Have we ever witnessed a coach like Brian Daboll?

[MightyGiants]

I don't think I can recall a coach getting (and certainly earning) coach of the year his rookie season only to follow up with a terrible second year that fairly would put him at the bottom of the league.  I say that because of the results, the issues with his staff, the easy training camp he ran, failure to prepare the team, and how badly the O-line was coached.

So Daboll is a bit of a mystery, at least to me.  Is he coach-of-the-year material or a guy in over his head?

Here is where CBS sports ranked him:


21. Brian Daboll (Giants)

Season: 3rd with Giants, 3rd as head coach
Career record: 15-18-1   Playoffs: 1-1

A tough nut to crack after two wildly different seasons to open his Big Blue tenure, Daboll was a rightful Coach of the Year in 2022, rejuvenating Daniel Jones and Saquon Barkley en route to a surprise playoff run, only to slip as both a situational play-caller and sideline maestro in 2023. Once again the onus will be on him maximizing Jones and a still-rebuilding offense in the tough NFC East.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/2024-nfl-head-coach-rankings-chiefs-andy-reid-still-king-chargers-jim-harbaugh-returns-with-spot-in-top-10/

[DaveBrown74]

It's not an exact comp, but Kevin Stefanski is the first name that pops into my mind.

Rookie head coach in 2020, won NFL coach of the year.

Subsequent two seasons (2021 and 2022) the Browns had a losing record both years.

The in 2023, his starting QB had a season-ending injury early in the season, and Stefanski proceeded to lead his team to the playoffs in a very tough division, earning him his second NFL COY award.

[T200]

Last season was a rough one for him, some of his own doing and some circumstances beyond his control.

Seeing the changes he's made so far with his staff and his own personal lifestyle choices, I think he's learned and adapted from last season.

Time will tell as we get closer to the season start whether his changes result in tangible improvements that translate to better play on the field.

[MightyGiants]

It's not an exact comp, but Kevin Stefanski is the first name that pops into my mind.

Rookie head coach in 2020, won NFL coach of the year.

Subsequent two seasons (2021 and 2022) the Browns had a losing record both years.

The in 2023, his starting QB had a season-ending injury early in the season, and Stefanski proceeded to lead his team to the playoffs in a very tough division, earning him his second NFL COY award.

I agree, similar, but not quite as drastically different.  I think the thing to keep in mind with the Giants last season is a few meaningless fluke wins sort of masked just how bad last year's team was.  You can look at at a 6-11 record as bad but not horrible.  When you consider the team was effectively out of the playoff hunt by Haloween, you appreciate just how bad the team was last year (plus all the other issues I mentioned).

Like I mentioned in the Hard Knocks thread, I thought it was quite telling how Schoen reacted when Daboll told Nabers that sometimes he loses it as the head coach.

[DaveBrown74]

I agree, similar, but not quite as drastically different.  I think the thing to keep in mind with the Giants last season is a few meaningless fluke wins sort of masked just how bad last year's team was.  You can look at at a 6-11 record as bad but not horrible.  When you consider the team was effectively out of the playoff hunt by Haloween, you appreciate just how bad the team was last year (plus all the other issues I mentioned).

Like I mentioned in the Hard Knocks thread, I thought it was quite telling how Schoen reacted when Daboll told Nabers that sometimes he loses it as the head coach.

I totally agree that the Giants were worse than their record last year. Considerably worse, in my opinion, and I agree that this is the main difference between Daboll's first two years and Stefanski's.

Separately, it is also the reason why it is so goddamned frustrating that they did not get a top three pick in this last draft.

[Philosophers]

In 2022, how many of the Giants wins were the result of something fortunate happening that would not typically happen?  It seemed to me they eeked out some wins on lucky bounces.  I never felt they were as good as their record.

[Trench]

I would use Fassel and Coughlin as an example of coaches who made individual adjustments to their own self after poor seasons and the success which followed as an example of us having hope for Dabs

[DaveBrown74]

In 2022, how many of the Giants wins were the result of something fortunate happening that would not typically happen?  It seemed to me they eeked out some wins on lucky bounces.  I never felt they were as good as their record.

I believe there is a lot of truth to this. Mike Francesa commented at the time (and after) that they "won with mirrors" that year. I did not significantly disagree with that statement, at least as it pertained to a number of their wins.

Still, they did manage to have some big wins late in the season that year and did win a road playoff game, so I myself cannot say they were dramatically worse than their 9-7-1 record. It's not like that's some great record.

Were they probably more like an 8-9 or even 7-10 team if you played that season over and over again, thousands of times? Sure, maybe - I don't have a hard time believing that at all. But I would not call that a dramatic difference from what actually happened.

