Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: MightyGiants on October 03, 2023, 01:11:46 PMYou are certainly entitled to your approach.  I prefer one that is more measured.  I think Jones had a very bad game.  Still, this team is terrible which requires Jones to be perfect. Every mistake is magnified on this team.  So that's why I prefer to see some numbers that would allow for a fact-based evaluation.

Numbers can be presented to hide what we see with our eyes. You'd rather see numbers to make sense of what you already saw. I don't need numbers to translate what I've already seen.

Quote from: JT39 on October 02, 2023, 11:16:25 PMI'm definitely ok drafting a QB. Even I defended Jones and still good with this. If we had the number 1 pick - send Jones packing.

Williams
Ewers
Maye
McCarthy

All good with them. DB, my problem is so we trust Schoen to make the right call.

How do you feel about Bo Nix

Quote from: MightyGiants on October 03, 2023, 01:15:55 PMThe team was far from perfect in the second half of the AZ game, but it didn't stop DJ from a historic comeback.

The line play was great the receivers made plays in that second half.  It was about as perfect as you can play.  And that's what Jones requires everything around him to be going great that doesn't require him to improvise or have to think too much.

Quote from: JT39 on October 03, 2023, 01:16:03 PMWe can argue that Jones needs to be perfect in order for us to win too. It works both ways. The defense and running game havent stepped up either.

The defense allowed 10 points that weren't a result of a turnover.  Seattle's defensive strength is their run defense.  Their weakness is their pass defense.  It was the Giants passing offense that lost the game.

https://twitter.com/NFL_DovKleiman/status/1709034471561875755?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1709036691397177380%7Ctwgr%5E1af5426c8b43fe157244d4ea2c02ef2166b9c71d%7Ctwcon%5Es3_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.foxnews.com%2Fsports%2Fgiants-brian-daboll-tosses-tablet-disgust-showing-daniel-jones-interception-footage

Quote from: Rambo89 on October 03, 2023, 01:13:58 PMAnd the team is also required to be perfect for Jones to be productive by propping him up.

i think they just have to be average. or something close to it.

Quote from: MightyGiants on October 03, 2023, 01:15:55 PMThe team was far from perfect in the second half of the AZ game, but it didn't stop DJ from a historic comeback.

Two out of 16 quarters. Two.

Where was he last night? Where was Dab/Ka with the playcalling? Where was the max protect? Where were the downfield shots?

Yes, I know about the offensive line injuries. Seattle had more offensive starters out than we did.

Quote from: Rambo89 on October 03, 2023, 01:20:09 PMThe line play was great the receivers made plays in that second half.  It was about as perfect as you can play.  And that's what Jones requires everything around him to be going great that doesn't require him to improvise or have to think too much.

The defense allowed 10 points that weren't a result of a turnover.  Seattle's defensive strength is their run defense.  Their weakness is their pass defense.  It was the Giants passing offense that lost the game.

18 carries for 39 yards. Thats our RBs total. We didnt play the 85 Bears. Its pathetic in every sense of the word. And the blame cannot be put on Jones there.

And their secondary improved dramatically by adding a pro bowl corner - did it not? Getting Woolen back made a major difference.

Orlovsky was just on McAfee's show saying of the 11 sacks he put 4 on the OL and 6 on the QB, either not getting the protection right or scrambling into the sack when he didn't need to. 

(the last one being that lateral play to campbell that is considered a sack for some reason)

Quote from: JT39 on October 03, 2023, 01:14:54 PMRambo,

you are making my point for me. You're telling me he's locked into one guy and forcing it to them. Why is he locking into a guy like Campbell or Slayton who neither are very good. Wouldnt you rather him forcing it to them? Or guys like Robinson or Waller who can actually exploit the defense?

He shouldn't be locking onto any one receiver no matter who it is.  He should be going through his progressions and read the field anticipating plays.

Quote from: B1GBLUE on October 03, 2023, 01:26:02 PMi think they just have to be average. or something close to it.

They were in the first half last night and put up 3 points.

Quote from: JT39 on October 03, 2023, 01:27:44 PM18 carries for 39 yards. Thats our RBs total. We didnt play the 85 Bears. Its pathetic in every sense of the word. And the blame cannot be put on Jones there.

And their secondary improved dramatically by adding a pro bowl corner - did it not? Getting Woolen back made a major difference.

Did you not read what an wrote about the strength of the Seattle defense being their run defense?  I didn't expect the Giants to be able to run the ball last night.  They ran it that much to just keep the defense honest.

The weakness of the Seattle defense is their pass defense.  They can be passed on yet the Giants were unable to do that last night.

Quote from: Gmo11 on October 03, 2023, 01:28:21 PMOrlovsky was just on McAfee's show saying of the 11 sacks he put 4 on the OL and 6 on the QB, either not getting the protection right or scrambling into the sack when he didn't need to. 

(the last one being that lateral play to campbell that is considered a sack for some reason)

Though it's just one opinion it does point out that not every sack is on the offensive line.

Quote from: Gmo11 on October 03, 2023, 01:28:21 PMOrlovsky was just on McAfee's show saying of the 11 sacks he put 4 on the OL and 6 on the QB, either not getting the protection right or scrambling into the sack when he didn't need to. 

(the last one being that lateral play to campbell that is considered a sack for some reason)

Making a bad situation worse?

That should not come with the pricetag it is...

Quote from: JT39 on October 03, 2023, 01:14:54 PMRambo,

you are making my point for me. You're telling me he's locked into one guy and forcing it to them. Why is he locking into a guy like Campbell or Slayton who neither are very good. Wouldnt you rather him forcing it to them? Or guys like Robinson or Waller who can actually exploit the defense?

He's locking onto Campbell and not Waller because Campbell is typically his bail out short route guy in the slot while Waller, Robinson etc are running actual routes. Like Tim and everyone said Jones always goes short and thus he either throws it to Campbell or a RB because everyone else is running actual NFL routes.

I am not sure I agree with that. I believe he is being told to read the defense and take what is given to him.

And this is a subject nobody is right or wrong about. However, he needs to be told to focus on players that can actually be made. Paris Cambell should never be an option unless he is the last option.

Quote from: JT39 on October 03, 2023, 02:54:15 PMI am not sure I agree with that. I believe he is being told to read the defense and take what is given to him.

And this is a subject nobody is right or wrong about. However, he needs to be told to focus on players that can actually be made. Paris Cambell should never be an option unless he is the last option.

Then either doesn't know how to read defenses or he's just a check-down maverick.

The defense gave him open receivers. He rejected and offered up his own gift.

Quote from: T200 on October 03, 2023, 02:57:46 PMThen either doesn't know how to read defenses or he's just a check-down maverick.

The defense gave him open receivers. He rejected and offered up his own gift.

It's really as simple as this. If he read the defense he would have made the plays.

Quote from: JT39 on October 03, 2023, 02:54:15 PMI am not sure I agree with that. I believe he is being told to read the defense and take what is given to him.

And this is a subject nobody is right or wrong about. However, he needs to be told to focus on players that can actually be made. Paris Cambell should never be an option unless he is the last option.

Campbell is running the underneath routes which Jones has a habit of going to rather than downfield.  What Jones needs to do is anticipate and break that habit of going to the underneath route.

This was one of the criticisms of him coming out of college playing in a half field first read system that he wasn't one to anticipate plays but rather he would go to his easy read.