NYG going with DeVito bump their odds of picking #1 from 12% to 21%

[DaveBrown74]

I'm not sure I understand why or how it is somehow poor behavior if not sacrilege to speak unfavorably about Jones' football ability or to express relief that he is no longer the QB of the team, but it was perfectly fine all these years to completely denigrate numerous other supporting players on this team in an effort to excuse Jones' objectively poor results, especially considering that a number of these other players suddenly did better once they landed in a different organization with a different QB.

Not to mention the countless coaches, coordinators, and other employees who were routinely besmirched by Jones supporters here in the face of any criticism at all about his play from anyone else here.

If all of that was perfectly fine, why is it a problem to say anything negative about Jones' ability? That's not adding up at all for me.

[MightyGiants]

I'm not sure I understand why or how it is somehow poor behavior if not sacrilege to speak unfavorably about Jones' football ability or to express relief that he is no longer the QB of the team, but it was perfectly fine all these years to completely denigrate numerous other supporting players on this team in an effort to excuse Jones' objectively poor results, especially considering that a number of these other players suddenly did better once they landed in a different organization with a different QB.

Not to mention the countless coaches, coordinators, and other employees who were routinely besmirched by Jones supporters here in the face of any criticism at all about his play from anyone else here.

If all of that was perfectly fine, why is it a problem to say anything negative about Jones' ability? That's not adding up at all for me.

Interesting how you reframed things and how popular the reframing was by the usual suspects.   You essentially removed the "when he is down" part of kicking a man while he is down to create a strawman like claim that criticizing the performance of active Giants is the same as continuing to bash a guy who essentially has been fired.


Jeff, I know you to be an intelligent man and a good person.  I don't know why you would distort the issue so badly with the reframing, nor why you would be an advocate for kicking people while they are down.   


One odd thing, DJ by every indication is a good hard working man.  It's amazing how such a man could bring out the lesser side of so many people.

[coggs]

Fair point, although I will add I am not a big fan of talking smack about people behind their back either.  I appreciate the case for no harm, but I just see it as bad form.

So, you would rather thousands of fans on message boards and twitter confront Jones and tell them their thoughts to their face?

[DaveBrown74]

Interesting how you reframed things and how popular the reframing was by the usual suspects.  You essentially removed the "when he is down" part of kicking a man while he is down to create a strawman like claim that criticizing the performance of active Giants is the same as continuing to bash a guy who essentially has been fired.


Jeff, I know you to be an intelligent man and a good person.  I don't know why you would distort the issue so badly with the reframing, nor why you would be an advocate for kicking people while they are down. 


One odd thing, DJ by every indication is a good hard working man.  It's amazing how such a man could bring out the lesser side of so many people.

I think you are personalizing all this Jones stuff too much, Rich. I have never once attacked Jones' character, integrity, or makeup as a man. I have routinely done the exact opposite for years, and I suspect you know that. My only negative comments of Jones have been about his contributions on the football field, particularly relative to his cost. I think my comments have been completely justified and appropriate. If my having made them is the "lesser side" of me, as you put it, then I actually take that as a compliment (even though I understand you did not intend it to be one), because I have done nothing wrong or objectionable. So if that's truly the lesser side of me, then I'm actually very happy with that.

[T200]

So, you would rather thousands of fans on message boards and twitter confront Jones and tell them their thoughts to their face?

Didn't some fans wait for him after a game  last year and yelled "YOU SUCK!!"?

[T200]

I think you are personalizing all this Jones stuff too much, Rich. I have never once attacked Jones' character, integrity, or makeup as a man. I have routinely done the exact opposite for years, and I suspect you know that. My only negative comments of Jones have been about his contributions on the football field, particularly relative to his cost. I think my comments have been completely justified and appropriate. If my having made them is the "lesser side" of me, as you put it, then I actually take that as a compliment (even though I understand you did not intend it to be one), because I have done nothing wrong or objectionable. So if that's truly the lesser side of me, then I'm actually very happy with that.

This after he made a request to stick to football and refrain from personal attacks.

[MrGap92]

He let us down for six years, and as much as he tried to make the product entertaining, he failed to do so, he tried his ass off, but trying alone doesn't cut it.

If some are relieved, they deserve to be, a new chapter is finally upon us, with Jones there was never much hope or optimism.

I just don't get why being happy is a problem.

