How I would fix the NY Giants organization

[EDjohnst1981]

I think I would give Schoen another year or two. This is his first go round in the big boy chair and there are bound to be bumps in the road and mistakes made in the draft and in FA. I believe that his learning under Beane in Buffalo will payoff with a little bit more experience in both of those areas.
I would dump Daboll today and let Kafka take over as he is Asst. HC anyway and never really got a shot to do anything his way. Even calling plays was taken away from him by Daboll.
Let this be Kafka's "audition" for next season. If there is not improvement over the final 6 games, so be it, but if players respond and it looks like he just might have some juice to actually lead a team, give him his shot.
Up to now, I don't really know why they hired him in the first place? I think Daboll may be somewhat intimidated by him and fears Kafka may be a better coach than he is. Why else tie his hands and basically ignore the fact that he is part of the staff? Seems like a power move to me made by Daboll.
And if Kafka doesn't work out, the Giants need a head coach with experience who is a disciplinarian!
No more hot young co-ordinators, no more "players coaches". They need someone who will lay down the law and hold everyone in the room accountable.
And if you wonder why I would give Schoen another few years and not Daboll, the reason is I don't think he is a good leader. The players seem to be fed up with whatever is going on in the locker room and there is way too much "Coach Speak" in every interview. The Giants ALWAYS have a good week of practice, but somehow, they are NEVER prepared to play on Sundays.

I think if the game Thursday is a repeat of Sunday, that's the way that Schoen will go.

[Bob In PA]

First, I agree with much of Mike Lombardi's assessment of what is wrong with the team, so read that post if you want to get a feel for what I consider the problems to be.   


MY PLAN:

1) Hire a non-Mara to be President of Football operations-  This position would be equal to GM and have all NY Giants employees outside of coaching, scouting, and football front office people reporting to him.  He would clean the house with no family or loyalty issues holding him back.  Mara would only supervise this position and GM.

2) Replace Schoen with a GM whose vision for the team isn't "whatever the coaches tell me they want."  While I want the GM to work with the coaches, the GM shouldn't be asking new hires like Schoen Bowen what sort of team they should be building (like we saw on Hard Knocks)

3) Fire Daboll and bring in a culture setter/good manager head coach with experience as HC

Obviously the QB and the rest of the roster need work, but I would trust the new team to get the job done.

Rich: From what I've heard (it's not "inside info" but it's from a source who is very likely to know... and most of us strongly believe it anyway, inside info or not), lol, your Step One is a non-starter. Bob

[MightyGiants]

Rich: From what I've heard (it's not "inside info" but it's from a source who is very likely to know... and most of us strongly believe it anyway, inside info or not), lol, your Step One is a non-starter. Bob

Bob, it wouldn't surprise me.  Although, point one is critical to my plan's success.  Otherwise it's just more wheel spinning.

[Bob In PA]

Bob, it wouldn't surprise me.  Although, point one is critical to my plan's success.  Otherwise it's just more wheel spinning.

Rich: Yeah, that was my point (didn't want to deep-6 your hard work but there's no other way to say it). Bob

[todge]

I disagree entirely (well mostly)

#1 I would retain Schoen for, at least another draft and another year. He came to the Giants and he was saddled with a horrible money situation and a bad team. We see other teams get turned around almost overnight but maybe they had money to use to get better, Schoen didn't and that basically lasted for his first couple of years. Yes, his drafts weren't the best, but in this last draft, he hit it truly out of the park, so now you want to get rid of him. He needs at least another year to bring in HIS own QB not one who should never have been playing here. Yes, he gave him that huge contract, but from what I have heard, a lot of that was Mara's interference. We saw, from Hard Knocks, Schoen wanted someone else in a terrible way, but couldn't manage it. Again, he deserves at least another year, another draft and get a QB who can really play in the NFL.
#2-Daboll. I am truly on the fence with this one. I don't believe Daboll has done a good job this season (and some of last) but, like Schoen, he is saddled with one of the worst QBs in the league. I think he deserves another year with a QB HE feels he can work with. We have a coach and a GM who were handed a horrible QB. They both tried to give him everything people said this QB needed to succeed and it still wasn't enough. Daboll was COTY so he can't be that bad. There are certain things I really don't like about his coaching and if he remains he must hire a quality OC. As this is Daboll's first crack at being a HC he is still learning on the fly, how to deal with these things that are happening in the locker room. He has never experienced these things (especially losing every year) so I would have to give him one more year with a QB that he can work with.

As I have said several times, with a good QB who can make NFL plays, we have the nucleus of a decent enough team,a nd can be competitive next year with a couple of good additions. The two guys need a 'prove it' year to right this ship free of the burden of Daniel Jones. Jones got a 'prove it' year, why shouldn't the coach and GM get the same.

Len: Schoen was handed a 2022 ascending Playoff team and turned it into a total mess in three years. His lack of GM experience is glaring. Would be interested in knowing what your thoughts are on that?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Woody]

Sell it


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Jclayton92]

Len: Schoen was handed a 2022 ascending Playoff team and turned it into a total mess in three years. His lack of GM experience is glaring. Would be interested in knowing what your thoughts are on that?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Lol on what planet was 2022 an ascending team? Lucking into the playoffs with smoke and mirrors is far from ascending. I think most realist even on this forum knew the talent on this team was severely lacking in 2022.

