The Giants have not been offering QBs a chance to start for the team

[MightyGiants]

https://x.com/clt_ny/status/1768958500674122142?s=20

[DaveBrown74]

I think Jones is pretty close to a lock to start in week one if he is cleared by the doctors, which seems solidly above 50/50. I think the real question is how long he stays in that role as the season progresses. Will he stay healthy, and if he does stay healthy will he play well enough to avoid being benched for performance-related reasons? A big part of the answer to this depends on whether they draft a QB or not.

[MightyGiants]

I think Jones is pretty close to a lock to start in week one if he is cleared by the doctors, which seems solidly above 50/50. I think the real question is how long he stays in that role as the season progresses. Will he stay healthy, and if he does stay healthy will he play well enough to avoid being benched for performance-related reasons? A big part of the answer to this depends on whether they draft a QB or not.

The biggest unknown is that we (people outside 1925 Giants Way) have no idea what DJ's neck issue is all about.

[EDjohnst1981]

The biggest unknown is that we (people outside 1925 Giants Way) have no idea what DJ's neck issue is all about.

The neck is my biggest concern too. I'm expecting him to take a step back with his running production because of the ACL. But the neck concerns me greatly - primarily for his long term well-being and then secondly as a fan.

[MightyGiants]

The neck is my biggest concern too. I'm expecting him to take a step back with his running production because of the ACL. But the neck concerns me greatly - primarily for his long term well-being and then secondly as a fan.

It's always been a bit odd that the Giants were very cagey about the neck injury.  Injuries are usually public knowledge, and we know what a player is dealing with.  The team has never said more than DJ has a neck injury (both times), which is very unusual for the NFL

[Giant Obsession]

DJ will start until our wizard of a HC decides we needed a spark".

Probably Game 1...4th qtr....11 minutes left.

[sxdxca38]

It's always been a bit odd that the Giants were very cagey about the neck injury.  Injuries are usually public knowledge, and we know what a player is dealing with.  The team has never said more than DJ has a neck injury (both times), which is very unusual for the NFL

I've noticed that at the bottom front of DJ's neck, there is a small incision about an inch wide across. That incision appeared after his first neck injury a few years ago, has anyone else noticed that as well?

It was probably a pretty bad and serious injury, and that is why they haven't opened up about it, but that is just my opinion.

[kingm56]

I've noticed that at the bottom front of DJ's neck, there is a small incision about an inch wide across. That incision appeared after his first neck injury a few years ago, has anyone else noticed that as well?

It was probably a pretty bad and serious injury, and that is why they haven't opened up about it, but that is just my opinion.

If the injury was as serious as some are now theorizing, why sign him to a second contract, or start him post injury last year? I believe the Giants are a moral organization that place a high-priority on player safety. I also trust the doctors who make such decisions are following their oaths; to that end, if Jones is cleared to play, he's cleared to play; meaning the neck conspiracy theories carry little weight with me.  My opinion greatly differs from yours, as I don't believe his neck injury is as significant as you suggest.  Instead, I believe the fans/pundits who projected DJ to be a top-10 QB are over-emphasizing his neck injury as rationale for why their prognosis failed to materialize.  IMO there's zero chance the Giants signed him to a significant contract and/or cleared him to play if they had ANY reservations about his neck.       

More to the point, I don't believe his below-average passing production is a byproduct of said neck-injury, as the majority of his play results from poor football cogitative abilities, vice any physical limitations.  To that point, I am far less concerned about his past neck injury, than I am about 8 years of data that clearly indicate he's a below-average passer.  Although, my concern for the latter is fairly low, as DJ's tenure is clearly coming to an end; I suspect he has a max of 17-games remaining as his swelling contract, coupled with mediocre play, will compel the Giants to look in a different direction.  Although, I don't discount the possibility of another injury ending his Giants career too. 

Concerning your initial question; yes, I've noticed DJ's micro scar.  Although, I don't think much about it as I suspect a significant portion of NFL players have scars from various surgeries.   Its very routine in the NFL...

Finally, I am curious if anyone actually believed Lock had a chance to start?  He's been objectively worse than DJ over the same period.  It was a good signing as he's a capable backup, but hardly starting material.  I agree with Jeff, DJ is our starter, unless fortune favors us and we find ourselves in position to draft a QB.  Post 2024, the Giants QB is yet to be added to the roster.

