Big Blue Huddle

Bob Papa shares a conversation he had with Brian Daboll.   As we have all witnessed we have seen fans and people who know more than fans (like Dan O.) post video clips and pictures of plays, with the commentary of "look at the open receiver!  Daniel Jones completely missed him".   

Well, in their latest podcast, Bob shares a story where, during the playoff run, he asked Brian Daboll directly about that issue.   Brian shook his head and said, "you sound like all those others.  Do you know why he missed that bleeping read?  The receiver ran the wrong route he wasn't where he was supposed to be"

You can hear the full explanation and the 31-minute mark

Okay, one example.

There are countless examples of locking on a guy and missing the open WR. Are we to infer that BD is putting the responsibility on the WRs all the time?

Quote from: EDjohnst1981 on March 17, 2024, 08:52:11 AMOkay, one example.

There are countless examples of locking on a guy and missing the open WR. Are we to infer that BD is putting the responsibility on the WRs all the time?

If you watched the video, Daboll goes on to explain the "countless examples" are the result of not knowing the play call, the progression, etc

Quote from: MightyGiants on March 17, 2024, 08:53:33 AMIf you watched the video, Daboll goes on to explain the "countless examples" are the result of not knowing the play call, the progression, etc

Sorry, I should have said. I'm unable to watch the video - I'm in a hospital waiting room for my Mrs.

Although, if he truly believes that the " result of not knowing the play call, the progression, etc" he ought to find another job. Because that's on coaching.

Quote from: MightyGiants on March 17, 2024, 08:53:33 AMIf you watched the video, Daboll goes on to explain the "countless examples" are the result of not knowing the play call, the progression, etc

This really doesnt speak well of the OC or HC IMO.

Quote from: EDjohnst1981 on March 17, 2024, 08:57:00 AMSorry, I should have said. I'm unable to watch the video - I'm in a hospital waiting room for my Mrs.

Although, if he truly believes that the " result of not knowing the play call, the progression, etc" he ought to find another job. Because that's on coaching.

I can agree running the wrong route can be on coaching.  In other instances, it's more on the evaluators.  Too often, evaluators scan the entire play just looking for an open receiver, and the minute they see it, the screen captures it and declares, "The QB missed on the open man!"

The reality is a bit different.  QBs go through progressions.  If the receiver is not open when he checks, he moves on to the next one, and so on and so on.  If the receiver gets open after he was checked or before he is checked, it's not realistic to think the QB will see him.  There are also plays where not every receiver running a route is part of the progression.  There are often decoy routes run which serve to draw away defenders from the receivers in the progression.  If a decoy gets open, it is not on the QB for missing him.

And let me guess: these same wide receivers who were wide open downfield that Jones didn't see solely because they constantly ran the wrong routes suddenly all mysteriously started running the right routes for DeVito and Taylor, correct?

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on March 17, 2024, 10:11:14 AMAnd let me guess: these same wide receivers who were wide open downfield that Jones didn't see solely because they constantly ran the wrong routes suddenly all mysteriously started running the right routes for DeVito and Taylor, correct?

In light of the fact that stats showed that Devito and Taylor had significantly more time to throw this season than Jones, this comment appears to be a bit disingenuous

I think Jones, being the kind of kid he is would say, Enough! I have to be better. I don't want to hear anymore excuses. When teammates made errors when my sons were pitching, they would get angry. I would tell them you can only control what you do. The same with the QB. These excuses for him haven't helped him any.

Quote from: katkavage on March 17, 2024, 10:29:08 AMI think Jones, being the kind of kid he is would say, Enough! I have to be better. I don't want to hear anymore excuses. When teammates made errors when my sons were pitching, they would get angry. I would tell them you can only control what you do. The same with the QB. These excuses for him haven't helped him any.

The situation here was just a conversation between Daboll and Papa.  This wasn't a public comment, this was the coach setting the record straight.  Pointing out that those claiming people were making excuses" for Jones were simply speaking to the reality of the situation.   A perfect anolgy would be saying you can't drive your car because it has a flat and some accusing you of just making excuses for your lousy car.

The post itself was another excuse. Sorry, if Jones won't say it, I will. Enough! Do better. That's all.

Quote from: katkavage on March 17, 2024, 10:42:28 AMThe post itself was another excuse. Sorry, if Jones won't say it, I will. Enough! Do better. That's all.

football doesn't work like that

The perfect analogy would be going to Shop-Rite and they were out of Avocados and then tell everyone that Shop-Rite doesn't carry Avocados.

Now after going back five years once a week, and still no Avocados... Then they don't carry Avacados.

Go to the first play of the Raiders game, it's 9 seconds in. Barkley is in the flat and open. Jones sails it by him.

That's one example to counter BD's one example.

I've tried to take a screen shot of the play but the app or my phone won't allow it.

Take a look. See what you think and tell me Barkley ran the wrong route.

Quote from: EDjohnst1981 on March 17, 2024, 11:06:22 AMGo to the first play of the Raiders game, it's 9 seconds in. Barkley is in the flat and open. Jones sails it by him.

That's one example to counter BD's one example.

I've tried to take a screen shot of the play but the app or my phone won't allow it.

Take a look. See what you think and tell me Barkley ran the wrong route.

They addressed this argument to a degree on the show as well.  First, Jones is hardly the only QB to miss a receiver; even the best QBs will miss receivers.

Here's the thing: there is so much strong argument and debate over an issue where knowledge is far more limited than being acknowledged by people making the claims.  Daboll is absolutely correct that even a former NFL QB looking at the all-22 tape doesn't fully know what he is looking at (much less fans).

We also don't fully know what DJ's injury and health issues are.

There is a proposition that the strength of one's conviction should be matched by the evidence used to form that conviction.   The reality is the only ones who fully know the situation are inside 1925 Giants Way, and they are not likely to be fully transparent with what they see and what they know.  Some can be gleaned by actions they have taken, like contracts, but in the end, there is a significant amount of unknowns in any outside evaluation.