[Trench]

Interesting how you reframed things and how popular the reframing was by the usual suspects.   You essentially removed the "when he is down" part of kicking a man while he is down to create a strawman like claim that criticizing the performance of active Giants is the same as continuing to bash a guy who essentially has been fired.


Jeff, I know you to be an intelligent man and a good person.  I don't know why you would distort the issue so badly with the reframing, nor why you would be an advocate for kicking people while they are down.   


One odd thing, DJ by every indication is a good hard working man.  It's amazing how such a man could bring out the lesser side of so many people.

"The usual suspects"??...

I sincerely hope I'm reading this the  wrong way.

[T200]

"The usual suspects"??...

I sincerely hope I'm reading this the  wrong way.

It certainly wasn't football related.

[MightyGiants]

It certainly wasn't football related.

And the post I was responding to was???

[MightyGiants]

I think you are personalizing all this Jones stuff too much, Rich. I have never once attacked Jones' character, integrity, or makeup as a man. I have routinely done the exact opposite for years, and I suspect you know that. My only negative comments of Jones have been about his contributions on the football field, particularly relative to his cost. I think my comments have been completely justified and appropriate. If my having made them is the "lesser side" of me, as you put it, then I actually take that as a compliment (even though I understand you did not intend it to be one), because I have done nothing wrong or objectionable. So if that's truly the lesser side of me, then I'm actually very happy with that.

Jeff,


First, I agree I do personalize Daniel Jones.   I see him as a human being and not just some number on the field, put there for my entertainment.


Second, your response didnt address what I said.   First, you didn't make it clear, but I assume you were targeting me and my comment that it's bad form to kick a man when he is down (as you said, Jones is no longer going to be on the field and can't impact the team).   So you reframed that comment into, I was saying everyone on the team is fair game but Daniel Jones.   We all know that isn't true, because at this point DJ is on the team in name only.  So what purpose does continued bashing of him serve?

As for respecting the man, I look at the DJ thank you thread.   Not many people appreciated the man.  Hell a bunch of bashing of DJ had to be cleaned out and more appeared.  As I alluded to with the lesser nature comment, for many the animosity toward Jones extends beyond his play on the field (I acknowledge your claims of not being personal in your critiques of Jones).


Look people are free to say what they want within the confines of the forum rules.   I appreciate that in today's America, my values and beliefs have become archaic, and I shouldn't expect many to see things as I do.   I just wanted to correct the false impression that your framing of the issue created.  It's about kicking any man when he's down, not hands off Daniel Jones

[Trench]

Interesting how you reframed things and how popular the reframing was by the usual suspects.   You essentially removed the "when he is down" part of kicking a man while he is down to create a strawman like claim that criticizing the performance of active Giants is the same as continuing to bash a guy who essentially has been fired.


Jeff, I know you to be an intelligent man and a good person.  I don't know why you would distort the issue so badly with the reframing, nor why you would be an advocate for kicking people while they are down.   


One odd thing, DJ by every indication is a good hard working man.  It's amazing how such a man could bring out the lesser side of so many people.

[T200]

And the post I was responding to was???

And YOUR post he responded to was???

You can't call a cease fire and then keep firing. We have weapons too.

[MightyGiants]

And YOUR post he responded to was???

You can't call a cease fire and then keep firing. We have weapons too.

Tim,

I called for a cease-fire, and instead of supporting it, you literally encouraged people to do the opposite by liking a post that broke the cease-fire.  Then, after encouraging people to go back to sniping at one another instead of talking football, you went after me for defending myself.

I am well aware you "have weapons". You have been using them against me for a long time.  Since you referred to yourself as "we".   It's not looking like "we" desire friendly, civil, and respectful discourse about the Giants and football.  Instead you prefer the talk crap about other posters.

[T200]

Tim,

I called for a cease-fire, and instead of supporting it, you literally encouraged people to do the opposite by liking a post that broke the cease-fire.  Then, after encouraging people to go back to sniping at one another instead of talking football, you went after me for defending myself.

I am well aware you "have weapons". You have been using them against me for a long time.  Since you referred to yourself as "we".   It's not looking like "we" desire friendly, civil, and respectful discourse about the Giants and football.  Instead you prefer the talk crap about other posters.

So it's my fault???

How about this? Get rid of the damned "LIKE" feature because you use it to target people!!! Why the hell do you care who likes a post... just so you can blame me because I "LIKE" a post and you automatically assume it's because of something derogatory you feel they said?

You're always the victim and never the instigator, right Rich? Go have a look in the mirror and enjoy your day.