[Ed Vette]

If the injury was as serious as some are now theorizing, why sign him to a second contract, or start him post injury last year? I believe the Giants are a moral organization that place a high-priority on player safety. I also trust the doctors who make such decisions are following their oaths; to that end, if Jones is cleared to play, he's cleared to play; meaning the neck conspiracy theories carry little weight with me.  My opinion greatly differs from yours, as I don't believe his neck injury is as significant as you suggest.  Instead, I believe the fans/pundits who projected DJ to be a top-10 QB are over-emphasizing his neck injury as rationale for why their prognosis failed to materialize.  IMO there's zero chance the Giants signed him to a significant contract and/or cleared him to play if they had ANY reservations about his neck.       

More to the point, I don't believe his below-average passing production is a byproduct of said neck-injury, as the majority of his play results from poor football cogitative abilities, vice any physical limitations.  To that point, I am far less concerned about his past neck injury, than I am about 8 years of data that clearly indicate he's a below-average passer.  Although, my concern for the latter is fairly low, as DJ's tenure is clearly coming to an end; I suspect he has a max of 17-games remaining as his swelling contract, coupled with mediocre play, will compel the Giants to look in a different direction.  Although, I don't discount the possibility of another injury ending his Giants career too. 

Concerning your initial question; yes, I've noticed DJ's micro scar.  Although, I don't think much about it as I suspect a significant portion of NFL players have scars from various surgeries.   Its very routine in the NFL...

Finally, I am curious if anyone actually believed Lock had a chance to start?  He's been objectively worse than DJ over the same period.  It was a good signing as he's a capable backup, but hardly starting material.  I agree with Jeff, DJ is our starter, unless fortune favors us and we find ourselves in position to draft a QB.  Post 2024, the Giants QB is yet to be added to the roster.

Well stated. Why would they sign a QB with neck concerns to a multiyear deal. Why would they even put him as risk in Read Option plays? An ACL injury recovery is no longer a major concern for the long term prognosis of a QB. He's not a Receiver and he's not a RB where speed matters. What may matter is holding him back for a period of time and having to rely on his passing ability.

[MightyGiants]

If the injury was as serious as some are now theorizing, why sign him to a second contract, or start him post injury last year?

The injury concern is most likely why Schoen put the 2 year out escape clause in the contract.  The situation with neck injuries most likely left the Giants with a situation where they could sign Jones, but there was, say, a 10% or 20% chance of the neck injury returning and becoming a chronic issue.

if Jones is cleared to play, he's cleared to play

That's not how medicine works.  A player can be cleared to play, but that doesn't mean that the injury will not reoccur or that the player may be more prone to future injury.   We have literally seen hundreds of players return to play only to find they never could fully recover from the initial injury.  Frankly, I am a bit surprised you would make such a statement, as even if you don't have a medical background, just player injury history shows that being cleared to play doesn't mean the player has any long-term issues.


Edit to add-  LB Leighton Vander Esch  from his neck injury only to have to retire as it became chronic

[sxdxca38]

If the injury was as serious as some are now theorizing, why sign him to a second contract, or start him post injury last year? I believe the Giants are a moral organization that place a high-priority on player safety. I also trust the doctors who make such decisions are following their oaths; to that end, if Jones is cleared to play, he's cleared to play; meaning the neck conspiracy theories carry little weight with me.  My opinion greatly differs from yours, as I don't believe his neck injury is as significant as you suggest.  Instead, I believe the fans/pundits who projected DJ to be a top-10 QB are over-emphasizing his neck injury as rationale for why their prognosis failed to materialize.  IMO there's zero chance the Giants signed him to a significant contract and/or cleared him to play if they had ANY reservations about his neck.       

More to the point, I don't believe his below-average passing production is a byproduct of said neck-injury, as the majority of his play results from poor football cogitative abilities, vice any physical limitations.  To that point, I am far less concerned about his past neck injury, than I am about 8 years of data that clearly indicate he's a below-average passer.  Although, my concern for the latter is fairly low, as DJ's tenure is clearly coming to an end; I suspect he has a max of 17-games remaining as his swelling contract, coupled with mediocre play, will compel the Giants to look in a different direction.  Although, I don't discount the possibility of another injury ending his Giants career too. 

Concerning your initial question; yes, I've noticed DJ's micro scar.  Although, I don't think much about it as I suspect a significant portion of NFL players have scars from various surgeries.   Its very routine in the NFL...

