Big Blue Huddle

Bobby Skinner
@BobbySkinner_
Giants/Ole Miss QB Jaxson Dart Deep Passing 2024
(20+ Yards from LOS)

Total
22.6% Throw Rate
38/90 42.2%
1550 yards 119.2 YPG
17 TD 4 INT

SEC (8 Games)
24.1% Throw Rate
18/59 30.5%
734 yards 91.7 YPG
6 TD 3 INT

Non-Conference (5 Games)
20.1% Throw Rate
20/31 64.5%
816 yards 163.2 YPG
11 TD 1 INT

Kept my thoughts out of the individual posts but will give some here.

He is aggressive. Really aggressive. His attempt rate would have been the highest in the NFL by almost 4%. I think that number being higher v. SEC opponents is a product of less easy throw but him being more comfortable throwing vertical than trusting spacing. That's what you want to work with a young QB. I also think the decision making was good on the majority of misses (outside of Florida/LSU) but he was just innacuarate.

The innaccuracy worries me against the SEC. The All-22 shows this better but it would consistently putter out around 50 yards and fall short & inside too often. Fades away from too many throws which leads to this but he doesn't lack arm talent, just elite arm talent that allows you to play how he does consistently. You see against the bad teams how good it can be when he's comfortable. Gotta be able to do it uncomortable spots in the NFL to be successful.

Here's how his deep completion rate would rank in the NFL in 2024 (42 QB's):
Total: 42.2% (9th)
SEC: 30.5% (34th)
Non-Conf: 64.5% (1st)

Ultimately, Dart needs to learn quick game, protections, get more comfortable going through progressions and seeing things post snap but we all like the aggression and it has to be a big part of why he was Brian Daboll's guy. Get better at it and let's win some damn games!


https://x.com/BobbySkinner_/status/1932526265870782551

I think he stays equally as aggressive because of the Wrs around him with the Giants. What doesn't get mentioned enough is that Dart was atill aggressive despite missing his top 2 Rbs, top Wr, top TE, and top 3 Olineman for a huge portion of the season.

Normally if a Qb loses his top weapon or a couple of guys on the oline then they become a shell of themselves and play it safe. That however isn't in Darts DNA and likely one of the many reasons Daboll loved the kid. No matter what was going on he wasn't afraid to chunk it.

Quote from: MightyGiants on June 11, 2025, 03:27:13 PMHe is aggressive. Really aggressive.

Rich: Just my personal view, not popular among guys I talk to, but they're all at colleges.

I'd rather have a gunslinger and spend my time working to "back him off of it" than the opposite.

Exhibit one would be Daniel Jones. Not saying he'll never work up to it, but haven't seen it so far and his career is probably closer to its end than its beginning.

Bob

This isn't OlMiss. Totally different Offense, routes, progressions, and strategy. He will also be taught to get velocity and power from the ground. That trailing leg is causing the tailoff on the deep throws. And that deep throw percentage will come down. He won't have the time to throw that he did there.

Ed,

He..I'm sure.(Dart) Is aware of that and has time to process the speed of the game. I mean. panic did despite doubts under Payton very well in his rookie season- evident in preseason.

Patience is key. I think he has the intangible it of a successful QB in the league.We will surely get a better idea in August where he's at.. naturally.

 

Quote from: Bob In PA on June 11, 2025, 04:57:35 PMI'd rather have a gunslinger and spend my time working to "back him off of it" than the opposite.

There is something to like in every post in this thread. The one point which stuck out like a sore thumb was your declarative statement above, @Bob In PA  , and I'll tell you why. Let me set the background for you. My ex's late father-in-law, a good man, an Army Officer and a Gentleman, was a graduate of the University of Southern Mississippi. His mama, who passed roughly a year after I married his daughter, and having earned her trust and respect during that time, warmly and affectionately welcomed me into her loving family, my Hattiesburg "kinfolk," if you will. When she passed, my father-in-law, and his sister, begged me to be a lector at her funeral Mass; I was honored and blessed to do so. Being taken in and "accepted" as an in-law, albeit a "Yankee," deep in the heart of Dixie when Southerners would case you down with their eyeballs, it was considered a badge of honor (NOTE: I had just completed my Army service with a nearly two-year course in "Southern Culture" at Fort Fordon in Augusta, Georgia so I felt pretty good about my chances when I told them I made the best grits this side of the Mississippi River (NOTE: that alone earned me cool points!); however, I'm now fully digressing so time to get back on track here, now!

Down south, even back in them, thar-a days, the legend of Brett Farve rung loud and clear like the bells on many of the churches which ring THREE times DAILY!

So, in keeping with Southern Tradition, you say the word "gunslinger" and the #4 comes-a-rising to the occasion! Dare we suggest that when looking for a blonde-haired gunslinger in 1979, with the traits of Terry Bradshaw, this small-town country kid from Kentucky named Simms stepped up??? Also, one day, the legendary Bradshaw would be in the broadcast booth praising the Dickens out of the kid wearing #11 for the Big Blue??? Really???

Now, out of Mississippi, where "Gunslingers" are known to be bred and developed, where legends have originated from that place called "Ole' Miss" where they wear the red, white and blue. The "Ole' Miss," where Giants Among Men have led the organization to glory, "Ole' Glory!"

Could it be that the Giants now have themselves a good old fashioned "gunslinger" from the deep south who's here to thrill? To thrill but also to win? To win but also win BIG? To win BIG AND WIN IT ALL?

Would you like some butter, salt and pepper with your grits, folks? How 'bout a pinch of cayenne to spice things up?