[MightyGiants]

I would use Fassel and Coughlin as an example of coaches who made individual adjustments to their own self after poor seasons and the success which followed as an example of us having hope for Dabs

Coughlin improved with time, while Fassel seemed to swoon after his Super Bowl appearance.

[MightyGiants]

I totally agree that the Giants were worse than their record last year. Considerably worse, in my opinion, and I agree that this is the main difference between Daboll's first two years and Stefanski's.

Separately, it is also the reason why it is so goddamned frustrating that they did not get a top three pick in this last draft.

Being out of the hunt early, followed by meaningless wins that harm the team's draft position, is a pattern Giants fans are all too familiar with.

[Philosophers]

I believe there is a lot of truth to this. Mike Francesa commented at the time (and after) that they "won with mirrors" that year. I did not significantly disagree with that statement, at least as it pertained to a number of their wins.

Still, they did manage to have some big wins late in the season that year and did win a road playoff game, so I myself cannot say they were dramatically worse than their 9-7-1 record. It's not like that's some great record.

Were they probably more like an 8-9 or even 7-10 team if you played that season over and over again, thousands of times? Sure, maybe - I don't have a hard time believing that at all. But I would not call that a dramatic difference from what actually happened.

I believe there is a lot of truth to this. Mike Francesa commented at the time (and after) that they "won with mirrors" that year. I did not significantly disagree with that statement, at least as it pertained to a number of their wins.

Still, they did manage to have some big wins late in the season that year and did win a road playoff game, so I myself cannot say they were dramatically worse than their 9-7-1 record. It's not like that's some great record.

Were they probably more like an 8-9 or even 7-10 team if you played that season over and over again, thousands of times? Sure, maybe - I don't have a hard time believing that at all. But I would not call that a dramatic difference from what actually happened.

Good point.  Not a dramatic difference but more of say a 2 game swing back IMHO.

[Painter]

Aside from the fact that 40% of what happens in a NFL game and season, good or bad, is a result of chance, I have to think there were 2 reasons why Daboll was named COTY in 2022. 1) First Giants Playoff Game win in 12 years. 2) Lack of otherwise strong competition for the award.

As for the 2-8 start last season, he deserves all the blame and little or no credit for the 4-3 finish.

Whether or how any of that will be reflected in this season is at present unknown and foolish to suggest.

Cheers!

[Bob In PA]

I don't think I can recall a coach getting (and certainly earning) coach of the year his rookie season only to follow up with a terrible second year that fairly would put him at the bottom of the league.  I say that because of the results, the issues with his staff, the easy training camp he ran, failure to prepare the team, and how badly the O-line was coached.

So Daboll is a bit of a mystery, at least to me.  Is he coach-of-the-year material or a guy in over his head?

Here is where CBS sports ranked him:


21. Brian Daboll (Giants)

Season: 3rd with Giants, 3rd as head coach
Career record: 15-18-1   Playoffs: 1-1

A tough nut to crack after two wildly different seasons to open his Big Blue tenure, Daboll was a rightful Coach of the Year in 2022, rejuvenating Daniel Jones and Saquon Barkley en route to a surprise playoff run, only to slip as both a situational play-caller and sideline maestro in 2023. Once again the onus will be on him maximizing Jones and a still-rebuilding offense in the tough NFC East.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/2024-nfl-head-coach-rankings-chiefs-andy-reid-still-king-chargers-jim-harbaugh-returns-with-spot-in-top-10/

Rich: If you DO find another team, compare the Giants' injury scenario in the year after Daboll's Coach-of-the-Year Award with the same point in time of the other comparison team. It should be revealing. Bob

[Trench]

Coughlin improved with time, while Fassel seemed to swoon after his Super Bowl appearance.

Coughlin improved immensely after he looked in the mirror and made his leadership council. Fassel to me also grew into his role and gained confidence after the "I'm upon the ante" speech. He also had a very good offensive scheme as well

[DaveBrown74]

Coughlin improved immensely after he looked in the mirror and made his leadership council. Fassel to me also grew into his role and gained confidence after the "I'm upon the ante" speech. He also had a very good offensive scheme as well

I loved the "I'm raising the ante" speech by Fassel too, but if memory serves, the Giants were 7-4 at the time.

Guaranteeing playoffs for a 7-4 team is noteworthy because most coaches don't do things like that, but the call itself was not overly bold. The Giants' Vegas odds of making the playoffs at the time he said that were probably around 70% or so (just as a rough guess), and the reality is if they didn't make the playoffs that year, he was probably getting fired whether he had made that guarantee or not. So I'm not sure how much he was putting his neck on the line there in actuality.

Still a badass speech though. One of my favorite speeches/quotes for any Giants coach.