Finally, I am curious if anyone actually believed Lock had a chance to start?  He's been objectively worse than DJ over the same period.  It was a good signing as he's a capable backup, but hardly starting material.  I agree with Jeff, DJ is our starter, unless fortune favors us and we find ourselves in position to draft a QB.  Post 2024, the Giants QB is yet to be added to the roster.

I have highlighted three areas in your post that I would like to address.

Your first point was that fans are now using DJ's injury as the reason why he never materialized as a top ten QB. It saddens me that you would make this comment, because I have never used his injury as the reason why he had a difficult year.

Since you have stated this, maybe you can share with us which posters and commenters were proclaiming this message?

Your second point, which I highlighted up above was that DJ is a poor QB with poor cogitative abilities.

It further saddens me when someone makes a blanket statement and ignores positive data.

For instance, in 2022 DJ's QB-RTG was 92.5 ranked 13th, and his QBR of 62.9 was ranked 6th amongst his peers.

As to your final point, which I highlighted above, last year you were also proclaiming that no QB that had his 5th year option declined was ever re-signed, and you were telling all of us that DJ will not be back, and once again you were wrong.

We will have to see how this year plays out, but if the O line gets strengthened, and a #1 WR is drafted, you may be seeing a different DJ, but time will tell.

[Jclayton92]

I have highlighted three areas in your post that I would like to address.

Your first point was that fans are now using DJ's injury as the reason why he never materialized as a top ten QB. It saddens me that you would make this comment, because I have never used his injury as the reason why he had a difficult year.

Since you have stated this, maybe you can share with us which posters and commenters were proclaiming this message?

Your second point, which I highlighted up above was that DJ is a poor QB with poor cogitative abilities.

It further saddens me when someone makes a blanket statement and ignores positive data.

For instance, in 2022 DJ's QB-RTG was 92.5 ranked 13th, and his QBR of 62.9 was ranked 6th amongst his peers.

As to your final point, which I highlighted above, last year you were also proclaiming that no QB that had his 5th year option declined was ever re-signed, and you were telling all of us that DJ will not be back, and once again you were wrong.

We will have to see how this year plays out, but if the O line gets strengthened, and a #1 WR is drafted, you may be seeing a different DJ, but time will tell.

It's amazing you continue to use one year of a five year career to try to justify your point, even saying it now sounds ridiculous knowing what we know. A) Jones only threw the ball beyond 20 yards twice before Thanksgiving in 2022. It's the whole mirage that kafka/Daboll used to prop Jones up in 2022 and if you can't see that then maybe that is the issue. Jones had identical passing production to Davis Mills, a 3rd pick who was in his 2nd year not 4th year, but shhh let's ignore that, and that Jones only threw beyond 200 yards 6 times, or that we had a bottom passing offense. None of that matter, but Jones rating when he throws 8, 6 yard dump passes because he can't read defenses, that's what really matters.

Also king didn't say anything like that, what he said over and over again was that no 4th/5th year Qb played horrible for his first several years in the league and then magically became great. Which is the truth, as we've seen with Jones over and over again.

It must have really saddened you to see every defense Jones face last season publicly blast him and make fun of him for not being able to read defenses, but let's ignore that right, just like we ignore the Eagles playoff game.

Jones can't mentally process plays or make basic adjustments, but he's supposedly going to blossom? It's the same thing every season, and every season there's a new excuse or reasoning.

At what point is it Jones and not everyone else, because you saw this past season and the 4 before that and you are still lining up for more of Jones which is mind blowing to me. Virtually everyone has acknowledged we need a new Qb and Jones isn't the future but sure let's give him another half decade.

[Ed Vette]

It's amazing you continue to use one year of a five year career to try to justify your point, even saying it now sounds ridiculous knowing what we know. A) Jones only threw the ball beyond 20 yards twice before Thanksgiving in 2022. It's the whole mirage that kafka/Daboll used to prop Jones up in 2022 and if you can't see that then maybe that is the issue. Jones had identical passing production to Davis Mills, a 3rd pick who was in his 2nd year not 4th year, but shhh let's ignore that, and that Jones only threw beyond 200 yards 6 times, or that we had a bottom passing offense. None of that matter, but Jones rating when he throws 8, 6 yard dump passes because he can't read defenses, that's what really matters.

Also king didn't say anything like that, what he said over and over again was that no 4th/5th year Qb played horrible for his first several years in the league and then magically became great. Which is the truth, as we've seen with Jones over and over again.

