Big Blue Huddle

Hearing all this, I guess Williams will be available maybe third round? 

Minimizing all these things is how you get players who never live up to their expectations.

Think about all the talented prospects who never lived up to their hype and then think about intangibles that swirled around them at this time of the year.

GMs survive if they pass up the next great thing.  They don't survive if they select the Ryan Leafs.

Quote from: Philosophers on March 01, 2024, 09:25:58 PMMinimizing all these things is how you get players who never live up to their expectations.

Think about all the talented prospects who never lived up to their hype and then think about intangibles that swirled around them at this time of the year.

GMs survive if they pass up the next great thing.  They don't survive if they select the Ryan Leafs.

Is it your position that Williams will be a Ryan Leaf type bust?

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on March 02, 2024, 05:32:29 AMIs it your position that Williams will be a Ryan Leaf type bust?

Predicting failure is as challenging as predicting success.  I will say that this whole thing has Dwayne Haskins vibes.

Quote from: MightyGiants on March 02, 2024, 06:41:31 AMPredicting failure is as challenging as predicting success.  I will say that this whole thing has Dwayne Haskins vibes.

I definitely agree there are red flags with Williams. He is a gamble. So is any QB prospect though. Hell, Trevor Lawrence had Peyton Manning/Andrew Luck type hype around him, and he has been fairly underwhelming to this point. There were multiple people here who were very high on Bryce Young around this time last year too. You just never know with these QBs.

I will add one more thing.  Pat Kirwan works for NFL radio.  He's been interviewing GMs and HCs all week at the Combine.  I have no doubt he also discusses stuff with them off the air.  So when Pat Kirwan voices strong concerns about Caleb Williams (and even mentions GMs) I feel pretty confident that he was getting negative feedback about Williams from the top people he is talking to.

https://x.com/NotSoAngryScout/status/1763438192466739392?s=20

Quote from: MightyGiants on March 02, 2024, 07:20:38 AMI will add one more thing.  Pat Kirwan works for NFL radio.  He's been interviewing GMs and HCs all week at the Combine.  I have no doubt he also discusses stuff with them off the air.  So when Pat Kirwan voices strong concerns about Caleb Williams (and even mentions GMs) I feel pretty confident that he was getting negative feedback about Williams from the top people he is talking to.

So you are surmising that his abhorrent behavior at the meat market will affect his draft status? Do you predict or think he will drop and won't go in the top three? Or number one?

Quote from: katkavage on March 02, 2024, 09:08:36 AMSo you are surmising that his abhorrent behavior at the meat market will affect his draft status? Do you predict or think he will drop and won't go in the top three? Or number one?

I have heard successful NFL people talk about this mindset (which is actually seen in the NFL).   Where a person is drafted doesn't prove anything.  How the player actually plays AFTER they are drafted will.

Quote from: MightyGiants on March 02, 2024, 09:29:22 AMI have heard successful NFL people talk about this mindset (which is actually seen in the NFL).   Where a person is drafted doesn't prove anything.  How the player actually plays AFTER they are drafted will.

You didn't answer my question.

Quote from: katkavage on March 02, 2024, 09:33:56 AMYou didn't answer my question.

What I just said shows that my position (and the position of smart people in the NFL) considers your question meaningless.  So why would I answer?  Were people who liked Ryan Leaf proven correct when he was drafted 2nd overall?   Were Tom Brady's detractors proven correct when Tom lasted until the 6th round?  Was Patric Mahomes not elite because he wasn't drafted in the top 5?

Again, what is the proven by where a player is drafted???

I'm asking that despite these so-called red flags will his stock drop. I'm not asking how he will do after he is drafted.

Quote from: MightyGiants on March 02, 2024, 09:39:41 AMWhat I just said shows that my position (and the position of smart people in the NFL) considers your question meaningless.  So why would I answer?  Were people who liked Ryan Leaf proven correct when he was drafted 2nd overall?   Were Tom Brady's detractors proven correct when Tom lasted until the 6th round?  Was Patric Mahomes not elite because he wasn't drafted in the top 5?

Again, what is the proven by where a player is drafted???

It doesn't. I agree fully but I'm not asking that.

Quote from: katkavage on March 02, 2024, 09:41:52 AMIt doesn't. I agree fully but I'm not asking that.

Seeing how you said you hope the Giants draft him (at least that is the assumption I made when you said you hope he drops into the Giants' laps), how he plays is the relevant issue, not where he is drafted.

Quote from: MightyGiants on March 02, 2024, 09:45:19 AMSeeing how you said you hope the Giants draft him (at least that is the assumption I made when you said you hope he drops into the Giants' laps), how he plays is the relevant issue, not where he is drafted.

Again no answer to my question. Why post this thread? If all this chatter is meaningless to his draft status why should we care about any of this?