[Trench]

Schoen and Brandon Brown were at Shedeur Sanders/Travis Hunter  practice today.

Seems like there is a plan.

I like it.

[Woody]

Schoen and Brandon Brown were at Shedeur Sanders/Travis Hunter  practice today.

Seems like there is a plan.

I like it.

Again didn't they go to game last week


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Doc16LT56]

Lol on what planet was 2022 an ascending team? Lucking into the playoffs with smoke and mirrors is far from ascending. I think most realist even on this forum knew the talent on this team was severely lacking in 2022.

Not to mention 2021 was a 4 win dumpster fire. Schoen inherited a mess. 2022 was smoke and mirrors.

[Doc16LT56]

First, I agree with much of Mike Lombardi's assessment of what is wrong with the team, so read that post if you want to get a feel for what I consider the problems to be.   


MY PLAN:

1) Hire a non-Mara to be President of Football operations-  This position would be equal to GM and have all NY Giants employees outside of coaching, scouting, and football front office people reporting to him.  He would clean the house with no family or loyalty issues holding him back.  Mara would only supervise this position and GM.

2) Replace Schoen with a GM whose vision for the team isn't "whatever the coaches tell me they want."  While I want the GM to work with the coaches, the GM shouldn't be asking new hires like Schoen Bowen what sort of team they should be building (like we saw on Hard Knocks)

3) Fire Daboll and bring in a culture setter/good manager head coach with experience as HC

Obviously the QB and the rest of the roster need work, but I would trust the new team to get the job done.

From your lips to God's ear on point 1. I also agree with point 3. On point 2, my question is could Schoen serve as a functional GM if a new president implemented his vision?

[Brooklyn Dave]

I think I would give Schoen another year or two. This is his first go round in the big boy chair and there are bound to be bumps in the road and mistakes made in the draft and in FA. I believe that his learning under Beane in Buffalo will payoff with a little bit more experience in both of those areas.
I would dump Daboll today and let Kafka take over as he is Asst. HC anyway and never really got a shot to do anything his way. Even calling plays was taken away from him by Daboll.
Let this be Kafka's "audition" for next season. If there is not improvement over the final 6 games, so be it, but if players respond and it looks like he just might have some juice to actually lead a team, give him his shot.
Up to now, I don't really know why they hired him in the first place? I think Daboll may be somewhat intimidated by him and fears Kafka may be a better coach than he is. Why else tie his hands and basically ignore the fact that he is part of the staff? Seems like a power move to me made by Daboll.
And if Kafka doesn't work out, the Giants need a head coach with experience who is a disciplinarian!
No more hot young co-ordinators, no more "players coaches". They need someone who will lay down the law and hold everyone in the room accountable.
And if you wonder why I would give Schoen another few years and not Daboll, the reason is I don't think he is a good leader. The players seem to be fed up with whatever is going on in the locker room and there is way too much "Coach Speak" in every interview. The Giants ALWAYS have a good week of practice, but somehow, they are NEVER prepared to play on Sundays.

What if the Giants win 2 games under Kafka ( Saints, Colts ) and they fall to 5 or 6 in the draft ? Then what?

[MightyGiants]

From your lips to God's ear on point 1. I also agree with point 3. On point 2, my question is could Schoen serve as a functional GM if a new president implemented his vision?

If the rest is done, I would entertain the idea of keeping Schoen

[LennG]

Len: Schoen was handed a 2022 ascending Playoff team and turned it into a total mess in three years. His lack of GM experience is glaring. Would be interested in knowing what your thoughts are on that?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Len: Schoen was handed a 2022 ascending Playoff team and turned it into a total mess in three years. His lack of GM experience is glaring. Would be interested in knowing what your thoughts are on that?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 Really Ted, what were you watching during 2021, was THAT an ascending team? So Schoen worked some magic, and the football Gods favored us with all sorts of magic and we won a few more games in 2022, but then reality set in and other teams figured out what Daboll was doing with Jones and they quickly shut it down and our true colors came out.
I'm not saying Schoen is perfect, far from it, but he hit a home run in this past draft, and, if not for a certain QB who is not on the roster now, we would be a much better football team now.
Again, I didn't like some of his moves, especially lasting 2 of our best players just walk away. You don't build football teams that way, but I want to see him without the burden of Jones at QB, and lets see what this team can do.

[DaveBrown74]

It is astonishing to me that anyone would give Gettleman the credit for 2022 when the team was an absolute MORTAL EMBARRASSMENT in each of Gettleman's long four years with the organization.

The 2021 team was an unmitigated disgrace. How was that 2021 team "ascending" in any way? Are you kidding me? That is an absolute farce to describe it as such.

I actually wouldn't even say it was a "descending" team, because you cannot descend from rock bottom. That team was so embarrassing you had fans with brown bags over their heads. That was the Mike Glennon/Jake Fromm year. That was the year the head coach called a QB sneak on a 3rd and 9 because he was petrified of turning it over and making an already lost game look even worse optically.

Schoen and Daboll get the credit for 2022. If you want to argue it was a fluke year and not represenative of their true caliber as GM and coach, fine, that's an argument that can be made with some credibility. But to hand the credit of 2022 to a GM who did nothing but completely embarrass everyone his entire time he was with the team is absolutely insane.

The Dave Gettleman era was a colossal failure. Period. Any argument to the contrary is false and can only be the result of extreme bias or pure ignorance.