Ready for a little "spice" in this kid's game? I know I will with bowl in hand!

Peace!

Another thing to consider would be Tyrods deep passing numbers in 2023. If I could find them again I would use them to illustrate how our offense will likely look this season. If I remember I had a Tyrod Taylor thread that broke down all his advanced analytics and that he led the league in BTT, and deep passing metrics in 2023 despite not playing the full season. He was aggressive and taking shots despite not having hardly any weapons, he was still aggressive. Now imagine Wilson and Dart who are known to throw it deep, I can imagine a season that revolves around deep shots to Nabers, Hyatt, and Slayton.

Quote from: MightyGiants on June 11, 2025, 03:27:13 PMThe innaccuracy worries me against the SEC. The All-22 shows this better but it would consistently putter out around 50 yards and fall short & inside too often.

I'd assume him still being young he can improve that with strength training as well as improved body mechanics.

Didn't Brady have a weaker arm when he started as well as some others?

To piggy back on Chris' comments about gunslingers. According to Google, the definition of a QB known as a "gunslinger" requires:

1) Strong Arm
2) Unpredictability
3) Swagger

Brett Favre is probably best known as a modern day "gunslinger", but the list has a long history of successful gunslinging QBs. Dan Marino, Dan Fouts, Warren Moon, Joe Namath, Sonny Jurgenson, Dan Pastorini, etc

Roger Staubach had gun slinger capabilities, but he played for a coach that was very rigid in his approach because he thought that the scheme was the most important aspect for a successful team. However, when Staubach got into the two-minute drives or had to improvise, his gunslinging skills came to life and could make plays that were jaw dropping exciting to see

Is Jaxon Dart a gunslinger?

1) Strong Arm [check]
2) Unpredictability [TBD]
3) Swagger [check]

I guess it amounts to how much rope Daboll gives him

Quote from: Jolly Blue Giant on June 11, 2025, 07:34:06 PM1) Strong Arm [check]
2) Unpredictability [TBD]
3) Swagger [check]

Does Dart have above average arm strength by NFL standards? I thought he was more just middle of the road in this specific area. If he has an above average arm, I was misinformed.

Quote from: Bob In PA on June 11, 2025, 04:57:35 PMI'd rather have a gunslinger and spend my time working to "back him off of it" than the opposite.



Bob

I'd rather have to tell the dog "heel" than "sic-em"

I've heard from an inspirational speaker that, "it's easier to tame a wildfire, then raise the dead"

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on June 11, 2025, 07:42:02 PMDoes Dart have above average arm strength by NFL standards? I thought he was more just middle of the road in this specific area. If he has an above average arm, I was misinformed.

NFL QBs arm velocity

Josh Allen, 62 mph
Patrick Mahomes, 62 mph
Joe Milton, 62 mph
JJ McCarthy, 61 mph
Baker Mayfield, 60 mph
CJ Stroud, 59 mph
Kirk Cousins, 59 mph
Malik Willis, 58 mph
Jared Goff, 58 mph
Jaxson Dart, 58 mph 👀
Carson Wentz, 57 mph
Justin Herbert, 55 mph
Gardner Minshew, 55 mph
Dak Prescott, 54 mph
Jalen Hurts, 54 mph
Anthony Richardson, 54 mph
Jordan Love, 54 mph
Daniel Jones, 53 mph
Brock Purdy, 52 mph
Mitch Trubisky, 51 mph
Lamar Jackson, 49 mph
Deshaun Watson, 49 mph

The average NFL Qb is in that 53 mph range and Dart's 58 mph velocity is considered in that upper echelon. Dart is only 21 and can get even stronger with his base and arm.

Quote from: Jclayton92 on June 11, 2025, 09:04:37 PMNFL QBs arm velocity

Josh Allen, 62 mph
Patrick Mahomes, 62 mph
Joe Milton, 62 mph
JJ McCarthy, 61 mph
Baker Mayfield, 60 mph
CJ Stroud, 59 mph
Kirk Cousins, 59 mph
Malik Willis, 58 mph
Jared Goff, 58 mph
Jaxson Dart, 58 mph 👀
Carson Wentz, 57 mph
Justin Herbert, 55 mph
Gardner Minshew, 55 mph
Dak Prescott, 54 mph
Jalen Hurts, 54 mph
Anthony Richardson, 54 mph
Jordan Love, 54 mph
Daniel Jones, 53 mph
Brock Purdy, 52 mph
Mitch Trubisky, 51 mph
Lamar Jackson, 49 mph
Deshaun Watson, 49 mph

The average NFL Qb is in that 53 mph range and Dart's 58 mph velocity is considered in that upper echelon. Dart is only 21 and can get even stronger with his base and arm.

Good point on age... agree he is going to be on an upward trajectory on this.

Just for my info, what is this stat exactly? The average velocity of all throws? Or their hardest throws? Obviously QBs mix up speeds given the situation. I think this is interesting so I just want to be sure I understand precisely what I'm looking at here.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on June 11, 2025, 10:21:06 PMGood point on age... agree he is going to be on an upward trajectory on this.

Just for my info, what is this stat exactly? The average velocity of all throws? Or their hardest throws? Obviously QBs mix up speeds given the situation. I think this is interesting so I just want to be sure I understand precisely what I'm looking at here.

https://x.com/impactfbdata/status/1895942164569604226?t=5Kxi_zhj3UvFa8tfgaqmlQ&s=19

I got the list from Twitter. It was a list of the fastest thrown ball by a QB on the velocity test at the combine. The video above is Dart doing his velocity test this year. It's why you don't see some guys on the list that didn't participate at the combine.