilty of it if not more so.  And still, that doesn't mean his connection with the lab can't be questioned.  The NIH is completely willing to let the narrative that the virus came from man's intrusion and exploitation of nature.  That's a good narrative for them.  The idea that it came from their own lab is not good for them or their funding.  The fact that the virus came from Wuhan where there exists a lab that researches and manipulates such viruses and has a track record of negligence and very little monitoring from the organization that helped fund it would make anyone a bit curious.  Why not investigate the idea?  Because its dangerous?  If this were a crime, any investigator would first look in this direction instead of ignoring it and closing the case.

Where is the evidence that says this did not come from a lab when an eminent virologist (not a public health administrator) says its obviously not of natural origins?  Where? Where is the shut-me-up facts? Oh there isn't any.  Why can't this be investigated?  We have been told to live under the notion that this did not come from a lab but is natural and our policy making with regard to how we handle this virus should all be based on that instead?  Our research of the virus should be based on the notion that it is naturally occurring as foundational?  Because that is what we are being told.  Again, nobody is saying just assume it came from a lab but why can't the possibility be explored without being shut down?  Why can't it be discussed?

And btw....not a scientist right?

Did that top school in the country teach you that science is about proposing wild conspiracy theories and then challenging people to disprove them (see the parts of your quote I bolded)?  If so, they need to have their teaching credentials yanked.

Also thanks for demonstrating another favorite trick of the right

when an eminent virologist

This is one of the clever but less than honest tricks I see the right constantly employee.  Every single one of their so-called experts are "eminent", "world-renowned", ""leading FILL IN THE FIELD OF EXPERTISE" and other variations on that theme.  It's never here is a virologist and here is that virologist's credentials.   It's always these meaningless and unprovable adjectives that falsely inflate the credentials whoever's claims we are going to have to take as a matter of blind faith