It must have really saddened you to see every defense Jones face last season publicly blast him and make fun of him for not being able to read defenses, but let's ignore that right, just like we ignore the Eagles playoff game.

Jones can't mentally process plays or make basic adjustments, but he's supposedly going to blossom? It's the same thing every season, and every season there's a new excuse or reasoning.

At what point is it Jones and not everyone else, because you saw this past season and the 4 before that and you are still lining up for more of Jones which is mind blowing to me. Virtually everyone has acknowledged we need a new Qb and Jones isn't the future but sure let's give him another half decade.

The real injury is the psychological trauma or to put it in Carl Banks words, Shell Shocked, PTSD. That's how the Organization leaked it out in preparation for them moving on from DJ at some point after the 2024 season.  Daboll knew it and even deviated from being his mentor to being visibly upset. Anything to knock him out of his funk. Sitting alone on the bench like a beaten dog. But as you have said, he just doesn't have it to be more than a game manager and he's not going to be able to risk his health and run anymore. As Rich said. He could be a shot away from never playing again.

It's not just one thing. It's everything.

[todge]

It's amazing you continue to use one year of a five year career to try to justify your point, even saying it now sounds ridiculous knowing what we know. A) Jones only threw the ball beyond 20 yards twice before Thanksgiving in 2022. It's the whole mirage that kafka/Daboll used to prop Jones up in 2022 and if you can't see that then maybe that is the issue. Jones had identical passing production to Davis Mills, a 3rd pick who was in his 2nd year not 4th year, but shhh let's ignore that, and that Jones only threw beyond 200 yards 6 times, or that we had a bottom passing offense. None of that matter, but Jones rating when he throws 8, 6 yard dump passes because he can't read defenses, that's what really matters.

Also king didn't say anything like that, what he said over and over again was that no 4th/5th year Qb played horrible for his first several years in the league and then magically became great. Which is the truth, as we've seen with Jones over and over again.

It must have really saddened you to see every defense Jones face last season publicly blast him and make fun of him for not being able to read defenses, but let's ignore that right, just like we ignore the Eagles playoff game.

Jones can't mentally process plays or make basic adjustments, but he's supposedly going to blossom? It's the same thing every season, and every season there's a new excuse or reasoning.

At what point is it Jones and not everyone else, because you saw this past season and the 4 before that and you are still lining up for more of Jones which is mind blowing to me. Virtually everyone has acknowledged we need a new Qb and Jones isn't the future but sure let's give him another half decade.

Jones had a promising and good rookie year. He threw 23 TD passes and was as high as fifth in QBR. Then the offense disintegrated due to injuries. So his entire career was not a flop as you claim.

As to your reference to "dump off" passes. It's the QBs job to run the offense. It's not his fault that the game plan was designed to accommodate an awful WR corp and an equally awful offensive line. Still DJ was clearly the best player on the field for most of the games in 2022. In the road Playoff victory, he threw for 300 yards and ran for 100.

You can dislike Jones all you want. But perhaps you can start to realize there are opposing arguments in support of Jones that are valid. Let's also remember that Daboll and Schoen also like and support Jones.


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[Jclayton92]

Jones had a promising and good rookie year. He threw 23 TD passes and was as high as fifth in QBR. Then the offense disintegrated due to injuries. So his entire career was not a flop as you claim.

As to your reference to "dump off" passes. It's the QBs job to run the offense. It's not his fault that the game plan was designed to accommodate an awful WR corp and an equally awful offensive line. Still DJ was clearly the best player on the field for most of the games in 2022. In the road Playoff victory, he threw for 300 yards and ran for 100.

You can dislike Jones all you want. But perhaps you can start to realize there are opposing arguments in support of Jones that are valid. Let's also remember that Daboll and Schoen also like and support Jones.


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I don't dislike Jones, this is the disconnect you and other Jones supporters have. I don't know the guy, so how could I dislike him. Do I think he's a bad quarterback, absolutely he's shown that time and time again. The Giants should have been proactive and dumped him like every other team that has a bad quarterback the past 5 years.

The game plan was designed to mask his deficiencies as a passer.

Promising rookie campaign of 3000 yards 24 tds, 12 int, and 18 fumbles..

This is why we are currently a bad franchise, other players, media personalities etc laugh at the thought of Daniel Jones and yet we still have half the fan base that thinks he's going to miraculous do something in year 6.